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ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#951: Sep 26th 2023 at 8:47:49 PM

Star Wars is full of "low level" force users beating force users with much more experience. It's part of its genre rots, heroes can win by being clever and lucky, not because they're more trained or experienced than the person by fighitng. Plus the Dark side, which gives the heroes' victories an "oh no, we're not so different" moment.

Plus, Maul didn't lose because he was confident (or over-confident which is what i think you meant), he lost because Obi-Wan is very strong with the force and almost explictly tapped into the Dark Side to do it.

Canon may have changed the specifics of this by now, but remember that Luke won his second light-saber fight ever (third if you wanna be pedantic) against Darth Vader.

[up]Not to mention, a lot of Jedi Masters achieve that rank through training a Padawan to Knighthood, and for most of the years of the Republic, that probably meant very, very little actual combat focus for either of them.

Edited by ArthurEld on Sep 26th 2023 at 8:49:11 AM

Luisdalas Since: Sep, 2023
#952: Sep 26th 2023 at 8:51:38 PM

My point is that Ezra losing to Shin feels like a case of Badass Decay

Shin has never proven to be especially strong.

Edited by Luisdalas on Sep 26th 2023 at 8:52:33 AM

ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#953: Sep 26th 2023 at 8:56:18 PM

Hmm...generally enjoyed that quite a lot and the more open Ahsoka is a lot more fun to watch and watch interact with the others. I'm quite interested in what Baylen's up to also, his acting after the encounter with Ahsoka was top notch. I really felt like I could hear the 'I'm sorry, Shin' as he turned to continue on his way and left her to Ahsoka's mercy.

This continues the quite silly pattern in this show (and somewhat more broadly) of the near total invulnerability of Ahsoka's ship. Seriously it spends most of this episode getting hit with stuff and chased by fighters to essentially no effect. I really wish they'd control that, as at this point I'm basically tuning out the dogfighting as it transparently has no potential to have consequences.

And finally, my obligatory New Republic whine. Leia's cover story doesn't really make any sense? Like, she was covering for them two episodes ago, but now is claiming that they were operating on her orders during that time period? What did that covering consist of then? Also, Xiono apparently needs a vote he somehow didn't follow correct procedure on (despite it coming out of a meeting with the literal chancellor of the republic), but Leia can just unilaterally authorize such a mission? I guess she's head of the defense committee, so maybe she's got special powers to do that? Also, is this a trial, or a senate hearing? And if either, why are random people just getting up to talk? Oh, for crying out loud, she's still focusing on Thrawn, rather than what she can actually prove, even as Mon Mothma tries to toss her a life-line...

And I will say I know why they're doing it this way, but having C 3 PO just show up to present evidence from Leia is a super awkward way of involving her without having to recast, or deep fake her. I can't really think of a better one, though.

[up]Eh, I'm not sure I'd say he lost to her? She knocked him down, once. The fight was still going on until they were suddenly surrounded by Night Troopers.

Now, I will say, I thought it was hilarious that he declined a weapon, until it was time to kill Night Troopers? Maybe a subtle hint they aren't really people/alive? But certainly didn't see any smoke coming out of them?

[down]I'll be really surprised if that's the case My guess is no one's dying until the movie, at the earliest.

Edited by ECD on Sep 26th 2023 at 9:12:39 AM

Luisdalas Since: Sep, 2023
#954: Sep 26th 2023 at 8:58:07 PM

Also, I can't help but think that Ezra is going to die. The guy who says "I want to go home" usually claps it.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#955: Sep 26th 2023 at 10:05:51 PM

I like how they continue to use pairing more simple minded villains with him as a kind of evil Lestrade of sorts as a means of show how much more on the ball Thrawn is, just like they did with Konstantine and Price in Rebels.

  • Konstantine / Price / Elsbeth / Etc: "What are you doing? Throw all the troops at them! We need to kill them!"
  • Thrawn: "Since when has killing these people specifically ever been our actual goal?"

(not actual lines from the show)

It's the contention they had when Baylan rode out to find Sabine and Ezra last episode. Yes, they could send all the troops to make Sabine and Ezra as dead as possible, but why would they possibly need to?

Like, the whole concept of "we have more important things to do than kill everyone who pissed us off" is such a great mindset for a villain in this franchise, because it's obvious and wise, but the Empire's exact weakness is an inability to show temperance and grasp such concepts.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 26th 2023 at 10:08:56 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#956: Sep 26th 2023 at 10:13:00 PM

Plus, Maul didn't lose because he was confident (or over-confident which is what i think you meant), he lost because Obi-Wan is very strong with the force and almost explictly tapped into the Dark Side to do it.

Wait. Obi-Wan tapped the Dark side? Where was that a thing?

No wait, he was pretty mad during that last leg of the fight before Maul managed to take back the advantage again by knocking him off the ledge. I guess you mean that.

Also, I'd argue Maul lost because he failed to realize what Obi-Wan was doing until it was too late (and he was overconfident. He basically had the fight in the bag, but chose to take his time trying to make Obi-Wan fall by spraying sparks in his face when he probably could have force pushed him off the edge.

As for this episode, We don't often see Jedi who completely eschew their saber in favour of going full Supernatural Martial Arts with the force. Ezra's new methods are interesting, but I do hope he gets a new saber at some point.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bubblepig Steve from Minecraft (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
#957: Sep 26th 2023 at 11:18:32 PM

Speaking of the latest episode, what are your guys' thoughts on Ezra's new look?

"CHICKEN JOCKEY!"
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#958: Sep 26th 2023 at 11:19:52 PM

Excellent of him to cosplay my favorite Star Wars character: Jesus.

Except the eyes. The blue contacts are too uncanny.

uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#959: Sep 26th 2023 at 11:20:40 PM

No doubt that the season will end with the cliffhanger of Thrawn returning to the Galaxy.

But I'm not sure what will end up happening with Baylan. Just one episode relly dosent seem like enough time to flesh out whatever thing he is after on Peridia.

Also they mentioned the conflict on Mandalore, confirmation when this is happening compared to Mando season 3.

Edited by uncertanSearcher on Sep 26th 2023 at 8:23:54 PM

jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#960: Sep 27th 2023 at 1:56:05 AM

Thrawn's level of competence and intelligence is a bit of a double edged sword when it comes to Imperial military stuff.

On the one hand, it's refreshing that he's smart enough to know that it's entirely possible to win or complete objectives without wiping out absolutely everyone, or even ANYONE.

On the other, the idea that this basic common sense appears to be the mark of genius by Imperial standards suggests that they are (Thrawn aside) almost entirely idiotic. Elspeth maybe gets a pass because she is not actually militarily trained, but otherwise... yikes.

I am also a bit worried that we STILL don't know what Baylan is actually after. Revealing AND resolving it satisfactorily in the remaining time, with everything else going on as well, seems a risky prospect.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#961: Sep 27th 2023 at 4:23:01 AM

Speaking of the latest episode, what are your guys' thoughts on Ezra's new look?

I like how his look very much emulates his dad.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Chortleous she/her friend to the hooved (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
she/her friend to the hooved
#962: Sep 27th 2023 at 5:14:37 AM

I like that he's rocking the 'old hermit master' look even though he is, at most, about 30. Jedi age weirdly fast, might as well embrace it early on.

Edited by Chortleous on Sep 27th 2023 at 7:24:17 AM

Risa123 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#963: Sep 27th 2023 at 6:32:45 AM

What they are planning to do with Shin ? TVT called the last scene RedemptionRejection which I suppose is correct. Are they trying to quash any speculation about redemption with this ? Or laying ground for an actual one. So far my position on this issue was "no she is not getting any" especially since I'm well aware of my biases on the issue, but after her question her orders in previous episode and this I feel it is not just wishful thinking.

EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
#964: Sep 27th 2023 at 7:48:50 AM

If I had to guess she will last beyond Ashoka and probably get redemption in finale movie. It is pretty common for characters to reject redemption once or twice (or even constantly), only to give in at the end.

Honestly given how little we know about him, I kinda think Baylan was meant to last beyond Ashoka as well, but Ray Stevenson’s death potentialy derailed that plan. Guess we are gonna see next week.

Edited by EmperorGeode on Sep 27th 2023 at 7:50:49 AM

LadyBlackwood The show must go on from Wouldn't you like to know? Since: Jun, 2023 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
The show must go on
#965: Sep 27th 2023 at 8:07:56 AM

I think that Ezra losing to Shin is a Surprisingly Realistic Outcome. His schtick of relying entirely on the force and hand to hand combat might work on raiders and stormtroopers but it's not enough to defeat an armed force user. There's also the fact that he probably hasn't fought anyone except the aforementioned raiders in nearly a decade so it doesn't surprise me that he's rusty. I do like how he looks though.

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#966: Sep 27th 2023 at 8:13:00 AM

[up][up]

Her name's Ahsoka. Ashoka's a king from ancient India. tongue

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
EmperorGeode from A Galaxy far, far away Since: Oct, 2022 Relationship Status: On the prowl
Chortleous she/her friend to the hooved (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
she/her friend to the hooved
#968: Sep 27th 2023 at 8:23:12 AM

I hope they weren't planning anything too big with Baylan beyond this series, honestly, and if they were, I do wonder how far in advance they're writing this stuff and how elegantly they're writing around his actor's passing. Well, maybe present-tense isn't quite right given the strikes, but you know what I mean.

Edited by Chortleous on Sep 27th 2023 at 10:26:19 AM

Luisdalas Since: Sep, 2023
#969: Sep 27th 2023 at 8:34:27 AM

Speaking of the situation, Ezra reacting to what Sabine did Considering there's only 1 episode left, I imagine that plot will come down to an Easily Forgiven.

Speaking of Senator Xiono, I really hope Thrawn kills him in the future, and that they use the twin brother excuse to justify his appearance in Resistance.

Baylan: Maybe you'll crucify me, for what I'm going to say, but if they have something planned with Baylan, they should hire another actor, instead of aborting any plot they have planned with him.

Edited by Luisdalas on Sep 27th 2023 at 8:36:35 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#970: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:17:10 AM

I never really bought the fanbase’s idea that Shin would be redeemed in the first place.

Ever since their first appearances, the show has kept up that the difference between her and Baylan is that Baylan is temperate, respectful but driven and ruthless, whereas Shin is more readily violent, ambitious and relishes the opportunity to take power. She’s always come off as more evil than Baylan, not less.

Incidentally, do we know the length of the final episode. I’m getting severe “the final episode is triple length” vibes from the lead up to this finale.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 27th 2023 at 10:18:27 AM

Xopher001 Since: Jul, 2012
#971: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:21:39 AM

God I hope so.

I'm not really sure what Shin's deal is. It doesn't seem like she rly knows what she wants, she's mostly been following Baylan.

Risa123 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#972: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:22:32 AM

[up][up] Simple, she is hot tongue. There is a reason why I talked about bias in my post. Unlike some people, I'm actually self-aware about stuff like this. I do feel however that after this scene is actually a legitimate theory, not just wishful thing of horny people.

[up] That actually supports the idea, you know. People who are unsure of their allegiance are more likely to change it.

Just to be sure, I'm not saying that she is going to get redeemed 100%. Perhaps she is not. I do not care all that much. I just think it is possible.

Edited by Risa123 on Sep 27th 2023 at 7:33:21 PM

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#973: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:25:39 AM

One thing I like about the dynamic between Baylan and Shin is that even though they ultimately turn out to have very different goals, their relationship doesn't actually turn antagonistic. Neither of them seem to really like that their paths are diverging, but they split nonetheless. Though I am wondering where Shin goes from there, considering she failed to kill Ezra and Sabine.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Risa123 Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#974: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:33:05 AM

[up] I agree. The way I see it, she has two options. The admittedly unlikely redemption, or try to become an independent dark Jedi. I also think that she will at least try to return to Baylan. Being his apprentice is what (and mostly likely only if he took her on when she was a child) she knows, and as you say they get along pretty well.

Chortleous she/her friend to the hooved (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: She does the things you do, but she is an IBM
she/her friend to the hooved
#975: Sep 27th 2023 at 10:40:45 AM

Shin always kind of looks like she's mentally pulling the wings off an imaginary fly, and I commend how well her actress sells that.


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