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This is a thread to discuss those Administrivia pages in need of a little updating- you know the ones. The ones that still cite rules we've long since changed, or the ones that don't properly cite our current standards. Some of them are even scattered in Main/!

So, this is the place to take those pages and fix them up with the help of the community.

For a list of current projects, see Outdated Pages.

Edited by WarJay77 on Nov 21st 2020 at 8:29:04 AM

Kevjro7 Premature Discharge
Premature Discharge
Dec 16th 2020 at 4:51:04 PM

Done. Now how should we update Up for Grabs to address drafts of temporarily suspended sponsors?

WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Dec 16th 2020 at 5:12:02 PM

Hmm. I'm just gonna break down each paragraph and see what we can rework, and we can find a place to add that part in:

In general, Trope Launch Pad items that are still getting regular attention from the person who initially proposed them ("original poster" or "OP") should not be significantly edited or launched by someone else without the OP's permission. This is because, while Trope Launch Pad items (like ordinary wiki articles) are technically free for any registered user to edit, they're also somewhat like a forum/discussion system, where you shouldn't edit someone else's comments at all.

Mostly good, but the last sentence is throwing me off. It's either a relic from when you could edit other people's comments, or is implying that it's bad to change examples someone else wrote. Either way it makes no sense- drafts aren't comments.

The Up For Grabs tag indicates that OP doesn't care if someone else takes sponsorship of their draft.

Misleading. Up For Grabs is used to indicate that a draft is sponsorless and adoptable- not that the OP doesn't "care" if someone else steals it from them.

It is also a common faux-pas to start a new Trope Launch Pad entry with the Up for Grabs tag. If you're in a rush to get your new trope out to launch, chances are you're overlooking something important in the process (maybe it Needs a Better Name, or Yes, We Do Have This One), which is an almost guaranteed way to get your trope pulled over in the Trope Repair Shop for reworking. You'll save the Repair Shop some trouble if you focus on writing a solid trope definition first; it's better to get a trope launched in good condition (no matter how long that takes) than it is to get it launched quickly.

True, but goes into a weird tangent that has nothing to do with UFG. Adding that tag first thing has nothing to do with rushing the process- it's about being lazy or unwilling to do the work on it.

Trope Launch Pad Drafts are automatically considered Up For Grabs after at least two months of inactivity by the OP (original poster). The YKTTW Salvage List is a good tool to help you find these.

Here's where we can add the "suspension" thing. Also, is the Salvage List even still a thing? Maybe we can plug the Adoption Drive instead for a list of "ready to grab" drafts?

Be aware that "Up For Grabs" does not mean "free to launch"—launching a draft, even one without a sponsor, without explicitly taking sponsorship yourself and announcing intent is called "rogue launching". Rogue launching is super rude, and it will get you suspended immediately.

[awesome]

When you take sponsorship of a draft, you need to rekindle discussion and resolve any lingering issues the previous sponsor didn't take care of—especially if the draft has been abandoned for significantly longer than the standard two months. While sponsors do occasionally abandon perfectly launchable drafts, it is far more common for an abandoned draft to need substantial work before it's ready.

This paragraph is also fine.


In all? This page needs serious rewriting for clarity and usefulness in addition to the "suspension" detail.

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
LaundryPizza03 Maintenance? from Texas
Maintenance?
Dec 16th 2020 at 5:52:15 PM

Image Pickin' should be moved to Administrivia namespace.

Edited by LaundryPizza03 on Dec 16th 2020 at 7:52:20 AM

NRLEP candidates * ColorTropesCleanup
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Dec 17th 2020 at 2:08:12 AM

[up]I previously mentioned that, but either the sandbox didn't exist at the time, or it did and I just forgot to add it.

Edit: Added Blue Link and Red Link to the sandbox. I put them on one bullet point since their subjects are closely related. I also put Single-Issue Wonk on there since it was brought up at one point, but discussion didn't get far (I remember discussing an offsite example with the Wikipedia editor who went around making small edits that did nothing but replace "comprised of" with "composed of").

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 17th 2020 at 11:21:55 AM

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
Kevjro7 Premature Discharge
Premature Discharge
Dec 17th 2020 at 12:16:15 PM

[up][up][up] My thoughts:

Mostly good, but the last sentence is throwing me off. It's either a relic from when you could edit other people's comments, or is implying that it's bad to change examples someone else wrote. Either way it makes no sense- drafts aren't comments.
I can think of 2 explanations:
  • The "View Markup" option wasn't always available on TLP, so granting the ability to edit other comments was the only way to copy the example formatting.
  • It's meant to say you shouldn't edit TLP drafts you aren't the sponsor of.
If it's the first explanation, we should cut it for being obsolete; if it's the second, it's a separate matter that belongs on TLP Guidelines. And it already is on there. Either way, this should be cut from UFG.
Misleading. Up For Grabs is used to indicate that a draft is sponsorless and adoptable- not that the OP doesn't "care" if someone else steals it from them.
Here's a rewrite: The Up For Grabs tag indicates that a draft is sponsorless, making it eligible for adoption.
True, but goes into a weird tangent that has nothing to do with UFG. Adding that tag first thing has nothing to do with rushing the process- it's about being lazy or unwilling to do the work on it.
If the tangent has nothing to do with UFG, it should be cut. And is the "tangent" the second and third sentences, or just the third sentence? Also, I think this advice belongs on a different page.
Here's where we can add the "suspension" thing.
Before we add the suspension info, we should decide when drafts of suspended sponsors become UFG. Should it be 2 months like with unsuspended sponsors? Or should the timeframe be shorter? Or longer? While mentioning that sponsors who are permanently banned (from TLP) makes their drafts automatically UFG might be noteworthy, that information seems so obvious that I think having it on the page is redundant.

WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Dec 17th 2020 at 1:52:26 PM

I think it should be the two-month wait period, like any other draft, though perhaps more restricted as the actual sponsor might return and want to continue working on it and shouldn't be barred from that. Bit different than them just vanishing into the aether.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 17th 2020 at 4:52:49 AM

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Dec 20th 2020 at 6:15:24 PM

If we move Main.Image Pickin to Administrivia.Image Pickin, would we end up cutting the old location? While the sidebar still links to Main.Word Cruft despite the page being moved to Administrivia.Word Cruft (hence why Main.Word Cruft was kept as a redirect), the sidebar's link to Image Pickin' links directly to the forum instead of the wiki page about it (the same is true for the Trope Repair Shop link, whose wiki page is already in Administrivia/).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 20th 2020 at 8:15:57 AM

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Dec 26th 2020 at 4:11:12 PM

I want to do a run-through updating of How to Do a Wick Check. Some of it seems outdated, to the point of either being no longer true, or just being a little odd or uncommon. Plus, people keep having questions about how to get the random selection.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 26th 2020 at 7:14:20 AM

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Dec 27th 2020 at 4:53:17 PM

[up]It doesn't really address how to check for anything other than misuse, like whether something is a duplicate, Chairs, a source of complaining, or better suited to Useful Notes. In the case of duplicates, the now-closed Duplicate Trope thread for Major Injury Underreaction had wick checks that discovered that that trope wasn't actually a duplicate, but I Ain't Got Time to Bleed (or Not Noticing The Pain as it's now called), which Major Injury Underreaction was initially claimed to be redundant with, was heavily misused and needed a new name.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 27th 2020 at 6:54:40 AM

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Dec 27th 2020 at 4:54:22 PM

It barely even addresses misuse at all in the "things to look out for" section.

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Dec 27th 2020 at 4:56:55 PM

Even changing the "Does the trope actually apply to the character/situation described?" bullet point to reference and link to Square Peg, Round Trope would slightly improve it by making it more clear that that bullet point is referring to misuse, but that's just one bullet point.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 27th 2020 at 6:59:47 AM

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Dec 27th 2020 at 5:02:07 PM

Yeah, it should also mention things like:

  • Describing the title, but not the trope itself
  • The kind of wiki pages it's being used on (YMMV, Main, Trivia, etc)
  • If the page is soft-split, are the wicks able to be crosswicked back?

And a greater explanation for how the randomization can occur should reference the ways people do it, such as:

  • Generating an integer list
  • Randomizing the wick list itself
  • Scrolling up and down the page randomly

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Dec 30th 2020 at 2:47:52 AM

I've been meaning to bring this to this thread for a while (but kept forgetting to, despite posting about it elsewhere), but should Sandbox.Trope Idea Salvage Yard be moved to Administrivia.Trope Idea Salvage Yard, similarly to what was done with Tropes Needing TRS? Lately, it's become a viable alternative to sending tropes back to TLP (in the case that either a sponsor isn't found, or there's no draft to unlaunch it to).

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
LaundryPizza03 Maintenance? from Texas
Maintenance?
Jan 1st 2021 at 9:07:04 PM

[up] I believe I supported this proposition elsewhere, but I forgot where.

NRLEP candidates * ColorTropesCleanup
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Jan 2nd 2021 at 7:46:38 AM

[up]Probably the TRS meta thread, which I'm pretty sure is where I first brought it up.

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Jan 2nd 2021 at 10:18:21 AM

I brought it up before that at the discard thread, but nobody responded.

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
Kevjro7 Premature Discharge
Premature Discharge
Jan 5th 2021 at 4:17:20 PM

Getting back to Up for Grabs addressing drafts of suspended sponsors, one troper is going to be suspended from TLP "for now." If the mods chose to suspend a sponsor from TLP for an extended period, how should UFG address that? Here is the draft with that suspended sponsor.

Edited by Kevjro7 on Jan 6th 2021 at 10:06:04 AM

ccorb She/her or They/them from the Sol Dimension Relationship Status: It's not my fault I'm not popular!
She/her or They/them
Jan 6th 2021 at 6:02:15 AM

I remember one draft where the original sponsor was permabanned and someone volunteered to adopt it.

Looking forward to perhaps my first CM EP soon
Piterpicher from Poland, for real Relationship Status: Awaiting my mail-order bride
Jan 6th 2021 at 6:31:45 AM

Christmas Every Day was one of them. It should definitely be mentioned on Up for Grabs that the draft automatically falls under this if the sponsor is permabanned or a ban evader. If they're only suspended temporarily, I feel like standard rules should apply as you don't know when exactly they'll be unsuspended.

Edited by Piterpicher on Jan 6th 2021 at 3:34:26 PM

It's the final year of school (then I plan to take a gap year) and exams are looking on the horizon, so I may not be as active.
crazysamaritan Could we just... not have Death anymore? from Lupin III
Could we just... not have Death anymore?
Jan 6th 2021 at 6:34:43 AM

Officially suspended from TLP "for now" is essentially permabanned, as they're not likely to get their TLP suspension released until at least a year, although sending a polite PM is still a good idea.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
WarJay77 It takes a lot to make a stew... from The Void Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It takes a lot to make a stew...
Jan 6th 2021 at 6:48:11 AM

Yeah, if the sponsor is still around and has a shot of getting privileges back, it's impolite to just immediately grab their draft.

Wick Check Project Official Sandbox (TM)
GastonRabbit A real nowhere man from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Jan 8th 2021 at 5:02:27 AM

Shouldn't Parabombing be in Administrivia since it refers to a type of natter? Also, I don't get why Right Parenthesis Deficit Disorder is a redirect. That sounds more like when someone starts to type text in parentheses, but neglects to add a closing parenthesis after typing it.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jan 8th 2021 at 7:02:57 AM

"Want to be a winner is you?" —Earl (Pokémon Gold and Silver)
Piterpicher from Poland, for real Relationship Status: Awaiting my mail-order bride
Jan 8th 2021 at 5:30:01 AM

It IS under Wiki Tropes so it can, in theory, belong in the Main/ namespace, but I agree that redirect sounds misleading.

It's the final year of school (then I plan to take a gap year) and exams are looking on the horizon, so I may not be as active.
wingedcatgirl Watch that pink smoke swooce right in from The Murder-Free Hotel
Watch that pink smoke swooce right in
Jan 8th 2021 at 7:37:20 AM

The redirect was added in 2013 with no edit reason.

Sylvi& | it/they/she | plural trans catgirl | Trouble Cube | avatar by Madame Butterfly Knife
bwburke94 Ultimate ??? from Ultimate Academy for Gifted Juveniles Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Ultimate ???
Jan 8th 2021 at 2:00:55 PM

That redirect seems cutlist-worthy; it doesn't describe the trope and has never been used.

NOT up to date on RWBY Volume 8, and will not be until early April 2021 unless this sig changes.

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