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GastonRabbit The Duck Knight from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Duck Knight
Aug 23rd 2019 at 1:29:07 AM

[up]Re: #2 and #3: Webcomics and most fan works are a subset of Web Original,note  and DarthWiki.Web Original is in the Permanent Red Link Club since it was too Flame Bait-y even for Darth Wiki (DarthWiki.Fanfic had that problem as well, but Content Policy violations were also a big factor), so I wouldn't object to cutting those categories if it turns out they're attracting the same problems. The page for webcomics is relatively small, and it looks like minor edits outnumber full additions and removals of examples in the recent edit history, so maybe that one's fine.

Edit: Noting that awesomereesee (who ended up being bounced after repeated edit wars) re-added a Horrible.Webcomics entry that was previously deleted. The removal was accompanied by an edit reason (though I'm not sure if there was any actual discussion; it wasn't brought up in this thread), but the re-addition wasn't.

Edit: The third example on Horrible.Webcomics (Chaos Diamonds 3) goes into the creator's personal life, discussing abusive relationships. That isn't kosher, right?

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 23rd 2019 at 6:01:38 AM

"Guess what? You got it for free. Are you proud of yourself?"
Irene Drathe Perrywinkle from Friend Code: 1203-9265-8784 and 4571-1389-1915 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Drathe Perrywinkle
Aug 23rd 2019 at 2:59:38 AM

Hacks are in a weird spot. A big issue is that they are of games that can sometimes be already programmed poorly. Trying to redo it is not remotely easy. This means that the only way to confirm if it was poorly made due to the hack creator alone is to double check it. This feels like they're too borderline and not entirely their fault when it comes to quality. There are some obvious bullshit that can relate to Kaizo stuff, so that might be worth keeping. There's thousands of poorly made hacks to begin with, and researching how it was developed to get a fair estimate of the situation doesn't help. I'm not sure, however, if this should be a reason to remove one. But I feel like this makes it so there's way too many to count as is.

Fangames can depend. Zelda Classic is a good program, but can be confusing for newer Quest creators, or any who hasn't taken a school in Video Game creation. Certain types of programming you need to ensure stuff doesn't break is hardly easy. Basic stuff like "why did I start here?!" can be chalked up to lack of programming knowledge, whereas basic game balance is very easy to figure out(hit points an enemy has is super easy to program to begin with. Stuff like their hitboxes and sprites are a bit more difficult, especially the sprites).

I'm for removing hacks due to complications with making them work as is enough where they can even have a chance of making the project high quality being very low. Fangames however should vary. You either have ones used with a program, or you have ones made from scratch. We'd have to go over each example alone. It's worth noting that in most of these cases, they aren't made by normal companies(or even normal Indies), but just a random fan who don't know what the hell they're doing half the time. That makes it feel like they're already going to have trouble keeping up with quality anyway.

I'm not sure the best way to explain it; it's not an exact case of notability. It feels akin to the fanfic problem. Some just don't know how to write and they aren't going to be high-level professional writers or even good with grammar alone. There's just too many who never finish, etc.

Omega Psycho Rangers Quest 64 Discord(very much safe for work)
Brainulator9 Regular garden-variety troper. from US Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Regular garden-variety troper.
Aug 23rd 2019 at 4:57:17 AM

My opinion is that homebrew or other user-generated content has a much lower bar for "uniquely and utterly horrible" than other mediums.

You don't mean no-nothing at all to me...
GastonRabbit The Duck Knight from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Aug 23rd 2019 at 7:01:09 AM

[up][up]Agreed. OTOH the fanfics page was demonstrably a mess even without the content policy issue - is that actually a case with any of this other stuff?

Pemulis_128 A 20th Century Boy from Teleporting behind you Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
A 20th Century Boy
Aug 24th 2019 at 3:59:01 AM

I would like to add an entry here for the 2004 live-action movie of Devilman. The movie is infamous for being one of the worst live-action manga/anime adaptations even by the notoriously low standards of such films, boasting a dismal 4/10 on IMDb, winning an “award” for Worst Movie of 2004, and topping a poll as the worst Japanese movie of the 2000s.The movie is so reviled that fans of the franchise in Japan have held memorials mourning the film’s release on the anniversary of its release.

Having seen the film for myself recently, I can confirm that it is quite dreadful. The costumes and special effects are poor, the fight scenes are dull and poorly choreographed, the plot is incoherent due to cramming the entire five volume series into two hours, the pacing is a mess (for instance, it takes ten minutes for the main plot to even begin and the battle with Jinmen is over in less than two minutes), sets are constantly reused for several locations, and the acting is wooden and lifeless. Between both my impressions of the film and the poor reception by critics and audiences alike, I personally think it easily qualifies as horrible. But what do you guys think?

Edited by Pemulis_128 on Aug 24th 2019 at 8:14:51 AM

razorrozar7 I am having much enjoyment! from Oregon Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
I am having much enjoyment!
Aug 24th 2019 at 4:34:48 AM

looks good to me. 4/10 is a little high for SBIH, but im not sure whether imdb generally uses the Four Point Scale. either way, judging by audience response to it as you've laid out, it seems to qualify.

I'm Chloe. I fix things. Only you can prevent ZCEs.
GastonRabbit The Duck Knight from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Duck Knight
Aug 24th 2019 at 5:36:21 PM

Just a heads up, if we need crowners for what to do with the categories that were discussed recently (unless that needs a full-fledged TRS decision), crowners are working again.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 24th 2019 at 7:38:17 AM

"Guess what? You got it for free. Are you proud of yourself?"
Irene Drathe Perrywinkle from Friend Code: 1203-9265-8784 and 4571-1389-1915 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Drathe Perrywinkle
Aug 24th 2019 at 5:38:40 PM

Alright, good to know. Thank you for the information. :)

Omega Psycho Rangers Quest 64 Discord(very much safe for work)
TheAlmightyKingPrawn Chonky Pallas Kitty from Surrounding the mind of A Self Called Nowhere Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Chonky Pallas Kitty
Aug 24th 2019 at 7:12:36 PM

Off-topic cause I don't know how to start a thread, but this needs A LOT of cleanup. For starters, should be moved to Advertising instead of "Commercials". Lots of ZCE, This Troper, and dead links too.

Life is like a hurricane.
Aug 24th 2019 at 9:23:30 PM

Would Batman Dark Tomorrow for the Gamecube and Xbox count? It got lots of negative reviews and the only thing that was praised was its accuracy to the comics. The game itself reeks of The Problem with Licensed Games and had an internet review recently. It was panned for repetitive buggy gameplay and Camera Screw along with mediocre graphics and Guide Dang It! moment regarding the ending. All the bosses are an Anti-Climax Boss except the Final Boss. It's considered better than the Batman and Robin game but possibly worse than Batman Forever for the SNES and Genesis.

Here's the review https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4Mhv5CBVJ4 Its Wikipedia article that lists its abysmal reception. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_Dark_Tomorrow

I was told to ask here. Also glad we have this thread.

Edited by Idisagree on Aug 24th 2019 at 10:42:26 AM

TalesofUnder Yup. It’s this avatar again. from Huh huh tandy gardens’s initials are “tg” Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Yup. It’s this avatar again.
Aug 25th 2019 at 12:12:31 PM

Sounds fine to me.

Ich bin ein donut.
chasemaddigan This is Unicorn!
This is Unicorn!
Aug 25th 2019 at 3:25:06 PM

I found this entry on the YMMV page for Batman Dark Tomorrow though:

  • Enjoy the Story, Skip the Game: Consensus is that the gameplay is rather bad, but the cutscenes and story themselves are praised as being very faithful to the tone of the Batman mythos.

I haven't seen any reviews, but if the story is praised for a video game, does it really qualify as SBIH? I'm not familiar with the game, so I wouldn't know.

Pemulis_128 A 20th Century Boy from Teleporting behind you Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
A 20th Century Boy
Aug 25th 2019 at 4:00:00 PM

While the reviews did praise the story for the game, they still gave extremely low scores to it because everything else in the game was awful.

WarJay77 The googly-eyed monstrosity from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
The googly-eyed monstrosity
Aug 25th 2019 at 4:06:57 PM

Isn't SBIH for works irredeemable, though? A good story is a redeeming quality.

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
GastonRabbit The Duck Knight from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Duck Knight
Aug 25th 2019 at 6:52:31 PM

[up]I'm pretty sure that's true, and as previously mentioned, Enjoy the Story, Skip the Game is already listed on the game's YMMV page.

Critical Dissonance might apply if reviewers gave it low scores, but others still liked at least part of it. I suppose that depends on whether non-reviewers think the story is enough of a redeeming factor, though.

Edit: Just for clarification, I've never played that game, so I'm just going by what's been posted in this thread.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 25th 2019 at 8:58:06 AM

"Guess what? You got it for free. Are you proud of yourself?"
Aug 27th 2019 at 12:14:52 AM

Over on Horrible.Comic Books, I found this:

"DC Challenge was an interesting concept — a 12-issue miniseries in which teams of people who normally didn't work together would take turns doing stories which could not prominently feature characters they normally worked on, each issue setting up a cliffhanger that the next team would have to solve in the next issue. Unfortunately, Round Robin stories are hard enough to manage as fanwork. Doing this professionally would've been difficult, so it wasn't. This quickly degenerated into a confusing mess. By the end, major plot threads had been dropped completely and nobody was quite sure what was going on — not even the editors at DC."

It doesn't really explain why it's bad, let alone universally hated, and websites like CBR and iFanboy have remembered it fondly, or at least as So Bad, It's Good.

Edited by lalalei2001 on Aug 27th 2019 at 12:22:08 PM

nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Aug 27th 2019 at 1:02:50 AM

[up]Speaking only for myself, those articles certainly sell me on cutting it. It sounds hilariously bizarre, not horrible.

Aug 27th 2019 at 7:43:10 PM

Horrible.Game Mods also has a lot of creator-bashing.

Aug 27th 2019 at 9:54:20 PM

[up] Rewrite the examples that have this problem to be more about the mods themselves and add a commented-out note for editors to not use the page for bashing the creators themselves.

Edited by OldLadyNightMan on Aug 27th 2019 at 12:54:43 PM

Aug 29th 2019 at 6:31:01 PM

A possible candidate for the advertising page: the NBA 2K20 myTeam trailer, which currently has a 190 to 22,000 like/dislike ratio on YouTube. Despite being an ad for a basketball game, there is very little footage of basketball; instead, the focus is on the various RNG-based reward mechanics such as card packs, and many of which are gambling-themed (including a slot machine, pachinko, and roulette), which is a pretty weird move considering how the Loot Box mechanic has been under fire for being compared to gambling aimed at minors. (though apparently, the casino-style games are not actually pay-to-play, it's a puzzling decision regardless due to the controversy). In the corner are clips of players celebrating, presumably as they get lucky pulls, though closer inspection reveals that their PS4 controllers seem to be turned off due to the light bar not being on, meaning that they actually just asked actors to pretend to cheer, then superimposed that with footage of rigged spins.

Edited by Zuxtron on Aug 29th 2019 at 9:34:28 AM

TheAlmightyKingPrawn Chonky Pallas Kitty from Surrounding the mind of A Self Called Nowhere Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Chonky Pallas Kitty
Aug 29th 2019 at 6:44:57 PM

[up] Yikes! A dislike ratio like that definitely needs to be considered. Do your thing.

Life is like a hurricane.
razorrozar7 I am having much enjoyment! from Oregon Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
I am having much enjoyment!
Aug 29th 2019 at 6:49:40 PM

i think it falls under the Speculative Troping rule for now, though. the backlash may cause them to change or remove the mechanics, and then the reception would change.

e: oh, you're putting the trailer on the ad page. i misread. in that case, i think it fits. although if the game is later changed, that should be noted imo.

Edited by razorrozar7 on Aug 29th 2019 at 6:56:10 AM

I'm Chloe. I fix things. Only you can prevent ZCEs.
WarJay77 The googly-eyed monstrosity from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
The googly-eyed monstrosity
Aug 29th 2019 at 6:53:50 PM

There's also an addition I'd like to make, in the film's section:

  • Five Across The Eyes attempts to be a found-footage horror flick of a group of girls being harassed and tortured by a crazy woman. What it actually is, is a movie shot on someone's VHS camera, where we're stuck listening to a bunch of stupid, bratty, teenage girls screech and argue the entire time while driving, until they get attacked, in which case they cry and screech. It's so dark and low-quality that almost nothing can be seen at times, and there are no scene changes- we're just stuck watching the entire car-ride. With a 15% on Rotten Tomatoes and a 2.6 on IMDB, this "film" is more of an endurance test than anything. Phelous suffers through it here.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 29th 2019 at 9:57:29 AM

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
Aug 29th 2019 at 6:55:34 PM

[up][up] The example is about the ad, not the game. If the game ends up being significantly changed in response to the trailer's poor reception, that would only be further evidence that it's a bad trailer.


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