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STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#3851: Nov 28th 2022 at 10:31:18 AM

Because the tags have to be put back in during the swap to the main page (otherwise the main pages won't index anymore) and it's both easier and lessens the risk of an error to just delete and re-add the period than to delete the whole thing and put it all back later.

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Nov 28th 2022 at 1:32:05 PM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#3852: Nov 28th 2022 at 10:33:24 AM

Ah, that does make sense.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3853: Nov 28th 2022 at 11:16:35 AM

Though that's why I wonder if unchecking "does indexing" for the Sandboxes would be adequate.

As for that 5P work, my personal opinion is that's fine to cut now, but that's just me.

LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#3854: Nov 28th 2022 at 11:39:02 AM

[up]If it helps to set a precedent, we do have a couple of examples from the Rance series of hentai games. Those were cut by P5 but the examples are still up.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#3855: Nov 28th 2022 at 11:58:25 AM

I think it would be best to save discussions for when the threads open. For example, what if someone disagrees with Entity 01 being a cut? Thinking that the revelation is not clear enough to impair its agency? These things should get full discussion and such.

But also I do not really mind waiting. Its not like questionable entries being up is going to hurt anyone, we can cut them later if they do not belong anymore. And I can wait a bit to propose certain characters. In some spaces its convenient, the discussion for Bendy and the Dark Revival is tomorrow and I would like to propose a character, but first have to find a way to read the novels that the character appears in to cover all their appearances. So having more time is a bonus.

Bow to the Prototype
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#3856: Nov 28th 2022 at 12:07:39 PM

[up] Actually agency isn't the only issue now. There are other ones I discovered after rewatching the videos.

You know speaking of The Content Policy that makes me realize. If it is true that non-content policy-violating examples are still allowed even for cut works that means that a work being removed for that wouldn't even be enough of a reason for something to be downvoted. Which I think is what everyone here has been assuming.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#3857: Nov 28th 2022 at 1:12:13 PM

From the Wandering Pilot discussion here's Septimus' post on the rule. Have we cut any "non-creepy, non-explicit examples"?

Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#3858: Nov 28th 2022 at 1:20:40 PM

There is Uchiha Heiress Remix which we thought would be disallowed due to the Content Policy and cut the example from it. Though I don't think it even actually went though it but even if it did and was cut the CM that used to be approved from it had nothing to do with the scene.

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#3859: Nov 28th 2022 at 6:03:16 PM

This MIGHT be a better question for the P5 thread (please don't holler me if this is the wrong thread) but what do we do if someone qualifies in a work like Crush Crush which CAN be an H-game (a rare instance of a western H-game as Sad Panda Studios is a Canadian studio) but has a SFW option to it? Do we let it go through, or do we cut it based on the P5 cleanup? For one, the work does not feature sexualization of any minors (characters like Ayano who WERE underage in their original work are aged up) and two, there IS a cohesive story and narrative to it. You said we can't dismiss examples based on it from being from schlock so what about H-games?

Edited by Klavice on Nov 28th 2022 at 6:06:01 AM

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#3860: Nov 28th 2022 at 7:39:47 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the rule basically that if a work is allowed to have a page on the site, then it is allowed to have candidates (aside from stuff that breaks No Real World Examples)? If I'm right then Crush Crush is allowed to have candidates.

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#3861: Nov 28th 2022 at 8:21:45 PM

There are CM from erotica actually. Hello Dimitri or Minister of Technology

Edited by KazuyaProta on Nov 28th 2022 at 11:25:30 AM

Watch me destroying my country
Ordeaux26 Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#3862: Nov 28th 2022 at 9:06:23 PM

[up][up] That is correct.

And as I have made clear even a work not being allowed on the site doesn't mean it can't have examples. As long as they examples don't have anything to do with why it got cut.

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#3863: Nov 29th 2022 at 12:50:50 AM

I just wanted to ask in the off chance I want to propose someone from that when the threads reopen and I thought the P5 meant no porn works are tropable. Then again, we trope The Room and several works with gratuitous sex scenes so I figured it wouldn't be a problem. I mainly asked just in case and to make absolute sure.

Edited by Klavice on Nov 29th 2022 at 12:53:01 PM

SeptimusHeap MOD from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#3864: Nov 29th 2022 at 2:08:48 AM

The rule for examples from 5P banned works is that they shouldn't link to the (cut) work page. That also applies to Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard examples.

The example writeups also need to observe No Lewdness, No Prudishness.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#3865: Nov 29th 2022 at 2:41:26 AM

Anyway with that answered. Could we get back to some suggestions from the Mod team about how to handle future debates?

Because as noted several people here are curious what they like for us to do and because it helps people learn what they did wrong?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
MinisterOfSinister From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye! from In the Hall of the Mountain King Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: What is this thing you call love?
From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye!
#3866: Nov 29th 2022 at 3:07:07 AM

I feel like it's still a good idea to discourage people from posting in heightened states of emotion or getting too invested in whether or not a character counts as a CM or MB. If we can't implement rules to stop people from posting for even a few minutes, the least we can do is remind people that it's just a thread, you should really just relax if you're at the point where you're ready to spit fire and throw insults around.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3867: Nov 29th 2022 at 3:49:10 AM

Huh, so examples CAN come from 5P-banned works, they just can't link to the work page?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#3868: Nov 29th 2022 at 4:39:10 AM

Well I mean they can but most if not all of those would fail characterization standard anyway in the case of pure porn (the ones that have pages here are Porn with Plot and we usually only cut if their really isn't anything in it). Well in the case of Pedo pandering the work must have some very fucked up standards making getting an example difficult.

Edit: Guys this isn't super important. It can be talked about more when the cleanup threads restart. I'm more interested in you know what we did wrong in arguments and trying to improve.

Edited by miraculous on Nov 29th 2022 at 4:40:53 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Klavice (Elder Troper)
#3869: Nov 29th 2022 at 5:13:23 AM

I'm with Mir, here. I just wanted my question answered, Septimus answered it, so now I'd like to ask how we can curb troublesome behaviour, and what we did wrong.

Edited by Klavice on Nov 29th 2022 at 5:14:19 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#3870: Nov 29th 2022 at 5:43:13 AM

What mir said, these are works by in large no one's really interested in looking into and represent a very small percentage of likely discussion topics which we're getting a bit too focused on in lieu of establishing common ground and understanding on much more widespread operating procedures.

Sinister raises a good point about mindfulness for civility, for starters.

Edited by 43110 on Nov 29th 2022 at 8:44:10 AM

WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#3871: Nov 29th 2022 at 7:27:19 AM

One major thing that does need curbing with threadgoers is the dog piling nature that occurs. A repeat thing with it is I've seen people call out others when they've dogpiled while also doing it themselves in other circumstances. It isn't a person-specific issue so there's no one to specifically blame but it is a reoccurring issue I've seen and people do stop when someone calls it out which does cease the hostilities but really it shouldn't need to happen in the first place?

It tends to be the result of either an EP that gets universally downvoted with repeated/snide comments or someone says something that should just be hollered and left behind.

Apologies if this was a thing that's been brought up, this thread's chunky lmao and another apology for my type up, using my phone.

What's wrong D-16? Rise up!
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#3872: Nov 29th 2022 at 8:55:34 AM

I agree and I've spoken up about that numerous times.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#3873: Nov 29th 2022 at 9:51:56 AM

Admittedly, I've been on both sides of that coin, and have been trying to curb that tendency on my end.

Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#3874: Nov 29th 2022 at 10:19:03 AM

Just so to be clear, we're not allowed to remove or add any entries at the moment, but are we allowed to request very minor edits (linking to Character-Specfic Pages)?

Eh, good enough.
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#3875: Nov 29th 2022 at 10:38:34 AM

I would think so. At least, I hope so.


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