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Duplicate Trope: Yes Virginia

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Jan 1st 2021 at 2:30:49 PM

Yes, Virginia and Santa's Existence Clause are extremely similar to one another. Both tropes deal with a character questioning their belief in Santa Claus, only to find that Santa is Real After All. Both also include the Fridge Logic that a character is essentially a Flat-Earth Atheist, not believing in Santa despite that millions of gifts appear every December out of nowhere. The only distinction is that in Santa's Existence Clause, a character who doesn't believe in Santa doesn't want to hurt a Santa-believer's feeling and fabricates a story about Santa being real - making it something of a sub-trope to Yes, Virginia. In additon, Yes, Virginia has an extremely obscure, non-indicative name, referencing an editorial from 1897 (which inspired Miracle on 34th Street), thus painfully suffering from Trope Namer Syndrome. There are two redirects to Yes, Virginia, Santa Is Real and Santa Claus Is Always Real, which are both more clear names in my opinion.

Neither trope is particularly thriving; Yes, Virginia has 101 wicks, Santa's Existence Clause has merely 44; I blame the obscure name for the former. There is relatively little overlap between the wicks, only 7 pages reference both tropes note . There are also 6 overlapping on-page examples:

How I see it, we have two options:

  • Merge the two tropes, probably under the name Santa's Existence Clause (as this is the more clear one)
  • Keep the two tropes separate (as the "character makes up a story about Santa" aspect is present in one but not the other), but give Yes, Virginia a more indicative name.

Edited by Snicka on Jan 1st 2021 at 11:31:05 AM

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
Feb 16th 2021 at 7:26:53 AM

Opening.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Synchronicity god-touched Relationship Status: I've got a total eclipse of the heart
god-touched
Feb 16th 2021 at 9:19:49 AM

Yeah, these are definitely dupes.

the "character makes up a story about Santa" aspect is present in one but not the other

Not strong enough of a distinction IMO, especially considering neither are well-used. Merge.

(EDIT TO CLARIFY: Merge into Santa's Existence Clause as that name is better)

Edited by Synchronicity on Feb 16th 2021 at 12:14:35 PM

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WarJay77 Some like it hot from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Mahoxy paf pof from the Splatlands Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Delibirda They look queerifcally cute together. from Trondheim, Norway Relationship Status: Love potion #9
They look queerifcally cute together.
Feb 16th 2021 at 10:15:56 AM

Fuse.

No MLP season 9 spoilers, please.
jandn2014 Hangs around Image Pickin’ a lot from somewhere in Connecticut Relationship Status: Hiding
Hangs around Image Pickin’ a lot
callmeamuffin Made out of 100% real dead ponies. from the kitchen Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
Made out of 100% real dead ponies.
Feb 16th 2021 at 11:27:57 AM

Merge.

Edited by callmeamuffin on Feb 17th 2021 at 5:28:08 AM

MLP shitposts are cool.
Berrenta Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
naturalironist from The Information Superhighway Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Feb 16th 2021 at 12:06:53 PM

Merge, make Santa's Existence Clause the main trope, but keep Yes, Virginia as a redirect.

Edited by naturalironist on Feb 16th 2021 at 3:07:42 PM

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"
Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
Feb 16th 2021 at 7:11:29 PM

[up]Agree with the above

Kirby is awesome.
themayorofsimpleton Loves things that are cute from Inside a dumpster
Loves things that are cute
Feb 16th 2021 at 7:20:49 PM

[up][up][tup]

Mainly I clean out complaining on this wiki, and I operate three active threads (and one inactive one) as well.
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Feb 17th 2021 at 1:13:08 AM

That's a consensus if I saw one. [tup]

WarJay77 Some like it hot from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Some like it hot
Feb 19th 2021 at 6:22:18 PM

Do we need a crowner to finalize it or we good?

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
Berrenta MOD Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
Feb 19th 2021 at 8:16:25 PM

Consensus is strong enough. Let's go with the merge into Santa's Existence Clause.

Berrenta Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
Feb 19th 2021 at 8:23:11 PM

I'll deal with wicks. Already dealt with the redirects (the shorter one is preserved).

...I did find a case of misuse, believe it or not.

Feb 19th 2021 at 10:55:26 PM

[up]Still Santa-related misuse? Or something completely different, like the state of Virginia?

Berrenta Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
Feb 20th 2021 at 6:16:01 AM

Nothing to do with St. Nick himself.

Synchronicity god-touched Relationship Status: I've got a total eclipse of the heart
god-touched
Feb 20th 2021 at 6:59:53 AM

I remember once adding an example of “is the tooth fairy real?” under Yes, Virginia; thought it would count under tropes are flexible.

Edited by Synchronicity on Feb 20th 2021 at 9:00:11 AM

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Berrenta Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
Feb 20th 2021 at 7:20:35 AM

Okay, to be specific, the misuse I encountered was saying how it's possible to dislike an actor's character.

As for tooth fairies...could be a variant.

Feb 20th 2021 at 7:38:32 AM

[up]Yeah, I guess the tooth fairy, Easter bunny or the Krampus can all be seen as variants...

Synchronicity god-touched Relationship Status: I've got a total eclipse of the heart
god-touched
Feb 23rd 2021 at 2:25:43 PM

I started wick cleaning (got Main/, a few wicks are about works titled "Yes, Virginia" or just about the phrase itself)

Do we have a trope for "character has not yet outgrown their belief in Santa Claus" in general, without the Real After All reveal? This example from Samurai Pizza Cats:

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Berrenta Remakes on the way from Texas Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Remakes on the way
Feb 23rd 2021 at 9:35:12 PM

[up] I tried checking, but can't find anything.

We can always put that example under Santa Claus or, in this case, maybe All of the Other Reindeer (as the character was mocked for it)?


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