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Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of Star Wars movies and shows, and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

    Original text of OP 
Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone! Because I didn't want to be tempted to read anymore spoilers for Rise of Skywalker!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of the Star Wars movies and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

Rise of Skywalker Final Trailer:

Mr. Sunday's Ten Easy To Miss Details in Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Final Trailer Breakdown):

This cool mashup of Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker and Avengers: Endgame trailers:

And also here's a trailer for The Mandalorian:

Edited by Mrph1 on Aug 31st 2024 at 8:23:29 PM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21076: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:48:03 AM

But it does kinda contrast with his plans revealed in Episode 9.

Build hundreds of mini-Death Stars?

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#21077: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:50:11 AM

Yeah, one thing that I actually like a lot better in the new canon is that there's a lot less romanticization of the Empire, making it clear than any "noble" qualities they have are window dressing and nothing more. Seriously, the Mando Season 2 finale shows that they apparently have ready-made handcuffs for babies.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21078: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:56:38 AM

I even like they did a great Alternate Character Interpretation of Thrawn that is entirely consistent with his character but actually pretty devastating.

In Hera's episode, they had Thrawn as the erudite, sophisticated, "respectful" Imperial of her people as well as well as culture.

Hera is MORE disgusted with him because all of Thrawn's art is stolen from the worlds they were sacred to and she'd rather see it burn than be on one of his shelves.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#21079: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:58:24 AM

[up][up]

Yeah, I remember when Blindwave watched that episode and one of them went "Of course they have baby-sized shackles".

[up]

Quotation marks on the "respectful" part because he's still treating a family heirloom like a trophy to put on his shelf.

That he understands the cultural value of what he's holding makes it even worse, in my opinion.

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Jul 4th 2022 at 5:59:51 PM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21080: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:58:52 AM

Them punching baby Yoda for fun was fantastic.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#21081: Jul 4th 2022 at 8:59:12 AM

Yeah, I always did see Thrawn as that kind of bastard who appreciates cultures as he steps on the people and takes their stuff.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#21082: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:00:42 AM

It also makes me wonder what Chiss culture's like - remember, in canon he isn't actually in exile.

He's a mole.

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21083: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:05:08 AM

I think Zahn must have realized the Empire was not going to be Worthy Opponent British types like he'd hoped.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#21084: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:07:57 AM

Times change.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#21085: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:08:16 AM

Wich means that after the fall of the Empire Thrawn is now a complete wild card. I hope he is not actually connected to Gideons Imperial remnant, he has so much more potential as the leader of a third faction.

Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#21086: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:19:13 AM

[up][up][up] I believe a lot of it has to do with Lucas spelling out exactly how Palpatine got into power. Prior to Revenge of the Sith, the Yuuzhan Vong invasion was used as a justification by Imperial apologists (both in-universe and real life) to say that Palpatine building the Death Star and militarizing the galaxy was actually a good thing because he was prepare to defend the universe from the Vong.

And then Revenge of the Sith reveals that not only was Palpatine the Sith Lord Darth Sidious, but it was clear he only cared about UNLIMITED POWER and is a pure Card-Carrying Villain through and through. That and also building the Empire on the blood of children.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#21087: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:27:31 AM

“Wow I can’t believe the guy in a black cloak named Darkness Badman sitting on a throne on Death Planet who hates friendship and zaps a guy with lightning for being too nice didn’t have good intentions.”

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#21088: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:34:19 AM

[up][up] What was the OG version of Sheev's rise to power again?

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Diana1969 Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#21089: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:34:59 AM

Prior to Revenge of the Sith, the Yuuzhan Vong invasion was used as a justification by Imperial apologists (both in-universe and real life) to say that Palpatine building the Death Star and militarizing the galaxy was actually a good thing because he was prepare to defend the universe from the Vong.

Not gonna lie, that *really* feels like the kind of thing Nazi-apologists love to say about Operation: Barbarossa.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#21090: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:36:31 AM

People in-universe also point out that if all these impractical superweapons fell to the Rebels, then there's no way they could stand up to the Vong.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#21091: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:40:41 AM

[up][up][up] Originally, it was pretty much the same in Lucas' original notes except Palpatine was more of a Richard Nixon figure than an Adolf Hitler/Julius Caesar/Napoleon. He was legitimately elected into a corrupt Republic, promising reform. Then he became corrupt, declared himself Emperor, and is controlled by other greedy figures like Tarkin and Vader.

Then Lucas made a big change with the Emperor in TESB, revealing him to be an evil sorcerer who makes Vader kneel before him.

Edited by Shadao on Jul 4th 2022 at 9:41:21 AM

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#21092: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:41:13 AM

Wich means that after the fall of the Empire Thrawn is now a complete wild card. I hope he is not actually connected to Gideons Imperial remnant, he has so much more potential as the leader of a third faction.

Considering his whole purpose within the Empire was to win a strong ally for the Chiss, it's gonna be interesting to see what he's up to now that the Empire collapsed.

People in-universe also point out that if all these impractical superweapons fell to the Rebels, then there's no way they could stand up to the Vong.

Yeah, Han had a good rant about that in one of the novels dealing with the Yuuzhan Vong War.

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Jul 4th 2022 at 6:42:14 PM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#21093: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:42:14 AM

Yeah, with The Empire they're not just evil but so obviously evil as to be somewhat comical.

In fact, one of the things that's impressive about Star Wars is the way it can actually make you take guys with names like "Darth Vader" seriously.

Leviticus 19:34
FrozenWolf2 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#21094: Jul 4th 2022 at 9:57:18 AM

The only Imperial who was EVER preparing for an invasion was Thrawn... by specifically robbing the Empire of resources, tech and personnel and just building HIS own Faction with the Chiss to deal with them... with added bonus that Thrawn would actively make sure that the Empire would be the First target over the Chiss

Thrawn saw the Empire as the Expendable one here.

Palpy was as prepared for the Vong invasion as he was losing his Empire... and New Canon makes him WORSE at it

Dark Empire Palpy had his whole Deep Core Byss Legions 'Cyborg soldiers, Dark side Elite , Plenty of custom over the top weapons and the Galaxy Gun

and Palpy made sure to get all the Imperials into one army going on one massive counter attack to the NR before Announcing his comeback

New Canon Palpy his Fleet is still constructing when he does his "I'M BACK"

Praise be to the absolute Queen
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#21095: Jul 4th 2022 at 10:43:36 AM

[up]

Nevermind that the whole "Palpatine was preparing for the Vong" thing becomes even sillier when you recall that we've already HAD an example of what Palpatine would do when encountering an extragalactic empire in Legends.

In The Truce at Bakura it is revealed that the reason the Ssi-ruuk are trying to invade Bakura in the first place is because a long time ago they had made a deal with Palpatine - he'd supply them with entechment victims and they would in turn supply him with some of their technology.

But then Palpatine died relatively shortly before their expeditionary force reached Imperial territory, so they considered the deal to be void and decided to just start taking over Bakura and potentially other systems for themselves.

This is what Palpatine would do when meeting another empire - he'd sacrifice a bunch of innocent people to strengthen his own position even more.

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Jul 4th 2022 at 7:43:57 PM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21096: Jul 4th 2022 at 11:00:23 AM

Note: Thrawn's faction also did jack savit during the Yuzzhan Vong war.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#21097: Jul 4th 2022 at 11:17:18 AM

[up]

Hadn't the Empire of the Hand merged into the Chiss Ascendancy by that point? I vaguely remember Chiss forces being involved on some fronts.

Edited by DrunkenNordmann on Jul 4th 2022 at 8:39:17 PM

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
FrozenWolf2 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#21098: Jul 4th 2022 at 11:23:00 AM

Technically the Chiss did exactly as they were gonna do if the Empire was still around

Let the Vong and the Empire go at it and see who won. They only change plans when the GA came knocking for unified military attack on all fronts and the Chiss realized They were Next on the hit list after the Imps

that and the Chiss did create Alpha Red

though as Wedge put it when the Chiss threw it out as a option to aid in their counter offensive push to retake Coruscant and end the war

"Genocide is what the Emperor did. It's what the Yuuzhan Vong do. It shouldn't be what we do. If it is, I'm fighting for the wrong cause."

granted The Chiss respect the vote to not use it but being the logical ones they point out that the offensive without Alpha Red doing the heavy lifting is gonna double/triple the death toll just getting to Coruscant

and then all the Vong book it to Coruscant for the Largest battle in galactic history

[up] Pretty much by the Vong war the Empire of the Hand and the Chiss were pretty much one faction

Edited by FrozenWolf2 on Jul 4th 2022 at 1:23:54 PM

Praise be to the absolute Queen
Avenger09 Since: May, 2014
#21099: Jul 4th 2022 at 11:38:55 AM

Palpatine was more of a Richard Nixon figure than an Adolf Hitler/Julius Caesar/Napoleon. He was legitimately elected into a corrupt Republic, promising reform. Then he became corrupt, declared himself Emperor, and is controlled by other greedy figures like Tarkin and Vader.
Then Lucas made a big change with the Emperor in TESB, revealing him to be an evil sorcerer who makes Vader kneel before him.

Retcons. The thing swaths of people on the internet love to complain about, yet has been a core aspect of all franchises since even their inception.

Edited by Avenger09 on Jul 4th 2022 at 7:45:49 PM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#21100: Jul 4th 2022 at 1:54:58 PM

It was less of a change as you might think as there always was an Evil Sorcerer/Palpatine figure.

It's just he was originally the Grand Vizier.

Emperor Palpatine isn't a new character so much as a Composite Character.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jul 4th 2022 at 1:55:14 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.

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