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Hindsight Cleanup

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The Hindsight tropes, Hilarious in Hindsight, Harsher in Hindsight, and Heartwarming in Hindsight, are among the most misused Audience Reaction tropes on this site. Many people don't understand that the tropes require more than just "This happened, so that happened", and end up adding examples which either lack connection or the substance that makes them funny/serious/not-so-funny/heartwarming. Some of them may be suited better for other tropes (ex: Life Imitates Art), while some may not belong on TV Tropes at all (such as ones involving politicians, due to Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment).

Please report any Hindsight example that you feel are questionable, and we'll analyze them to see if they are actually examples or not.

Remember that the Hindsight tropes are Audience Reactions. That means if an example under review discusses significant fan response pointing out the hindsight, the example can't be cut solely for being too tenuous for this thread.

    Common NOT in Hindsight examples 
  • Creator's character/portrayal dies in work and then creator dies in real life, unless their fictional death is closely similar to their real one (such as Billy Bob Joe portraying a character who dies from pancreatic cancer, then Billy Bob dies from pancreatic cancer himself)
  • Mundane word related to something terrible (such as "corona" or "Epstein") unless there's more to the connection (such as someone named "Corona" having the flu)
  • Creator appears in work then becomes more controversial later on.
  • A common event (such as a typical natural disaster) happens in work, then happens in real life (unless they are closely similar, such as the event happening to the same area in both reality and fiction around the same time) For once, not everything related to disease has to do with COVID-19, not everything related to racism and Police Brutality has to do with George Floyd and Black Lives Matter, and not everything related to sexual abuse has to do with #MeToo.
  • A common/generic concept was used in this work and then later reused in that work (too loose for a connection, unless the concept is so unique it's identified with the work)
  • Two actors appear together then do so in another work
  • Hindsight examples involving recent events, due to them often being shoehorns. Specifically:
    • COVID-19 examples, before 75% of the population has returned to normal
    • George Floyd/2020 Black Lives Matter examples, before protests have declined
  • Examples which fall guilty of Older Than They Think, such as "Make X Great Again" slogans. Aside from violating the ROCEJ, this slogan has been in use since the 1940s.
  • Characters using slurs which are treated as annoying at worst in the work, but is now harsher due to how severe the slur is made now. Discrimination has always existed with that slur. (May qualify for Values Dissonance if work is at least 20 years old.)

Note: As of January 2022, "Funny Aneurysm" Moment is no longer separate from Harsher in Hindsight.
  • The former redirects to the latter and all wicks to the former (with the exception of ones on archive pages and the YMMV Redirects index) must either be moved to the latter (if they're valid) or removed (if they're invalid).
  • The subpages for the former are still accessible from this page. After a subpage for "Funny Aneurysm" Moment has been completely cleaned up, turn it into a redirect to the Harsher in Hindsight subpage for the same medium to preserve inbounds.

Edited by Tabs on Jun 21st 2023 at 11:51:25 AM

Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
#6651: May 25th 2023 at 9:46:44 AM

Proposed entry looks good. Unsure about the Fukushima entry. Game came out in 2006/2007/2008 so people could've been thinking about the disaster.

The OP now has a third paragraph before the folder! Please keep it in mind.

bowserbros No longer active. from Elsewhere Since: May, 2014
No longer active.
#6652: May 25th 2023 at 11:29:39 AM

Since it's a new page, I felt it'd be good to mention that I'm still waiting for feedback on this.

Be kind.
BocchiTheRock Since: Feb, 2023
#6653: May 25th 2023 at 8:00:33 PM

The Hindsight page for Haruhi Suzumiya is entirely actor trivia, should I ask to cut it?

Ayumi-chan 3rd happiest man in Connecticut from Iacon City (Experienced Trainee) Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
3rd happiest man in Connecticut
#6654: May 25th 2023 at 8:07:47 PM

[up] Looking at it.... Yeeah. Send it to the cutlist. Any that can be salvaged can be moved to the YMMV page.

She/Her | Currently cleaning: N/A
BocchiTheRock Since: Feb, 2023
#6655: May 25th 2023 at 8:17:05 PM

[up] Thanks, there are a few other dubious Anime pages, namely Zoids (entirely actor trivia, one fan myopia, and one other one that may be valid), and Pretty Cure (some fan myopia, and a lot of ones that are simply "minor character in older series name was reused for main character in newer series", ignoring the fact that these are all common Japanese names.)

I'm also confused by the presence of a Politics page, considering the top of the thread here says: "while some may not belong on TV Tropes at all (such as ones involving politicians, due to Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment)." implying that politics shouldn't have a hindsight page.

Edited by BocchiTheRock on May 25th 2023 at 11:22:37 AM

TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Bye
#6656: May 26th 2023 at 9:31:42 AM

Bowser:

I think it's fine do move it to Land of Confusion with the changes that you did.

bowserbros No longer active. from Elsewhere Since: May, 2014
No longer active.
#6657: May 26th 2023 at 9:55:34 AM

[up]Alright, just did so, citing this thread.

Be kind.
BigBadShadow25 With my last breath, I curse Zoidberg. from Basement at the Alamo (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Desperate
With my last breath, I curse Zoidberg.
#6658: May 26th 2023 at 2:11:21 PM

An example from YMMV.Alone In The Dark 2023:

It’s… kinda weak, right?

You’re Gonna Carry That Weight.
TantaMonty Since: Aug, 2017
#6659: May 26th 2023 at 2:33:29 PM

[up] I agree, that's definitely a stretch.

BocchiTheRock Since: Feb, 2023
#6660: May 26th 2023 at 4:02:55 PM

Speaking of Streches, Mr Fantastic and the Fantastic Four Duology

  • Watching Chris Evans's performance as Johnny is particularly funny with the knowledge that he went on to slip into the costume of another Marvel hero… Captain America. That's about as far removed from Johnny as you'll get. Even better when you remember Scarlett Johansson, the future Black Widow, who had already starred in a number of films alongside Evans, was considered to play Sue. Also, some time after Johnny got his powers, he went skiing and fell into ice!
    Johnny: Captain on the bridge!
    i think mentioning chris evans is actually valid, considering how many people joked about it, this example needs a rewrite badly though
  • Seeing Jessica Alba play the love interest of Reed is funnier now that she became a billionaire entrepreneur and founder of The Honest Company.
    actor trivia
  • In the first game, Johnny is seen defeating Doombots. His actor, Chris Evans would play Captain America and defeat tons of robots in Avengers: Age of Ultron.
    • Also, the battle takes place in a small European country (not unlike Latveria).
    feels like a shoehorn since superheroes fighting robots is a common trope
  • The 2005 video game adaptation of the first movie not only features the main cast of the movie reprising their roles for the game but also featured an appearance by Ultimate Nick Fury, meaning you get to hear Chris Evans talking to the Samuel L. Jackson version of the character a full six years before Evan's first film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe.note 
    unsure since Sam didn't play him in the game
  • The complaints about Chris Evans and Jessica Alba not looking plausibly relatednote  are hilarious in light of the reboot casting the Storm siblings with Michael B. Jordan and Kate Mara, who look even less alike; just for starters, they're not even of the same race.note 
    feels ROCEJ violating
  • Apparently playing the Human Torch in a non-Marvel Studios movie is a good way to get yourself into the Marvel Cinematic Universe, considering that Michael B. Jordan was later tapped for a role in Black Panther (2018). Fun fact: T'Challa squares off against both of them in his career (Steve [Evans] in Captain America: Civil War and Erik Kilmonger [Jordan] in his own movie).
    this is troping Fan4stic
  • Johnny being called "Mr. Sunshine".
    actor trivia
  • Paul Walker was nearly cast as Johnny. This would have made the scene at the bridge Hilarious in Hindsight - as Johnny's reaction to Sue stripping is to ask for Brain Bleach. Walker would later play Jessica Alba's boyfriend in the movie Into the Blue where Alba would wear very little.
    actor trivia, also troping deleted content
  • Stan Lee's cameo in Rise of the Silver Surfer, where he's being denied entry from Reed and Susan's wedding, is a bit funnier when he has no cameo in the 2015 reboot.
  • Both this and the Hellboy films are significantly better comic book movies than their cruddy reboots from the late 2010s.
    shoehorn, there are tons of negatively recieved reboots, just seems like bashing
  • Elizabeth Banks was considered to play the Invisible Woman and she is currently working on a Universal Invisible Woman film.
    actor trivia, also troping deleted content
  • Rachel McAdams was considered to play Sue. She eventually joined the Marvel Cinematic Universe as Christine Palmer from Doctor Strange (2016). In Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, Palmer encounters Reed Richards.
    same as above
  • According to the crew DVD Commentary, the film's screenplay was inspired by Ghostbusters (1984). Both Fantastic Four (2015) and Ghostbusters (2016) are inferior reboots to the duologies.
    same as the hellboy example
  • Kerry Washington played Alicia in both movies and the third movie would have had Djimon Hounsou as Black Panther as well as an expanded role for Alicia. After the third movie was cancelled, Hounsou would voice Black Panther in a cartoon with Kerry Washington as the voice of Shuri.
    actor trivia
    • Plus, one of the What If…? (2021) episodes features T'Challa as Star-Lord, who will be captured by Korath the Pursuer (played by Djimon Hounsou).
    again more actor
  • The first film is oddly prescient of Teen Titans Go! and The Powerpuff Girls (2016), lighthearted superhero affairs with a major criticism that they don't do much crimefighting.
    fan myopia and again feels like bashing those two shows
  • Thing calls Johnny "Tinker Bell", the mascot of Disney, that ends up owning 20th Century Fox. Thus Marvel regained movie rights to the Fantastic Four (along with X-Men).
    disney fox shoehorn
  • The Thing decides to take the stairs. In Avengers: Endgame, the Hulk detests stairs.
    shoehorn
  • Sue asks Reed "Why don't you strip down and have a hundred people stare at you?" A scene from a Thor: Love and Thunder trailer has Thor stripped of his clothes and the people stared at him.
    shoehorn, thor isn't reed, and the line is a reference to the scene where Sue does exactly that so not hindsight

RallyBot2 (Elder Troper) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
#6661: May 27th 2023 at 4:27:39 AM

I was going to do the Persona Hindsights a while ago, but I had a lot of non-troping business on my plate to deal with. Might as well get this over with, starting with the early games and some of the spinoffs.

    Persona 1 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • Mark sure is good at dancing crazy. Nearly twenty years later both in and out-of-universe, so would a bunch of people living in a town he shares his last name with. And eventually, so did the people of neighboring cities. Everyone danced crazy like Mark. Keep with a rewrite, probably mentioning that P4 Dancing made a Call-Back to the (in)famous "Mark danced crazy" line.
    • Personas of the Fool Arcana are relatively rare, with only three in this game and all available solely through fusion accidents. As of Persona 3 onwards, the Arcana is reserved for the protagonists and the Social Links associated with the Arcana are that of their teams. One of these Personas, Narukami, is associated with Electricity in the other installments of the SMT franchise it appears in and shares its name with the initial English rename of Elizabeth's Electricity spell El Jihad, which was renamed back to Jihad in Golden more than likely because P4 The Animation cemented the protagonist's canon name as Yu Narukami, whose main Persona Izanagi's spells generally revolve around Electricity attacks. Keep. It's a bit of a stretch, but it's good enough.

    Persona 2 
  • Harsher in Hindsight: In order to sell the game outside of Japan as well as even provide some foreshadowing to the true nature (See Woolseyism), the Swastikas were replaced with Iron crosses. The use of the Iron Cross by neo-nazis proved almost eerily prophetic to The New '10s, where the Iron Cross returned, was mistaken for being a nazi symbol, and even started to be used by actual Neo-nazis. The Nazis themselves used the Iron Cross. Cut.
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • Tatsuya's ultimate Persona Apollo can perform Nova Kaiser, which allows him to briefly stop time. This won't be the last time that Takehito Koyasu will voice a character who can summon a spirit that can stop time. Actor fluff. Cut.
    • One of Hitler's special moves in his boss fight is called "Holy Grail". David Lodge, who voices Hitler's English dub, would voice the actual Holy Grail in Persona 5. Keep and expand, it's a valid example if expanded due to the similarities between the characters.

    Persona -trinity soul- 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • Daisuke Namikawa voices Tōma Shikura, one of the Marebito members. Come Persona 4, he instead voices our 100%-heroic protagonist Yu Narukami. Actor fluff. Cut.
    • Shin has a noticeable resemblance towards Goro Akechi. No he doesn't, unless you count a very common hairstyle and color as "a noticeable resemblance." Cut.

    Persona 4 Arena 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight: This piece of fanart made before Persona 4 Arena. And when the game did release, we were actually treated to a scene where Chie and Akihiko actually fought over a beef bowl. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. In this case it has nowhere to go. Cut.

    Persona 4 Arena Ultimax 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • The first line of the chorus to "Time To Make History" (The new battle theme from Persona 4 Golden) being the Baseball terminology "Step on up to the plate" became this when Junpei was unveiled, dressed in a baseball uniform & wielding a baseball bat as his weapon of choice. This was ramped up when "Time To Make History" replaced "Fog" as the Instant-Kill theme. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. Move.
    • Kagutsuchi's boss appearance - considering that the recent BlazBlue game had a similar boss with Take-Mikazuchi, one of the gods born out of Kagutsuchi's blood. Fan Myopia. Cut.
    • The Big Bad made those evil versions of the characters who will mess with them For the Evulz. Sounds familiar? Fan Myopia. Cut.
    • Kanji hating Ken in the P4 route is this when he ends up becoming a Big Brother Mentor to him in Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth and has a close relationship with each other. Not enough for an example. Cut.
    • Ken wanting to grow taller from drinking milk in Persona 3 becomes way funnier now that he really did grow! Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. It's not an example anyway as a boy will naturally grow during puberty. Cut.
    • Marie's "TV world glasses" is an eye patch on her left eye. Justine and Caroline, the new Velvet Room attendants in Persona 5, would wear eyepatches. Keep.

    Persona 3: Dancing in Moonlight 
  • Heartwarming in Hindsight:
    • The opening song "Our Moment" is about friends reuniting after a long time separated, which heavily foreshadows that Elizabeth will eventually succeed in freeing Makoto from his fate of being the Great Seal, something she's been tirelessly working on since the events of P3 according to Persona 4 Arena. Plus, its references to "Mass Destruction" and "Burn My Dread" will make anyone who has fond memories of the original game smile. Just Heartwarming, not Hindsight. Cut.
    • Brand New Days can be interpreted as Makoto spending his final moments with his best friend or having one last dance with three of his love interests before his death. Furthermore, he is able to spend his final moments with Yukari who became consumed by her Angst during The Answer when she couldn't be with him. Just Heartwarming, not Hindsight. Cut.
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • A stroll in Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth has Junpei wanting to participate in a crossdressing pageant after finding out from the one that was held at Yasogami High from Yosuke and Kanji. The boys are able to dress in drag in this game with Ken having two of them. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. Move.
    • For people who noticed that how similar Yuzu Tanikawa and the main protagonist character of Devil Survivor look to Yukari and P3's main hero may get a laugh out of the fact that the two have costumes based on the aforementioned duo. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. Move.

    Persona 4: Dancing All Night 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • Due to licensing issues, Miku's outfit from this game couldn't appear in Project Diva, since Miku doesn't solo the song it came from. Just under a year after this game came out, SEGA added it as a DLC module to both Project Diva X and Future Tone, as well as Project Diva Arcade Future Tone's rotation. It's not Hilarious, not Hindsight, and not from this game. Three strikes, you're out. Cut.
    • Yukiko's Velvet Room outfit makes her look like an older version of Lavenza. No it doesn't. The only similarities are the outfit (which is Margaret's, not Lavenza's) and the long hair. Cut.

    Persona 5: Dancing in Starlight 
  • Hilarious in Hindsight:
    • This video was made two and a half months before Dancing Star Night was announced. Guess who else got a dancing spinoff announced at the same time? Guess he saw it coming! Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. In this case it has nowhere to go. Cut.
    • A common comparison and joke by fans is with how Ren looks a lot like a certain glasses-wearing wizard. Ren's Halloween costume in this game is a wizard's outfit, complete with red accents. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. Move.
    • This Jim Carrey imitation video was published and has nothing to do with this game. Atlus then proceeded to make this cinematic accompany the song in the game. Assuming they based it off the original video, this doubles as an Ascended Meme. Hindsight audience reactions are for the work made hilarious/harsher/heartwarming by a later work. This is the wrong page for it. It's precisely that: an Ascended Meme. Cut.
    • Futaba's Les Yay moments when partnered with another female become this when her voice actress, Erica Lindbeck, came out as bisexual. Actor fluff. Cut.

TantaMonty Since: Aug, 2017
#6662: May 28th 2023 at 9:29:35 AM

Found this:

  • Hilarious in Hindsight: The Joker makes a comment that soon his tumor will claim him and he'll be deader than Pokémon. Y'know, the franchise that is still, to this day, 20 years and change and counting, an absolute juggernaut.

It describes a joke that aged like milk, which is basically the opposite of Hilarious in Hindsight. I'll cut it, is that okay?

Noaqiyeum we must dissent (it/they) from across the gulf of space (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
we must dissent (it/they)
#6664: May 28th 2023 at 1:42:48 PM

[up][up] The Joker being so incredibly wrong about Pokemon's longevity is funnier than it would have been at the time, so it seems like a good example to me.

ERROR: The current state of the world is unacceptable. Save anyway? YES/NO
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#6665: May 28th 2023 at 3:12:35 PM

And a joke that aged like milk still counts as Hilarious in Hindsight because the retroactive Dramatic Irony of It Will Never Catch On is funny.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#6666: May 28th 2023 at 4:34:25 PM

I think I've mentioned this before, but my dad is more into Pokemon in the present day than I ever was in the 90s. That example genuinely makes me laugh. I'd definitely keep it.

RacattackForce (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#6667: May 28th 2023 at 4:38:47 PM

I agree. I feel like the manner in which the joke aged manages to wrap around back to being funny precisely because of how ironic it has become, so I'd keep the example.

badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
#6669: May 28th 2023 at 6:40:39 PM

It sounds correct (and funny) to me, so I’ll throw in another keep.

AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#6670: May 28th 2023 at 6:50:06 PM

I love it too because its a great example, keep.

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
bowserbros No longer active. from Elsewhere Since: May, 2014
No longer active.
#6671: May 28th 2023 at 11:23:52 PM

I'd say keep with a slight rewrite to make note of the fact that Pokémon was genuinely (and incorrectly) seen as a dying fad circa 2001, just to contextualize the Joker's line.

Edited by bowserbros on May 28th 2023 at 11:24:10 AM

Be kind.
AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#6672: May 29th 2023 at 7:45:36 AM

Do other entries have that sort of explanation?

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
bowserbros No longer active. from Elsewhere Since: May, 2014
No longer active.
#6673: May 29th 2023 at 9:33:39 AM

[up]I don't recall, but considering how forgotten Pokémon's low period in the early 2000s seems to be, I think it's worth mentioning, e.g. "at the time, Pokémon was rapidly declining in popularity, which led to even Game Freak worrying that the series would end up a fad."

Be kind.
AegisP Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Kindhearted SSSSSNAKE Man
#6674: May 29th 2023 at 9:41:28 AM

If its not standard to have these sort of explanations then they arent needed and shouldnt be added.

As long as this flower is in my heart. My Strength will flow without end.
Zuxtron Berserk Button: misusing Nightmare Fuel from Node 03 (On A Trope Odyssey)
#6675: May 29th 2023 at 10:56:44 AM

I feel like extra context is always welcome, regardless of if it's "needed". It really can't hurt to make it clearer for people who haven't been Pokemon fans for decades.


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