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Hindsight Cleanup

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The Hindsight tropes, Hilarious in Hindsight, Harsher in Hindsight, and Heartwarming in Hindsight, are among the most misused Audience Reaction tropes on this site. Many people don't understand that the tropes require more than just "This happened, so that happened", and end up adding examples which either lack connection or the substance that makes them funny/serious/not-so-funny/heartwarming. Some of them may be suited better for other tropes (ex: Life Imitates Art), while some may not belong on TV Tropes at all (such as ones involving politicians, due to Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment).

Please report any Hindsight example that you feel are questionable, and we'll analyze them to see if they are actually examples or not.

Remember that the Hindsight tropes are Audience Reactions. That means if an example under review discusses significant fan response pointing out the hindsight, the example can't be cut solely for being too tenuous for this thread.

    Common NOT in Hindsight examples 
  • Creator's character/portrayal dies in work and then creator dies in real life, unless their fictional death is closely similar to their real one (such as Billy Bob Joe portraying a character who dies from pancreatic cancer, then Billy Bob dies from pancreatic cancer himself)
  • Mundane word related to something terrible (such as "corona" or "Epstein") unless there's more to the connection (such as someone named "Corona" having the flu)
  • Creator appears in work then becomes more controversial later on.
  • A common event (such as a typical natural disaster) happens in work, then happens in real life (unless they are closely similar, such as the event happening to the same area in both reality and fiction around the same time) For once, not everything related to disease has to do with COVID-19, not everything related to racism and Police Brutality has to do with George Floyd and Black Lives Matter, and not everything related to sexual abuse has to do with #MeToo.
  • A common/generic concept was used in this work and then later reused in that work (too loose for a connection, unless the concept is so unique it's identified with the work)
  • Two actors appear together then do so in another work
  • Hindsight examples involving recent events, due to them often being shoehorns. Specifically:
    • COVID-19 examples, before 75% of the population has returned to normal
    • George Floyd/2020 Black Lives Matter examples, before protests have declined
  • Examples which fall guilty of Older Than They Think, such as "Make X Great Again" slogans. Aside from violating the ROCEJ, this slogan has been in use since the 1940s.
  • Characters using slurs which are treated as annoying at worst in the work, but is now harsher due to how severe the slur is made now. Discrimination has always existed with that slur. (May qualify for Values Dissonance if work is at least 20 years old.)

Note: As of January 2022, "Funny Aneurysm" Moment is no longer separate from Harsher in Hindsight.
  • The former redirects to the latter and all wicks to the former (with the exception of ones on archive pages and the YMMV Redirects index) must either be moved to the latter (if they're valid) or removed (if they're invalid).
  • The subpages for the former are still accessible from this page. After a subpage for "Funny Aneurysm" Moment has been completely cleaned up, turn it into a redirect to the Harsher in Hindsight subpage for the same medium to preserve inbounds.

Edited by Tabs on Jun 21st 2023 at 11:51:25 AM

Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#5226: Mar 9th 2022 at 3:31:37 PM

YMMV.Nintendo Wars

  • Harsher in Hindsight: Having the word war in its title is vulnerable to unfortunate real-life events.
    • The first Advance Wars game shipped on September 10, 2001, and went on sale in most stores that Tuesday, which was, well, you know.
    • Advance Wars 1+2 Re-Boot Camp, a game that was supposed to be released in April 8th, 2022 was delayed due to the events of the Russo-Ukrainian War.

The latter example might be misuse as Hindsight is duet to events after the work in question releases and this is prerelease covered by Distanced from Current Events. But a a remake of an existing work it could be considered after. Thoughts?

mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#5227: Mar 9th 2022 at 3:40:49 PM

I don't think the second one counts (it is Distanced from Current Events though), but the first one might be valid if the gameplay actually resembles the 9/11 attacks in any way and it's not just the word "war" in the title.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Albert3105 Since: Jun, 2013
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#5229: Mar 9th 2022 at 4:17:42 PM

Goosebumps did not invent fascism

[lol] This is one of the funniest things I've ever seen on a cleanup thread when you divorce it from any context.

Obviously, cut that example, and the one Ferot mentioned.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him
#5230: Mar 9th 2022 at 4:57:14 PM

[up] I almost posted it out-of-context to Forum Win but I didn't know how it would be received.

Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
MrMediaGuy2 Since: Jun, 2015
#5231: Mar 10th 2022 at 11:13:01 AM

This example from My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic S5 E25 "The Cutie Re-Mark – Part 1" feels like pure Fan Myopia to me.

  • After Twilights' first attempt at stopping Starlight failed, she and Spike are ejected from the past into another timeline: one that as we would find out is a timeline involving Changelings. And what is the first thing that Spike says?

Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
#5232: Mar 10th 2022 at 12:38:04 PM

[up] That's on the YMMV for the fanfic page.

namra Since: Sep, 2021
#5233: Mar 10th 2022 at 6:07:15 PM

i think we need to address shoehorns related to the ukraine conflict. much like covid, users are randomly shoehorning the ukraine conflict to vaguely related entries.

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#5234: Mar 10th 2022 at 6:08:03 PM

We have a thread about that. Any Ukraine examples can be cut on sight though because the conflict isn't over yet.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
namra Since: Sep, 2021
#5235: Mar 10th 2022 at 6:15:33 PM

i see, thanks for letting me know.

Dramatic Since: Jun, 2012
#5236: Mar 11th 2022 at 5:07:11 AM

From Call of Duty: Black Ops Cold War:

  • Harsher in Hindsight: If you choose the good ending but fail to eliminate Aldrich's spy ring, Hudson will later remark that extreme measures like enhanced domestic surveillance will be required to help take it down. He later expresses frustration that such measures won't be allowed. Black simply replies: "Not yet."

This is commentary on a current issue that outright calls out the fact that it's a current issue, so not hindsight.

I also thought to have a look at Modern Warfare:

The in-game level doesn't involve a bombing, and it also didn't take place in 2011, so I think this is a stretch.
Maybe, but al-Assad's dictatorship does predate the release of Modern Warfare even if it became more notorious later, so I'm not sure on this one.
The real-world attack didn't involve gas or chemical weapons. This is "major city experiences terrorist attack".
  • Shepherd's speech at the beginning of Modern Warfare 2 about the Afghan soldiers trained by US forces takes a harsher meaning in the wake of 2021 Taliban takeover of Afghanistan.
This could be a maybe, but it also gives absolutely zero context as to how it's harsher.
  • Depending on how you feel about Russia, the Ultranationalists' goal of restoring the country to its Soviet era glory sounds strikingly similar to that of Russian President Vladimir Putin. Even Vladimir Makarov vaguely looks like Putin with a different hairstyle. Even harsher after Putin invaded Ukraine in February 2022.
I think this could stay, though it is at risk of just being a case of the writers taking inspiration from current politics rather than them predicting the future; the first Modern Warfare after all was released during Putin's first presidency. Occupy Wall Street has nothing to do with the events of the level. This is "major financial center is featured in game because its famous, then is later the site of protests because it's a major financial center".
I think this broadly counts, though that last sentence does come off as complaining (the campaign of Infinite Warfare is Vindicated by History by now).

Someoneman Since: Nov, 2011
#5237: Mar 11th 2022 at 7:47:21 AM

This was on Dragon Quest VII:

  • Harsher in Hindsight: Labres/Vogograd has you deal with a problem that, after the scenario's completion the villagers of the town are ashamed of their handling of, and erect a monument to prevent it from being forgotten. Go to the present, however, and a blatantly fake inscription is put on the monument that says the villagers were the heroes, and is blatantly false, which the town wholeheartedly believes. Once you uncover the original inscription, you take it to the village elder, who promptly destroys it rather than face reality, then tells you to leave and never return. This particular type of blatant disregard for the truth in spite of clear evidence has become a lot more relevant since its 2000 release.

Note the pothole to Donald Trump near the end. I removed it since it's a pretty clear ROCEJ violation, plus Donald Trump doesn't own the concept of misinformation.

Tonwen HoMM Fan from Axeoth Since: Dec, 2021 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
HoMM Fan
#5238: Mar 11th 2022 at 9:19:12 AM

[up]I'd even argue to dump the whole entry, Written by the Winners as a concept predates the Radio.

"Grandmaster Combat, son!"
MrMediaGuy2 Since: Jun, 2015
#5239: Mar 11th 2022 at 12:01:45 PM

This was just added to Calvin and Hobbes.

  • In a 1993 strip, Calvin's dad off-handedly wishes that the price of gas would rise to $8 a gallon. Come 2022, and this would be a near-reality for some Americans.

RallyBot2 (Elder Troper) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
#5240: Mar 12th 2022 at 1:48:46 AM

[up]It was going to happen at some point due to inflation. Cut.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#5241: Mar 13th 2022 at 4:04:39 PM

From Xenoblade Chronicles X:

  • Harsher in Hindsight: During Lao's Motive Rant, he implies that race was one of the deciding factors (in addition to general corruption) in the selection process for who got to board the White Whale, with members of racial minorities only getting picked because of their skills or social status. Five years after the game was released, many Asian-Americans became victims of hate crimes, being used as scapegoats for the COVID-19 Pandemic. Bear in mind, Lao is heavily implied to be Chinese-American (saying "people like us" to Lin; and the White Whale was an American ship) and given the year the game takes place and his listed age, born at a time where the Pandemic and the accompanying anti-Asian sentiment would have still been a fresh memory, if not subject to discrimination himself along with his family because of it. As such, his Freudian Excuse can become a bit more socially-relevant than the writers intended.

Anti-Asian racism has existed ever since Asians existed. Not to mention, gratuitous COVID shoehorn as well. Also, unnecessary all-white entry.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 13th 2022 at 7:05:07 AM

mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#5242: Mar 13th 2022 at 5:42:25 PM

Anti-Asian sentiment has definitely increased in prominence but it's ridiculous to act like it was never a serious issue before. Plus the example has nothing to do with pandemics. The point about the Freudian Excuse might make sense if that was the focus, but as written it just reads like "anti-Asian racism only exists in relation to COVID."

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#5243: Mar 13th 2022 at 6:44:07 PM

[up]Don't forget about the Atlanta spa shootings that happened last year and have nothing to do with the pandemic despite happening during it.

Kirby is awesome.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#5244: Mar 13th 2022 at 7:17:30 PM

But that's... not really relevant to the example... Nen, I feel like I'm just being an ass half the time, but a lot of your posts are seriously unrelated, man.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
maxwellsilver Since: Sep, 2011
#5245: Mar 14th 2022 at 8:12:57 AM

Just checked Alien to see if John Hurt's passing was shoehorned. I'm almost surprised it wasn't.

  • Harsher in Hindsight:
    • In the novelisation, Ash says the aliens who left the distress signal to warn others from landing on the planet were a noble people, and that hopefully humanity will meet them under better circumstances. Come Prometheus the Engineers are shown to have created the Xenomorphs as a Weapon of Mass Destruction, that at one point they attempted to use to destroy humanity. Is that a factual statement in the context of the novelisation, or speculation on his part? If it's speculation, I'd say it's not an example
    • The order the characters die in the film note  eerily mirrors the current order the actors passed away in real life. Actor mortality shoehorn, and seeing as Kane is the first to die, but John Hurt lived longer than most of the cast, it wasn't even accurate in the first place
    • In a post-COVID world, Ripley's demand that they remain outside to maintain quarantine seems chillingly correct. Infectious diseases and quarantines existed long before this film or COVID

maxwellsilver Since: Sep, 2011
#5246: Mar 14th 2022 at 8:32:13 AM

Sorry, I confused John Hurt with William Hurt. But my point still stands about the actor mortality.

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (10,238/50,000)
#5247: Mar 14th 2022 at 10:19:17 AM

I'd found this on YMMV.Bad Creepypasta when looking to see if a Ukraine shoehorn was added (because a story they read took place there and they made a lot of jokes about how shitty life in Ukraine is). It wasn't. I did, however, find this gem of a tropeslash, and I'm not sure if I should axe it entirely or what:

  • Hilarious in Hindsight/Harsher in Hindsight:
    • The title of It Will Get Worse wasn't just a title drop for the creepypasta, but spelled out how cringe-worthy (and at times, tasteless) some of the creepypastas they later riffed became.
    • During the Jeff the Killer Vs. Slenderman reading, Toby cracked a joke about how Jeff the Killer had rabid fans, which Jacob responded with a potshot towards PewDiePie. After reading Jane the Killer: The Real Story and Clockwork: Your Time is Up, they outright despise the Jeff fandom for unanimously praising the story while making light of sensitive subjects such as murder and sexual abuse.
    • During Chuckie's Mom, the mention of a "harlequin baby" sends the guys into hysterics, picturing a baby dressed up like a jester with a mask and pointy hat. Not only is it a real thingnote , but about two years after the pasta was read, a very, very infamous video involving it would be published.
    • In Thomas, Matt jokes on the fact that Thomas believes that his sanity and trauma over seeing his mom kill herself would be cured from just a hug. Years later, Steven Universe: Future came out, and the main criticism for the final episode was that Steven's over-a-year-long traumas about his mother were solved with just a hug and some sweet words.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
costanton11 Since: Mar, 2016
#5248: Mar 14th 2022 at 10:54:57 AM

[up][up] I think the one about the deaths was previously discussed because the actors died in the same order as the characters, but it seems like a stretch since the actors all died of natural causes.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#5249: Mar 14th 2022 at 2:54:56 PM

From Captain America: Civil War:

  • Ross telling the Avengers of how he suffered a heart attack and cheated an untimely death becomes tragic irony in light of his actor William Hurt's own untimely passing of natural causes in 2022, eight years since reprising his role in this film after his debut in 2008 in The Incredible Hulk and a year after his very last role as Ross in Black Widow.Black Widow (2021).

Well there's our first William Hurt shoehorn.

costanton11 Since: Mar, 2016
#5250: Mar 14th 2022 at 6:18:15 PM

The circumstances weren't similar, so it doesn't apply in this case.


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