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Ambiguous Name: John Barleycorn And Friends

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ccorb from A very hot place Since: May, 2020 Relationship Status: It's not my fault I'm not popular!
#1: Nov 16th 2020 at 11:35:13 AM

This trope was launched in 2013, and has a small but slightly healthy number of wicks (39) and a modest amount of inbounds (226)note . People on Image Pickin' and the TRS meta discussion expressed confusion over the name due to Trope Namer Syndrome (a personification of alcohol barley from British folklore), and it would likely fare better under a clearer name, such as Anthropomorphic Alcohol And Drugs.

Edited by ccorb on Nov 16th 2020 at 2:42:02 PM

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SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#2: Dec 16th 2020 at 12:25:48 AM

Opening but also clocking because it looks like a marginal case.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Spark9 Since: Nov, 2010
#3: Dec 16th 2020 at 12:54:34 AM

I was part of the earlier discussion... this really looks like the name of a work. The name John Barleycorn appears extremely dated and localized, and I wouldn't expect anyone outside the UK to be familiar with it. Googling the phrase suggests the character is wildly unknown, but there are a number of songs, books, and pubs by that name.

Overall I agree that this is not a good trope name. [tup] to rename.

GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#4: Dec 16th 2020 at 1:43:25 AM

Rename due to Trope Namer Syndrome and a small wick count (which is presumably due to a combination of the name and the fact that there are no redirects).

I'm going to wait before voting on a name.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 16th 2020 at 3:45:20 AM

I got a rock for Halloween.
Snicka Since: Jun, 2011
#5: Dec 16th 2020 at 2:46:13 AM

I remember the time this was launched... people were confused by the name even in the TLP phase. The alternative name Anthropomorphic Vice was suggested then (and was the most popular, but the TLP's host insisted on John Barleycorn).

Serac she/her (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
she/her
#6: Dec 16th 2020 at 10:10:00 AM

39 wicks in seven years is not what I would call the healthiest trope. And fortunately, having a low wick count makes it easy to rename. So yeah, I support renaming this.

callmeamuffin Just getting into Utena... (he/they) from the kitchen (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Thinkin' about you, muffin
Just getting into Utena... (he/they)
#7: Dec 16th 2020 at 2:07:04 PM

Anthropomorphic Vice sounds good.

Edited by callmeamuffin on Dec 16th 2020 at 8:07:23 PM

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FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#9: Dec 16th 2020 at 6:33:22 PM

Yes, I'd heard the proposition of renaming it to Anthropomorphic Vice from before this thread was open, and have to agree with that one.

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
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#10: Dec 16th 2020 at 8:49:36 PM

Anthropomorphic Vice would be excellent.

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alnair20aug93 🍊orange fursona🧡 from 🐾Furrypines 🇵🇭 (Long Runner) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
🍊orange fursona🧡
#11: Dec 16th 2020 at 9:21:00 PM

I don't need to repeat myself on what I have said, I can agree on renaming this Anthropomorphic Vice, so that no one could be confused with mistaking this to cereal boxes.

I also have pinged Lawman 592, the creator of the trope, to this thread.

Edited by alnair20aug93 on Dec 17th 2020 at 6:12:45 PM

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Lawman592 Since: Jan, 2001
#12: Dec 16th 2020 at 9:53:47 PM

Would Jack Daniels And Friends work better? Anthropomorphic Vice sounds too dry.

Edited by Lawman592 on Dec 16th 2020 at 9:54:25 AM

alnair20aug93 🍊orange fursona🧡 from 🐾Furrypines 🇵🇭 (Long Runner) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
🍊orange fursona🧡
#13: Dec 16th 2020 at 10:01:10 PM

^That's clearer, since we know more of Jack Daniels, but that possibly would still fall victim under Trope Namer Syndrome.

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raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#14: Dec 16th 2020 at 10:01:13 PM

Anthropomorphic Intoxicants? Anthropomorphic Vice sounds to me as of it's the inverse of Embodiment of Virtue.

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rjd1922 Best robot boy | he/him | Image Pickin' regular, from the United States Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Love is for the living, Sal
Best robot boy | he/him | Image Pickin' regular,
#15: Dec 16th 2020 at 10:02:16 PM

[up][up][up][nja]I agree that Anthropomorphic Vice is a bit dry (heh), but is Jack Daniel's whiskey well-known outside the US? Otherwise it would have the same problem as the current, being unclear to non-Americans. If it is well-known internationally, then I support the title "Jack Daniels And Friends".

Edited by rjd1922 on Dec 16th 2020 at 12:05:26 PM

Keet cleanup
Piterpicher Veteran Editor IV from Poland, for real (Series 2) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Veteran Editor IV
#16: Dec 16th 2020 at 10:08:09 PM

I don't honestly know, but Anthropomorphic Intoxicants does sound clearer than Antrophomorphic Vice or Jack Daniels And Friends (people in my family like Jack Daniels, but otherwise, IDK if it's that popular, and it still only covers alcohol). Honestly I also agree that this whole thing really is a marginal case, as the trope is standing in terms of wicks, so I would also be fine if nothing was done here.

Edited by Piterpicher on Dec 16th 2020 at 7:14:44 PM

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GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Zyffyr from Portland, Oregon Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#18: Dec 17th 2020 at 12:34:31 AM

[up][up][up]Thanks to some You Tube channels that I watch, I know that Jack Daniels is considered a premium drink in China. So, I suspect it is suitably internationally known. However, I think we would be better served with a name that isn't focused on a single product.

Spark9 Since: Nov, 2010
#19: Dec 17th 2020 at 12:38:52 AM

Unfortunately, "Jack Daniels" is a pretty common name and there are other creators or media figures by that name. So I don't think that's a good trope name.

I'm fine with either [up][up] and prefer the shorter name.

Edited by Spark9 on Dec 17th 2020 at 12:39:03 PM

alnair20aug93 🍊orange fursona🧡 from 🐾Furrypines 🇵🇭 (Long Runner) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
🍊orange fursona🧡
#20: Dec 17th 2020 at 2:04:44 AM

Since this is running on limited time, shall we call a crowner? Anthropomorphic Vice or Anthropomorphic Intoxicants would sound dry (no pun intended), but it sounds Clear, Concise, Witty enough.

The trope is standing, yes, but it does seem to have a stunted growth througout the past 7 years due to the obscure name (some beers are made of hops too y'know) and its focus towards alcohol when it also should cover tobacco and other drugs.

[down][down][down]Huh. I haven't fully knew that until now. I've always thought that beer was made of hops. I've always assumed that beer was made of either barley or hops after playing Stronghold. The more you know.

Edited by alnair20aug93 on Dec 17th 2020 at 8:16:05 PM

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GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Zyffyr from Portland, Oregon Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#23: Dec 17th 2020 at 3:42:24 AM

[up][up][up]Just a note.... pretty much ALL beers are made with hops. Beer (in its most basic formulation) is Water (gotta have some liquid to start with)+ Grain of some sort(to provide the sugars that will be fermented into alcohol) + Yeast (to do the fermenting) + Hops (flavoring and bitterness). Hops are the only optional ingredient among the 4, and completely skipping it tends to make a bland barely drinkable concoction.

Edited by Zyffyr on Dec 17th 2020 at 3:42:41 AM

callmeamuffin Just getting into Utena... (he/they) from the kitchen (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Thinkin' about you, muffin
Just getting into Utena... (he/they)
#24: Dec 17th 2020 at 4:06:23 AM

If the trope name gets changed, the description also need to be slightly changed, since it mentions the Trope Namer.

As mentioned way above by someone else, Anthropomorphic Vice should be the new name, since Tropes Are Flexible.

Edited by callmeamuffin on Dec 17th 2020 at 10:09:59 PM

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Snicka Since: Jun, 2011
#25: Dec 17th 2020 at 4:10:07 AM

"Jack Daniels" (and "Joe Camel") were mentioned in the original TLP, but they were downvoted because they are brand names, rather than the personifications of alcohol and tobacco.

AlternativeTitles: JohnBarleycornAndFriends2
18th Dec '20 8:07:18 AM

Crown Description:

Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.

Total posts: 125
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