In terms of character pages, you should avoid merging characters back into other subpages or folders that involve more than one character. That is because, in a few months, each character will have their own page so any mergers you do now will be undone in the future so it's wasted effort.
We can't share more on the whys and hows just yet, but any merging activity in character pages at the moment is going to be undone. So there's no point in doing it.
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - FighteerOn a related note, do we have a general timeframe of when a Wiki Talk regarding this change will be opened?
Because quite frankly, I have a lot of questions regarding this change.
I’ll lift my face, and run to the sunlight.![]()
Admin decision. The reasons will be shared when the project is underway.
I'm sorry, I'm not sure yet. But this is definitely coming and there's not much more I can say. I don't think anyone wants to put work into doing things that will be undone in the near future, so we're giving you a heads up now.
Speaking of variants, now that I took care of Paxton, there's one last thing I wanted to discuss:
I noticed that, just like Gamora's, the 2014 alternate version of Thanos from Endgame now has a separate folder from the normal version (probably because the original page was getting too long, but still). So, shouldn't we do the same with the 2014 version of Nebula?
Let's be clear, I 100% agree that we shouldn't give additional folders for every characters' past versions who show up in Endgame, since most of them only make minor appearances and are pretty much identical to their normal version. 2014 Nebula, however, is a major character with a huge impact on the plot who is very different from her normal version (and thus has many tropes distinct from the normal version), much like Gamora and Thanos (arguably even moreso, considering she stays evil until her death). I think giving her a separate folder would be the more logical thing to do (if anything, for the sake of consistency), don't you think?
I feel like we should establish some ground rules for past selves having their own folders. We made one for 2014 Thanos because the tropes about him exceeded 40k bytes and we made one for 2014 Gamora because she appeared in more than one movie. So I highly believe we should set some rules on whether or not a character’s past self should have their own folder because I don’t see 2014 Star-Lord, 1970 or 1949 Peggy Carter, or any of the 2012 Avengers we saw in Endgame get their own folders.
Edited by MaxyGregoryyyy on Apr 14th 2025 at 10:25:22 PM
A lot of them didn't really do much. Just kind of the same. They could all get folders with one-two tropes each, and they should because they are all technically variants.
Edited by GateStarX on Apr 14th 2025 at 7:29:27 AM
It's gonna be fun on the bun!Technical’s the key word here. Unlike the versions in What If…?, these characters may be from alternate universes, but they're still basically just their past selves in spite of the divergences from external factors (the Avengers travelling to their time) and there’s already a variants problem going on so unless they appear in more than one work (like 2014 Gamora) or have 40k bytes (like 2014 Thanos) or both (God of Stories Loki), I’d rather not make more folders of past selves and just make folders for actual alternate selves like those who have a very different life from the main version (like the Strange variants in MoM or the Peter Parker variants in NWH) or was diverged due to the slightly different decisions within the universe (like the ones in What If…?). MCU: Multiverse and many character pages are barely organized and holding it together, these past selves from Endgame just make it more of a hassle.
Edited by MaxyGregoryyyy on Apr 15th 2025 at 12:15:50 AM
I wrote earlier about Thor variants in What If, I'd create/keep a separate folder for each variant with at least 5 (7? 10?) unique tropes (not shared with the "main" variant) and move all the remaining tropes to some "other variants" folder. Tropes for minor variants tend to overlap a lot, too.
They are variants too and should be called variants, they were just introduced earlier than the concept was formalized. Some of the variants in What If are not so different from their main counterparts and have very brief appearances as well.
We also have versions of characters from Loki's time loops who are technically not variants at all, like past Mobius from an Alternate Timeline (rather than an Alternate Universe). Now, these I'd call "past versions."
PS This is the Ship of Theseus debate, isn't it?
Or this
and this
. Marvel just had to hammer it home.
- Mods: "When do we create Character-Specific Pages?"
- Meanwhile MCU Characters Thread: "What is a Character?"
Edited by Asherinka on Apr 15th 2025 at 3:14:41 PM
Of all the things at risk, the loss of an objective reality is perhaps the most dangerous.Like I said, I'm not necessarily asking for every past character from Endgame to get their folder (though that's not out of the question), but I think at the very least 2014 Nebula should get one, considering that she's a major character who hugely impacts the movie's plot and has her own distinct tropes, much like 2014 Gamora and 2014 Thanos (who have theirs).
I thought Nebula already had one? If not she definitely should. The only variants with any actual deviation are Loki, Gamora, Thanos, Nebula, Thanos's forces, and maybe the Ancient One. Everyone else was basically the same, and besides a passing mention don't really need folders.
We can still make characters and do moves, just no CSP merges AFAIK.
Edited by GateStarX on Apr 15th 2025 at 12:04:16 PM
It's gonna be fun on the bun!
Actually, pretty much all of them have deviations from their original versions. I doubt Frigga gave a pep talk to her obese son from the future or that Steve fought another version of himself in the original timeline.
But hey, they (and Thanos's forces) are all pretty minor characters and acted more-or-less the same as the originals, so leaving them merged with their original versions is fine by me. 2014 Nebula is different, since she's a major character, and acted very differently from the original Nebula (notably because she remained a Daddy's Little Villain til her death, whereas the original one changed sides at the first opportunity).
So long as we don't end up in the area where we make folders for the likes of Naked Clown Wong, I think we should be good.
"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."I agree with Mimic. Almost every past self has deviations. I believe we should only make deviations for those who actually have very meaningful ones like having a different personality now, or their story after being deviated is focused on a lot (Time Heist Thanos, Gamora, and Loki). I don’t think we should make pages for those who haven't really changed much as characters following their divergences or their story won’t really continue afterwards (2012 Cap, Rumlow, Sitwell, and Ancient One especially since that timeline was pruned now). If we made a folder for every past self, we're inviting more problems than we have now.
I agree with Matt that we shouldn’t make one for dreams unless the character encounters that alternate version (Defender Strange). So many shows (Runaways, Daredevil, Punisher, etc…) have characters having dreams or nightmares and while it's canonical that those are alternate universes, it's again inviting more problems that we already have.
Edited by MaxyGregoryyyy on Apr 15th 2025 at 11:47:05 PM
I think it's ok to create a folder for 2014 Nebula now. We're still alowed to create folders as far as I understand.
I don't think I can list 5 new character tropes for 2012 Cap or Ancient One (not shared with their "main" versions), so I'd rather not create separate folders for them.
I do think we could quantify how meaningful the divergence is by specifying the number of new tropes needed. I'd go for something like 5,7 or 10.
I agree.
Edited by Asherinka on Apr 16th 2025 at 6:47:12 AM
Of all the things at risk, the loss of an objective reality is perhaps the most dangerous.The four big characters with significant deviation is Loki, Thanos, Gamora, and Nebula. So just those four should be fine.
It's gonna be fun on the bun!

Sorry, I'm confused...what exactly are we forbidden from doing?
"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."