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Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of Star Wars movies and shows, and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

    Original text of OP 
Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone! Because I didn't want to be tempted to read anymore spoilers for Rise of Skywalker!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of the Star Wars movies and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

Rise of Skywalker Final Trailer:

Mr. Sunday's Ten Easy To Miss Details in Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Final Trailer Breakdown):

This cool mashup of Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker and Avengers: Endgame trailers:

And also here's a trailer for The Mandalorian:

Edited by Mrph1 on Aug 31st 2024 at 8:23:29 PM

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#21176: Jul 6th 2022 at 3:04:13 PM

I dunno, misfit smuggler barely getting by and being hounded by the bigger fish seems to be a common character type regardless of their state of mourning.

uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#21177: Jul 6th 2022 at 3:07:02 PM

There are many storys that portray Han that way even when he is supposedly on his A game.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#21178: Jul 6th 2022 at 3:07:57 PM

Han was always kinda winging it. Half his gambles across the OT tend to screw up or create new complications. So that his attempt to weasel out just creates more hijinks is par for the course, not especially the lowest he’s been.

DarthNoxIsCool Since: Jun, 2022
#21179: Jul 6th 2022 at 4:28:31 PM

I don't understand why the hate towards Han Solo.

Coping with your son going down the wrong path, going back to doing something you're good at, seemed interesting to me and a good justification.

Diana1969 Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#21180: Jul 6th 2022 at 4:44:04 PM

Some people are just born monstrous.

No, they aren't. There's no inherent "monstrousness" to someone upon birth.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#21181: Jul 6th 2022 at 4:47:47 PM

I mean yeah sure thats true but its Kylo.

So its not really a bad thing to slander him as a soulless vile monster who never gave a damn for anything or anyone in his life. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
DarthNoxIsCool Since: Jun, 2022
#21182: Jul 6th 2022 at 4:50:28 PM

I think there is a fine line between Alternative character interpretation and Ron the Death Eater.

Still, Kylo had some characterization issues in the trilogy, including "having the greatest power" Luke has ever felt, which he never bothered to show.

Edited by DarthNoxIsCool on Jul 6th 2022 at 4:54:10 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21183: Jul 6th 2022 at 5:07:09 PM

No, they aren't. There's no inherent "monstrousness" to someone upon birth.

In this respect, I think a better statement is that someone can be mentally sound, given a good environment, and still become a reprehensible piece of shit.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#21184: Jul 6th 2022 at 5:12:02 PM

So, with Han, it's a bit rough, because we've literally watched him develop out of that character into someone else. To have him backslide entirely offscreen is just...sad. It's not impossible or anything, people do backslide for all sorts of reasons, but it's a truly wild storytelling decision to undo a story arc and then kill the character off. About as wild as TLJ's decision to rerun Luke's character arc of learning how to be a Jedi and then kill him off.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21185: Jul 6th 2022 at 5:17:08 PM

Well Harrison Ford always wanted written out and I frankly think dying trying to reach Kylo Ren was a good moment.

IF YOU ARENT GOING TO REDEEM HIM.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#21186: Jul 6th 2022 at 5:54:02 PM

[up]Sure. But don't have him be bumming around the galaxy doing nothing. Have him actually be using the contacts he made through a quite successful back-half of his life as a general and Leia's husband to try to find their son. Leia is focused on the bigger picture of the First Order, Han is trying to rescue Ben from Snoke. ETA: The bit at the end, where he tries to convince Ben to come back and fails and is killed, is honestly the best part of the ST, I'm super fine with that part. It's everything around it that annoys the crap out of me.

Edited by ECD on Jul 6th 2022 at 5:55:03 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#21187: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:01:18 PM

Way back I read an interview with one of the writers of TFA, and they said the reason why they didn’t want to use the more mature and politically connected Han of Legends was because they felt him being half of a “Washington power couple” meant he couldn’t go on space adventures like before. So it feels like a waste to regress him but then kill him so he’s not going on any more flights anyway.

I’m more invested in TLJ’s Luke direction because while he is fallen it’s a new and fascinating direction to the character for me. I’m less interested in more of the same as with Han.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21188: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:05:23 PM

I'm not sure there's any value to Luke as a tired old man because, well, that was Obi-Wan's story.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#21189: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:06:49 PM

Not really? Old Ben Kenobi wasn’t really doubting of the Jedi way.

Mega_zxa Since: Mar, 2015
#21190: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:40:07 PM

Honestly fallen old man Luke doesn't feel any different then the other fallen old masters who have lost faith in the world and what they believed in and need the new generation to restore that faith.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#21191: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:43:10 PM

Yeah, neither Obi-Wan nor Yoda had actually lost faith in the Will of the Force. They were simply biding their time and waiting for Luke and Leia to be ready.

Luke otoh...had just plain given up on it all. He even stopped using the Force entirely by the time TLJ begins.

Disgusted, but not surprised
EmeraldSource Since: Jan, 2021
#21192: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:49:13 PM

For me what didn't make sense is that smuggling is by definition an illegal, under the table endeavor that requires a certain degree of anonymity. Underground circles might spread around some notoriety, but a consistent reputation is needed. If Han becomes a war hero and minor figurehead in the New Republic there is no chance he would be trusted for any smuggling job. I liked the idea Han is hiding his pain with his work, but let's not pretend it wasn't done to ensure fans are excited to see the old criminal Han and freedom fighter Leia.

Comics are just words and pictures. You can do anything with words and pictures.
ECD Since: Nov, 2021
#21193: Jul 6th 2022 at 6:53:07 PM

[up]It's definitely clear that the ST's goal was to 'recapture' the magic, but trying to do that by literally repeating character beats is just...bad.

More generally, you only need him as a smuggler if you're sticking with, he meets Finn/Rey basically by accident. Whereas, if he's searching for Ben, well Ben is looking for Finn/Rey. Lots of ways for him to find that out.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#21194: Jul 6th 2022 at 7:03:12 PM

The intentions bleed into the execution, basically.

Han being broken by grief and going into a self destructive spiral is a great idea for a character arc, but it's not really there to be a character move. Han doesn't - like - go through experiences that cause him to find his center again, or anything. He just kind of goes along with the story, sometimes being more virtuous, sometimes more roguish, until he dies. It's there to push Han into being the same character he was in the OT again. And it shows.

Likewise, all the steps they went to turn Luke into the next OT Obi-Wan, and all the steps they made to keep Leia from being too different from OT Leia (it's generally overshadowed by all the other crap in that film, but I'm still pissed at how hard TROS shut down the idea of her being a Jedi).

A lot of these ideas are good, but go largely unexplored because the point isn't to bring those ideas into the story, it's to use these ideas to make the universe smaller and more reminiscent of what we've already seen.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jul 6th 2022 at 7:04:29 AM

HeraldAlberich from Ohio (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Gonna take a lot to drag me away from you
#21195: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:12:11 PM

Y’know, I think I’m still getting over my expectation that a Han Solo at this age, if he has to still be smuggling, ought to be an Old Master at it. So for him to struggle and fail seems subversive. This entire page of replies has been insightful for me.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#21196: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:26:18 PM

One way Han has changed since the OT is that he's become a true believer in the Force. He outright tells Rey that all of that stuff about the Jedi is true.

Which makes it bitterly ironic that Luke by contrast has lost faith in the Force and given up on it.

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21197: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:36:46 PM

My take is that Han Solo was actually a shitty smuggler and failing miserably at the job he used to excel at. Part of what I was getting from it is that Han Solo is now too nice of a person to be a smuggler.

After all, he believes in the Force and jumps at a chance to help the others.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#21198: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:41:24 PM

I switch between "He's gotten too nice" and "He was deliberately conning his employers".

Leviticus 19:34
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#21199: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:51:58 PM

It’d be interesting if the stuff he was smuggling was stuff that ordinary people sorely needed, but couldn’t obtain legally for whatever reason.

Oh God! Natural light!
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21200: Jul 6th 2022 at 8:56:09 PM

I assumed he was trying to con his employees because, of course, they're bad people.

I also have the headcanon that the two criminal syndicates were really mad because they were big fans of him.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.

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