Misused (Alt Names crowner 6 August 2021): Everythings Better With Monkeys

Everythings Better With Monkeys is supposed to be (as far as I can tell) about monkeys being used to add comedic value to a work. However, likely due to its name, it has essentially become "monkeys exist", which is People Sit on Chairs. A wick check specifically revealed the following:

• 12% of examples are correct
• 74% of examples are simply about monkeys existing in a work
• 10% of examples were about other monkey-related concepts we may or may not have tropes for/may or may not be tropeworthy, and
• 4% of examples were not classifiable under the other categories.

Making things worse is that even the correct examples, as pointed out by War Jay 77, are very low on context. On top of that (although I am fairly certain it is) I am not even entirely sure if the definition I used is the definition, since the description and Laconic are both unclear as to the actual meaning of this trope.

I am unsure of the tropeworthiness of what I believe to be the concept, but it might exist, so I propose four possible solutions:

• Rename (on the Wick Check thread, I suggested More Fun With A Barrel Of Monkeys, mightymewtron suggested a play on Monkey Business)
• Send back to TLP (possibly with a new name) with whatever legit examples there are and try to get some more legit examples
• Salvage yard it, or
• Cut the trope, maybe merging it with Primate Index

What does everyone else think should be done? Are there any other ideas for fixing this trope?

Opened.

While I support a rename, I'm not sure if those name ideas will work. One's a bit too wordy.

As for name ideas, I'll pitch Funky Monkey. Gets to the point, and as a bonus, it rhymes.

Funky Monkey is a good name idea, but I don't think it gets across the "comedic" part of this trope. The monkeys are there for comedic value, while Funky Monkey could theoretically refer to any kind of monkey.

A rename can work. Maybe Mirthful Monkey for monkeys used as humor (if we want alliteration)?

Monkeys For Funnies...? Either way, I do think that renaming this is the best option.

Edited by jandn2014 on Jul 5th 2021 at 10:59:18 AM

Someone on one of the threads pitched More Fun With A Barrel Of Monkeys, which is clever but a bit wordy.

I was tinking of Monkey Business but that lends itself to the same problems. Maybe Funny Monkey Business? I'm just trying to use monkey puns here.

I could also go with Monkeys For Funnies... Mirthful Monkey sounds too weirdly proper to me.

Edited by mightymewtron on Jul 5th 2021 at 11:40:57 AM

Funky Monkey Business?

I pitched the first name. I agree now, it's too wordy, I just couldn't come up with anything else.

Funny Monkey Business is the suggestion I am currently most inclined to support, unless someone comes up with something else.

EDIT: Changed my mind

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Jul 5th 2021 at 11:43:19 AM

Monkeys Are Bananas? :p

I'm pretty sure More Fun Than a Barrel of Monkeys would violate No New Stock Phrases (since it's a preexisting phrase that simply refers to something or someone being very fun) in addition to being wordy. I prefer Funky Monkey.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 5th 2021 at 9:08:26 AM

to any name with "Monkey Business" in it because it gives connotations of fraudulent business schemes that has absolutely nothing to do with the trope.

Tentative to everything else, but leaning towards Funky Monkey or Funny Monkey.

That feels like a bit of a stretch of the policy, given that we wouldn't be troping the actual phrase and it's not worded like a line of dialogue. But it's too wordy either way.

I kinda like "Monkeys Are Bananas" but that sounds more like "crazy monkey" than "funny monkey," which overlap but are not one and the same.

I agree that Monkeys Are Bananas sounds more like "crazy monkey" than "silly monkey". Crazy monkeys are probably more likely to fall under Maniac Monkeys (if they're unhinged and evil) or Mischief-Making Monkey (if they cause trouble in way that's over-the-top without being evil).

That said, I suppose a funny monkey could still be an example of Crazy Is Cool.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 6th 2021 at 2:43:54 PM

Honestly, I'm not sure the OP's definition is correct. I was always under the impression the definition here was supposed to be something a lot closer to Gratuitous Monkeys, with "monkeys are funny" being a potential reason for the trope, not the trope itself.

(FWIW I'm actually pretty sure this is the original Everything's Better With X trope name that all the rest were snowcloned from.)

The TLP backs that theory, for the record.

A Gratuitous Monkey trope is already covered by Garnishing the Story. I don't think it would be a good idea to create subtropes that are about specific objects, feels like it would shift the focus from the garnishing to the object and thus invite shoehorning. And it wouldn't be tropish since it's just "Garnishing the Story with a particular object"

Edited by SeptimusHeap on Jul 6th 2021 at 6:13:01 PM

Plus, we attempted that back at the Instant Awesome Just Add Dragons thread, and none of us had any idea what such a trope would even be defined as.

As one of the people who raised that objection, I feel like Gratuitous Monkeys would be a little easier to identify, because monkeys aren't really a genre thing like dragons - they're just a type of animal. That said, I can imagine it still being pretty subjective.

I do think there's definitely a real thing where people put in monkeys for meta Rule of Funny / Rule of Cool reasons but the monkeys aren't treated as funny in-universe. Not sure if the proposed Funky Monkeys trope would cover that or not.

Edit: Also, we have subtropes of Garnishing the Story - it's literally an index. I'm not wedded to the Gratuitous Monkeys concept by any means, but that's kind of a weird objection.

Edited by nrjxll on Jul 6th 2021 at 3:07:04 AM

I don't subscribe to the "we already have ones" logic especially since a lot of these are shoehorn magnets or due for TRS.

The counterpoint to the nixed Gratuitous Dragon concept is Everythings Better With Princesses -> Gratuitous Princess, for those wondering what a valid "gratuitous x" subtrope might look like.

I do think "monkey added for comedic effect" is a more solid concept than "gratuitous monkey", but looking at the wick check it does seem like we'd be basically starting from scratch.

Edited by Synchronicity on Jul 6th 2021 at 3:57:06 AM

I think there's enough examples on the Everythings Better With Monkeys page to build a Funny Monkey trope, which I think is more tropeworthy than a Gratuitous Monkey concept.

Gratuitous X tropes make more sense if there's a coherent reason for adding X.

Edited by naturalironist on Jul 6th 2021 at 5:39:18 AM

Yeah, I'm not sure what real reason there is to insert a monkey into something if not to have it be funny (or crazy). I'm not sure what meaning a Gratituous Monkey trope would have.

Would something along the lines of "heroic monkey" be tropeworthy or not?

I can’t think of any clear, meaningful association between “heroism” and “monkeys”, so likely not.

The only thing I can think of is the legendary Monkey King Sun Wukong, and the Monkey from Kung Fu Panda. Basically, monkeys can be portrayed as agile and powerful fighters. I'm not sure if that'd be considered "heroic", but a trope about monkeys who use their skills for battle might be useful.

In response to nrjxll:

As I said in the OP, I wasn't entirely sure what this trope was about. The TLP Septimus linked to seems to indicate my definition was the original one, but the current definition seems to be different from the TLP one.

Maybe I should have gone for Unclear Description. (Or someone unilaterally changed the definition at some point.)

Anyway, I don't think a "Gratuitous Monkey" trope would be a good idea, for the same reasons Septimus said: Garnishing the Story covers it well enough.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Jul 6th 2021 at 6:29:53 AM