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So Bad It's Horrible Cleanup

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So Bad, It's Horrible is one of the more flame-bait-y parts of the site, so a cleanup thread is needed to ensure that works aren't added simply because someone doesn't like them.

If you want to list a work under this, keep the following in mind:

  • The work must have very few fans or defenders (both genuine and ironic). It should fail to appeal to any type of audience.
  • Being offensive in its subject matter isn't enough.
  • It isn't horrible just because a certain critic disliked it, though their reviews can be used as sources and citations.
  • The work should have notably poor reviews (e.g., less than 3/10 on IMDb, or single digit scores on Rotten Tomatoes)
  • For a Moral Substitute to qualify, it cannot even appeal to its target demographic.
  • Please be polite while writing and as much as possible, avoid falling into Complaining About Shows You Don't Like. Instead, focus on explaining why the work is horrible.

In addition, per No Recent Examples, Please!, a work must be at least one month old before it can be added, to prevent knee-jerk reactions.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Oct 6th 2024 at 3:34:45 AM

FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3701: Nov 16th 2021 at 12:46:15 PM

[up][up] Done.

Also, should we have the Lord of the Rings musical in Horrible.Theatre? It was nominated for the Laurence Olivier Award for Best New Musical.

mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#3702: Nov 16th 2021 at 1:04:03 PM

[up] That does seem to work against it, unless it's a Music situation where there wasn't a lot of competition and it received a big backlash for being nominated.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3703: Nov 16th 2021 at 1:26:29 PM

[up] I mean... they chose to nominate it when not having done so would've been an option (the Tony Awards did it for their latest ceremony for the Percy Jackson musical). It also went toe-to-toe with the likes of Hairspray, Parade and The Drowsy Chaperone.

Idisagree Since: Jun, 2011
#3704: Nov 16th 2021 at 5:03:02 PM

[up] I've also seen mentions of that musical on one of the Awesome Music pages. Nothing in the entry criticizes the music. Between that and being nominated for an award, I'd say it might be worth removing.

Also I thought we all agreed to cut Smithy Boy. The entry sounds more like kids being kids than serious music.

Edited by Idisagree on Nov 16th 2021 at 5:05:50 AM

FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3705: Nov 16th 2021 at 6:35:06 PM

[up] I'd already gone ahead with cutting those two Music entries hours ago. Are you implying that you'd discussed cutting them before, but that never went anywhere?

I'll wait for more consensus on the LOTR musical.

randomtroper89 from The Fire Nation Since: Nov, 2010
#3706: Nov 16th 2021 at 11:14:38 PM

  • Inhumans was the pet project of controversial Marvel executive Ike Perlmutter, who saw the characters primarily as a means to devalue the X-Men IP (the live-action film rights of which were held by 20th Century Fox before that studio was sold to Disney and ended in 2020). Unfortunately, Inhumans became the very first entry in the seemingly-untouchable Marvel Cinematic Universe to be universally despised by those that saw it. Its problems included an abrupt return to a Movie Superheroes Wear Black aesthetic (after the MCU had done so much to make comic-accurate visuals acceptable onscreen); recurring Special Effect Failures in spite of a budget reportedly larger than any other Marvel series; and most of all, some of the most shameless Protagonist-Centered Morality in recent memory: The Designated Heroes are the ruling family of an Inhuman colony on the moon, who enforce an oppressive caste system that condemns those born with less-than-flashy superpowers to backbreaking labor while the chosen few live in luxury. The Designated Villain Maximus is a victim of the caste system and wants it gone, but we're supposed to root against him because of this, not despite this like the wider MCU's similar but far more competently executed Well-Intentioned Extremist villains. Instead of giving more heroic traits to the Inhumans and/or having them acknowledge that the caste system is a bad thing, the show pins several villainous acts on Maximus; thus, Rooting for the Empire is pointless when everyone is terrible. All those weaknesses together make up for the nadir of an already controversial comic book franchise, which only sank the property into irrelevance. Long story short, Inhumans was cancelled after one season, and following the billion-dollar successes of Black Panther (2018) and Captain Marvel (2019),note  the Inhumans were devalued in the comics and Perlmutter was demoted, with Disney’s eventual purchase of Fox rendering his efforts to make the Inhumans a household name All for Nothing. The series also marked the beginning of the end for Marvel Television and its contributions to the MCU, which had tangential connections to the films at best, with their various series (with the exception of Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D., which lasted an extra year to have a proper Grand Finale) coming to an abrupt end over the next two years as Disney prepared to instead focus on producing MCU series for their forthcoming streaming service Disney+ that directly tied into the films, before being folded into Marvel Studios, effectively ending Marvel Entertainment's control over their eponymous media except for merchandising.note  Even after the merge, Inhumans continues to haunt the MCU; Chloé Zhao insisted on filming Eternals in beautiful locations, and Marvel Studios was more than happy to indulge her, but cowriter Kaz Firpo has reported being told that Hawaii was off-limits because Inhumans happened to be the first MCU work to be primarily set there, meaning Marvel Studios is effectively Persona Non Grata in the state.

Let's try this instead, focusing on the show itself

  • Inhumans was the pet project of controversial Marvel executive Ike Perlmutter. Unfortunately, it became the very first entry in the seemingly-untouchable Marvel Cinematic Universe to be universally despised by those that saw it. Its problems included an abrupt return to a Movie Superheroes Wear Black aesthetic (after the MCU had done so much to make comic-accurate visuals acceptable onscreen); recurring Special Effect Failures in spite of a budget reportedly larger than any other Marvel series; and most of all, some of the most shameless Protagonist-Centered Morality in recent memory: The Designated Heroes are the ruling family of an Inhuman colony on the moon, who enforce an oppressive caste system that condemns those born with less-than-flashy superpowers to backbreaking labor while the chosen few live in luxury. The Designated Villain Maximus is a victim of the caste system and wants it gone, but we're supposed to root against him because of this. Instead of giving more heroic traits to the Inhumans and/or having them acknowledge that the caste system is a bad thing, the show pins several villainous acts on Maximus; thus, Rooting for the Empire is pointless when everyone is terrible. All those weaknesses together make up for the nadir of an already controversial comic book franchise, which only sank the property into irrelevance. Long story short, Inhumans was cancelled after one season, the Inhumans were devalued in the comics, and series also marked the beginning of the end for Marvel Television and its contributions to the MCU.

Edited by randomtroper89 on Nov 16th 2021 at 1:19:38 PM

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#3707: Nov 18th 2021 at 9:04:29 AM

About the Lord of the Rings musical, I did hear that the West End version was much more polished than the original Canadian version.

FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3708: Nov 18th 2021 at 10:19:48 AM

[up] Hm, maybe the entry could be rewritten to address this.

mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#3709: Nov 18th 2021 at 1:56:24 PM

Is it like Carrie where only certain older versions count as Horrible? Which version was the nominated one?

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3710: Nov 18th 2021 at 3:28:11 PM

[up] The West End one. I don't think Canada has a major theatre award, unlike USA or UK.

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#3711: Nov 18th 2021 at 8:49:14 PM

[up]Canadian here. Canada indeed does not have a major theatre award. Canadian theatre awards are generally for performances in specific cities.

For example, the Dora Award is for best performances in Toronto. Yes, the Dora Award is considered the most prestigious theatre award in Canada.

Kirby is awesome.
MissConduct (Septatroper)
#3712: Nov 19th 2021 at 7:13:55 AM

I'd vote to remove the LOTR musical entry, though do check to see if it would belong on Troubled Production.

FernandoLemon Since: Aug, 2015
#3713: Nov 19th 2021 at 7:32:54 AM

[up][up] The others work the same. The Tony (the most prestigious in the USA) is for performances in Broadway, and the Laurence-Olivier (in the UK) is for performances in the West End.

MurlocAggroB from the second-most ridiculous province of Canada Since: May, 2015
#3714: Nov 19th 2021 at 9:42:51 AM

Since no one else mentioned it, the Inhumans rewrite looks good [tup]

regulation pigeon
MathsAngelicVersion Ambassador of Eurogames and Touhou Music from Gensokyo Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Ambassador of Eurogames and Touhou Music
#3715: Nov 23rd 2021 at 9:57:17 AM

I'd like to nominate War of the Spark: Forsaken. Even disregarding the controversy over Chandra's bisexuality being retconned, it was very poorly received in the Magic community. The only thing going against its inclusion is the 3.5 star rating on Amazon, but even then the top reviews are overwhelmingly negative.

  • The Magic: The Gathering novel War of the Spark: Forsaken by Greg Weisman was Overshadowed by Controversy for its decision to retcon Chandra's bisexuality, but even disregarding that, the book is just bad. The writing is shoddy and juvenile, the Character Development that several main characters had undergone is ignored, the long-anticipated romantic relationship between Jace and Vraska ends shortly after it began, the decade-long Chain Veil story arc is concluded in an anticlimactic way that provides no resolution, a major character is killed off-screen by a minor, newly-introduced character, and the story breaks a fundamental rule of Magic lore by giving Kaya the ability to transport people to other planes with her. The Professor, an English major and a well-respected member of the Magic community, rips it apart here.

If the above is too spoiler-y:

  • The Magic: The Gathering novel War of the Spark: Forsaken by Greg Weisman was Overshadowed by Controversy for its decision to retcon Chandra's bisexuality, but even disregarding that, the book is just bad. The writing is shoddy and juvenile, the Character Development that several main characters had undergone is ignored, several major, heavily-anticipated events conclude in anticlimactic ways, and the story breaks a fundamental rule of Magic lore by letting a planeswalker transport people to other planes with them. The Professor, an English major and a well-respected member of the Magic community, rips it apart here.

Edited by MathsAngelicVersion on Nov 23rd 2021 at 7:40:03 PM

AlmightyKingPrawn I can chase the wind, I can race the rain from Down at Fraggle Rock *clap clap* Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
I can chase the wind, I can race the rain
#3716: Nov 23rd 2021 at 6:26:57 PM

[up] slightly off topic, but permission to cut that Complete Monster entry on that book's YMMV? Looking at the page it doesn't look official. Anyways I know nothing about Magic so I can't really comment.

She/her. Profile pic is by Richard Michael Gomez @StarmansArt. Please watch Fraggle Rock: Back to the Rock. https://youtu.be/Vm92JNgPbqk
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#3717: Nov 23rd 2021 at 6:27:48 PM

[up] Pretty sure you'd have to contest it on the CM thread to remove it.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#3718: Nov 23rd 2021 at 6:28:59 PM

Yeah, you'd have to get consensus at the CM thread.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
AlmightyKingPrawn I can chase the wind, I can race the rain from Down at Fraggle Rock *clap clap* Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
I can chase the wind, I can race the rain
#3719: Nov 23rd 2021 at 6:30:01 PM

[up][up] [up] I meant that the writing style made it look like it isn't an entry approved by the thread. It was initially a Zero Context Example according to the page history.

Edited by AlmightyKingPrawn on Nov 23rd 2021 at 9:30:25 AM

She/her. Profile pic is by Richard Michael Gomez @StarmansArt. Please watch Fraggle Rock: Back to the Rock. https://youtu.be/Vm92JNgPbqk
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#3720: Nov 23rd 2021 at 6:31:35 PM

You still have to get permission to remove it, I'm pretty sure. The process is very specific. For all we know, they could get actually approved on the thread.

Edited by mightymewtron on Nov 23rd 2021 at 9:32:00 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
MurlocAggroB from the second-most ridiculous province of Canada Since: May, 2015
#3721: Nov 23rd 2021 at 8:19:20 PM

I added the shortened Inhumans section that randomtroper89 wrote. People were STILL adding more to the entry, so I figured it was better off fixed.

regulation pigeon
harryhenry It's either real or it's a dream Since: Jan, 2012
It's either real or it's a dream
#3722: Nov 23rd 2021 at 8:37:15 PM

I'm not so sure about the Inhumans example. Bob Chipman described it in the video below as "not exactly terrible" and praised the Hawaiian location shooting, casting, and Lockjaw. I'm not a fan of Bob for a number of (unrelated) reasons, but he is a prominent-enough online film critic that it counts for something, and might call the "Horrible" distinction into question. What do you all think?

(If the video's url timestamp doesn't work, it starts at 4:50)

Edited by harryhenry on Nov 24th 2021 at 5:42:34 AM

MathsAngelicVersion Ambassador of Eurogames and Touhou Music from Gensokyo Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Ambassador of Eurogames and Touhou Music
#3723: Nov 24th 2021 at 7:04:00 AM

[up]Eh, it's only one example of a critic not hating it (a work can be SBIH even without a 0% approval rating), and some of his defences are of the "The Emoji Movie has good animation" type (i.e. redeeming qualities that don't actually do much to salvage the work).

Oh, and should I go ahead and add Forsaken?

Edited by MathsAngelicVersion on Nov 24th 2021 at 4:04:58 PM

SkylaNoivern Since: Sep, 2016
#3724: Nov 24th 2021 at 3:24:51 PM

The entry for Music is incredibly bloated, so I tried giving it a rewrite. Any thoughts? I'd rather not cut out too much important details

  • Music, a 2021 musical film directed by pop singer Sia, follows drug dealer Kazu (Kate Hudson), who has to care for her autistic nonverbal half-sister, the titular Music (Maddie Ziegler, who is actually neurotypical) after her mother's death. Rife with Glurge and general ignorance about autism, Music is portrayed as a childish Womanchild with Hidden Depths shown through choreographed musical numbers, and is treated like a Living Prop for Kazu's character development and a burden to her carers. Infamously, the film contains scenes which depict Music being put in a chokehold in an attempt to calm her during a meltdown.note  The film's shifts between being a realistic drama to a cheery romantic comedy results in an incoherent story that also attempts to juggle several plotlines to minimal effect. While the film was nominated for two Golden Globe awardsnote , this most likely had more to do with the slow film season that year due to the COVID-19 Pandemic than the film's actual quality. Not only did the film lose both nominations, Golden Globe hosts Tina Fey and Amy Poehler condemned the movie and called it a "floparooni." It has poor Rotten Tomatoes scores (9% from critics, 13% from audiences), only has a 3.1 on IMDB, and it won three Razzies.note  Sia herself saw a massive blow to her reputation for her poor handling of the criticism toward Ziegler's casting and her failure to remove the infamous prone restraint scene. Sara Luterman of Slate criticizes the film here. Jessie Gender, a transgender autistic woman, goes further into the deeper problems with Music's depiction of autism here. Cynical Reviews (who is neurotypical) also takes a shot at it here.

Edited by SkylaNoivern on Nov 24th 2021 at 11:26:59 AM


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