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Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of Star Wars movies and shows, and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

    Original text of OP 
Hello and welcome! This here thread is a spoiler-free zone! Because I didn't want to be tempted to read anymore spoilers for Rise of Skywalker!

Things that are acceptable here:

  • Trailers and trailer speculation
  • Discussion of the Star Wars movies and what we would like to see/not like to see in them.
  • Discussion about anything and everything Star Wars, just...no spoilers.

Things that are not-acceptable here:

  • Spoilers! No talking about the leaks!
  • Being mean! If you disagree with someone's opinion, try not to come across as mean or rude.

And here. we. go.

Rise of Skywalker Final Trailer:

Mr. Sunday's Ten Easy To Miss Details in Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (Final Trailer Breakdown):

This cool mashup of Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker and Avengers: Endgame trailers:

And also here's a trailer for The Mandalorian:

Edited by Mrph1 on Aug 31st 2024 at 8:23:29 PM

Demetrios Making darkness adorable since 1999 from Des Plaines, Illinois (unfortunately) Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Making darkness adorable since 1999
#20926: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:06:12 PM

True, but only the bad guys have it. It's the Warhammer 40,000 Universe you'd want to avoid in that case, since most of the factions in that game destroy planets on a regular basis. x_x tongue

Come on! Let's bless them all until we get fershnickered!
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20927: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:07:21 PM

I still argue that the reason the Force itself went so far as to create a Chosen One to stop the Sith was because of Planet Killer technology. With Planet Killer weapons, the Sith had become an existential threat to all life in the Galaxy, and the Force is fueled by life. Note that Anakin came into the picture not long before the Sith started making plans for the first Death Star (we saw the first schematics for it in Attack of the Clones).

Especially since the Sith just kept escalating. First it was a Death Star. Then it was another Death Star. Then it was a planet converted into a Planet Killer that could wipe out multiple planets at once. And finally it was an entire fleet of Planet Killer battleships.

[up]"Safer than the Warhammer 40k verse" isn't exactly a high bar.

Edited by M84 on Jun 16th 2022 at 2:09:19 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20928: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:10:20 PM

Plus like the Sith themselves are oppressive to life with their very corruption of the Force and use of the Dark Side. Even discounting the Empires and planet destroying tech, the point of the Sith is to gain power, and to use that power to hurt, kill and generally exert your will over others.

So of course destroying them would be beneficial to the Force.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20929: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:11:50 PM

Though I'm saying that normally the Will of the Force won't act so directly as to create a Chosen One like Anakin. The Sith developing weapons that could destroy entire planets in one fell swoop was a Godzilla Threshold moment for the Force.

Disgusted, but not surprised
uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#20930: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:13:12 PM

I think Star Wars should really move on from the planet killers. After we had a whole fleet of them the concept has kinda lost its impact.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20931: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:13:50 PM

If I'm right, and the dark side is actually sentient to any extent, would it feed on the death caused by all the planet killers?

There was all that talk about how darkness rises and light rises to meet it in The Force Awakens.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20932: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:19:10 PM

No, it's just self-destructive. Killing all life would end the Dark Side as well.

Disgusted, but not surprised
uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#20933: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:28:54 PM

I really find it annoying that because the Jedi and Sith are often treated synonymous with force users the common assumption is that a force user that is neither must be some kind of mid point between the two when there is no reason they couldn't just be something compleatly different.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20934: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:32:06 PM

I mean, there was that guy in Rebels who used both the Light and Dark, and basically didn't give a shit about what was happening in the Galaxy.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#20935: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:34:38 PM

If The Dark Side is a specific sapient being, then its goal is likely to fill the galaxy with hatred and suffering, not death specifically.

Though it's probably not accurate to say The Dark Side is a sapient being per se. It's probably more like "psionic haterade" mixed with crystal meth.

Leviticus 19:34
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20936: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:37:00 PM

As I noted earlier, the Dark Side of the Force tends to change a bit between writers, but I personally take the view that it IS sentient to a certain extent and able to guide the Sith.

In Tarkin for example, Palpatine and Vader note that the Dark Side is guiding them and is part of why Vader is working with Tarkin for the novel.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#20937: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:38:59 PM

[up][up] The Bendu. Who basically didn't want anything other than to get all these pesky kids off his lawn.

Though I guess there's an argument that it's the Will of the Force that Kanan and Ezra just happened to end up on his planet.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20938: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:44:33 PM

The Dark Side is basically the embodiment of every selfish, self-centered, shortsighted impulse in every living thing. It's inherently self-destructive.

Disgusted, but not surprised
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20939: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:54:31 PM

There's an interesting argument I remember from the SWTOR community and even youtubers like Lily Orchard like to espouse is that the emotions of the Dark Side like passion, anger, happiness, ETC are fundamental emotions of a human being and that to deny that is to become emotionless detached and unemphatic people like the Jedi.

That clip of Luminara callously dismissing collateral damage to a home of civilians is really popular for this sort of argument.

Thing is, you have Jedi like Obi-Wan who are capable of expressing emotions like as grief or anger, you can see this when he's fighting Anakin in EP 3. The difference is, that the Jedi don't let these emotions dominate them. This is the ideal way, Jedi can feel negative emotions, but they don't draw power from it or let it cloud their judgement. Not every Jedi can be like this, but the Jedi as a whole aren't fundamentally opposed to feeling anything at all.

Plus the Dark Side's very nature is to warp your justified emotions like hatred at slavery or injustice into a lust for power and desire to exert your power.

Like Yuthura Ban sought the Sith ways as a way to fight injustice in the galaxy, because she felt the Jedi were apathetic and not doing anything proactive to fight slavery that she suffered as a child, but as she grew immersed in the Sith ways, she desired power to hurt slavers and sought to destroy her compassion to gain that power and free herself from shackles of any weakness.

Then Revan points out without compassion would she care about slaves?

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20940: Jun 15th 2022 at 11:55:42 PM

Jedi can still feel those emotions. They just don't wallow in them or indulge them the way people like the Sith do.

Disgusted, but not surprised
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#20941: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:01:17 AM

They are stoics, meaning they are simply reserved.

Its a common foible for people to mistake reservedness for not feeling anything at all.

And it should bare repeating that they are monks, ascetism is a common practice.

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 16th 2022 at 12:03:44 PM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20942: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:12:33 AM

It's absurd since you see Jedi act emotional all the time in the movies and other media. They aren't unfeeling drones or anything like that.

Edited by M84 on Jun 17th 2022 at 3:12:49 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20943: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:22:55 AM

Well how else are we going to make the Sith look justified? sad

But yeah, basically these are arguments used by the more hardcore Dark Side and Sith lovers (like Lily Orchard) or people who misguidedly want to justify Gray Jedi.

Like there's a misconception that the Prequel Jedi council detachment and often callous judgements like dismissing kid Anakin is meant to be what the Jedi are. Missing that the Prequels show the decay and corruption of the Jedi, and why people like Obi-Wan were the ideal, not the exception.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#20944: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:24:43 AM

I think its due to people having just a hard time comprehending reserved characters and considering them boring because they aren't visibly emotional.

Also it could be people having a hard time comprehending the idea of a heroic organization with actual religious doctrines and rules.

Because the Jedi isn't just a generic hero organization, there is actual specific rules and conditions to follow.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#20945: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:36:45 AM

There is this attitude in certain parts of the fandon that if you are force sensitive but dont want to live your live dictated by dogmatic rules you have no choice but become a darksider. Wich is just absurd but I keep seeing people arguing it and posit some Sith, Jedi merger as a solution.

Edited by uncertanSearcher on Jun 16th 2022 at 9:39:05 PM

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#20946: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:40:30 AM

Heck Dooku just left the Order on peaceful terms, and nobody in the Order gave him shit for it. He was respected and his departure was considered to be a reminder that the Order wasn't perfect. It would be a while until he turned to the Sith.

Disgusted, but not surprised
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20947: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:45:09 AM

No wonder the Sith are mostly popular with edgelords and edgy teens/young adults.

Myself included.

But seriously, the same people who think the Jedi are boring because they have rules would look at the Sith and see them as cool freedom fighters who are rebelling against an uncaring Jedi order of Force users. Since they can embrace cool emotions like passion, anger and hatred.

Hell, this is the same sort of fanbase Kylo Ren gets. A character who was just so fundamentally a terrible person managed to get a majority of the fanbase swooning for him.

They want to be cool Sith without paying the price for power, like the constant backstabbing, looking like an ugly monster person, and generally not actually being fulfilled in life.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#20948: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:46:52 AM

I know Lucas has generally been on the stance that the Dark Side is an imbalance and not the yin to the light side's yang, but has he ever said that the Dark Side ever possessed a sentience akin to a God of Evil? I don't think he has

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#20949: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:56:09 AM

Well Lucas has always portrayed the Force as something alive, and that there are Sith characters that comment that the Dark Side communes with them.

And we also have an actual embodiment of the Dark Side, or whatever the hell the Son is.

So it's not hard to see it as something sentient to an extent.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#20950: Jun 16th 2022 at 12:59:11 AM

[up][up][up] I blame that on American's being generally anti-authority.

Which now that I think about it, I can't think of many heroic organizations that don't turn out corrupt with the hero rebelling or leaving.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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