Follow TV Tropes

Following

Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker (spoilers obviously)

Go To

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
Sep 15th 2020 at 3:56:18 PM

Made without love. Back when the animated Mulan was made it was a very obscure old epic poem. The animated film was a fantastic, high budget and absolutely gorgeous adaptation that made Mulan a household name.

This one looks like an utterly done out bog standard wuxia movie any tiny studio could have made.

Edited by blkwhtrbbt on Sep 15th 2020 at 5:58:42 AM

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
Sep 15th 2020 at 4:51:36 PM

Back when the animated Mulan was made it was a very obscure old epic poem. The animated film was a fantastic, high budget and absolutely gorgeous adaptation that made Mulan a household name.

Do these things apply to the Chinese audience?

As much as Disney attempting to cater to China is absolutely a problem, I'd rather not get the "Disney was the one who made this other culture's story actually relevant, and now they spat all over that by changing it" narrative going either.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 15th 2020 at 4:53:00 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
miraculous Chicks dig psychopaths from South Africa
Chicks dig psychopaths
Sep 15th 2020 at 4:56:43 PM

Yeah uh Mulan has always been a popular poem in China. It was till film that it became popular in the west too would be the actual thing which happened.

"A darkness approaches. A day will come in the future where everything you care about will change... Until then I'll be watching you!"
Tuckerscreator from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Sep 15th 2020 at 5:01:56 PM

If a myth is popular in America, it's usually even more massively well known in its country of origin. Small Reference Pools and all that.

If your good mood was ruined because you got into an accident with a car...
Sep 15th 2020 at 5:06:58 PM

This is getting way off topic, but it's kind of something that's been bugging me - because a lot of the hatedom surrounding Mulan has that kind of negative "the Chinese representation doesn't matter, all that matter is what I experience when I was a kid" mentality, and now that the movie has catered so much to China that it looped into Disney outright condoning dictatorship those people get to feel like they were right all along. Which... eh...

It does kind of look back to Star Wars for that same reason, though. Likewise, the ST have had a lot of people who were against their success for reasons that weren't really all that good, and now that those movies turned into a shitshow those poeople felt vindicated and their voices became louder. It happens with everything that has a hatedom.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 15th 2020 at 5:07:56 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Tuckerscreator from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Sep 15th 2020 at 5:14:10 PM

Yeah, I agree. While I wasn't expecting much of the remake, sometimes it felt safer to not say much about it pre-release given it was tricky to distinguish which criticism was well-intentioned and which created a environment that welcomed outright racism like I saw in near where I live.

If your good mood was ruined because you got into an accident with a car...
Windona Hiya from the void Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Hiya
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:08:55 PM

Yeah, ST criticism was in this weird 'do they hate this because they're a bigot or do they hate this because the movie was bigoted'. And then there's the 'hate this because it was poorly written' but that's not antithetical to being a bigot/being against bigots.

Regarding Boyega, isn't he a decently popular star? I know he was in Attack The Block. And as for his social positions, he wouldn't be the first star who's vocal about politics/social issues. Plus IIRC Samuel L Jackson was once a black panther, so Boyega would probably be less likely to be blacklisted than Jackson.

Plus, depending on the studio, there's a chance they might want to go 'look how progressive we are, we have Boyega!'

My AO3
Tuckerscreator from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:22:19 PM

Jackson wasn't a Black Panther, though he was affiliated with the Black Power movement in his 20s before he went into acting.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Sep 15th 2020 at 6:23:30 AM

If your good mood was ruined because you got into an accident with a car...
Tuckerscreator from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:34:26 PM

It might be worth noting that Star Wars's track record of star-making tends to be spotty. Of the OT main cast, only Harrison Ford went on to become a big star. Mark Hamill went into theater and eventually made a new name in voice acting. Carrie Fisher was pushed out of acting by sexism and went into script doctoring. Billy Dee Williams largely worked in television. And James Earl Jones kept up a steady film career.

Then in the prequels of course none of Anakin's actors had much of a career. Ewan MacGregor and Natalie Portman eventually became respected names, but it was generally viewed as despite the prequels rather than because of them. And Ian McDiarmid returned to TV and theater.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Sep 15th 2020 at 6:41:48 AM

If your good mood was ruined because you got into an accident with a car...
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:46:24 PM

Fisher also had drug issues that certainly didn't help. The thing was that Ford, McGregor and Portman also had a rising star status before Star Wars that Star Wars assisted in building but they had to find other outlets to prove themselves (Indiana Jones, Moulin Rouge, V for Vendetta).

Boyega I think would normally be fine but in the changing cultural and political landscape it's hard to see where things will add up. Like what Ray Fisher is trying to do right now, being outspoken about problems with your boss makes other bosses hesitant to hire you.

Edited by KJMackley on Sep 15th 2020 at 6:50:37 AM

Windona Hiya from the void Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Hiya
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:47:00 PM

[up][up]Ah, my bad. Still, point stands that Jackson had strong political opinions and it didn't screw over his career.

Honestly though Boyega didn't get slammed the way PT actors did, so it shouldn't hurt his career. And he is a good actor

My AO3
Sep 15th 2020 at 6:58:19 PM

We're entering an interesting time, where actors - especially those with star power - feel emboldened to call out studios for their shit without fear of being blacklisted or losing their career, and studios are in the awkward position that punishing stars for daring to hold them accountable would be widely reported and bring backlash down upon them.

Granted, a lot of the people doing this are people with pull, which is part of the reason their careers aren't being destroyed. Could DC afford to cancel Aquaman because of Jason Mamoa's comments this week? Probably not. Could they have done something like that to Ray Fisher if someone like Mamoa hadn't spoken up? Probably.

But still, Boyega's becoming a widely recognized figure despite or even because of his visible contention with Disney. It's reached the point where studios could start excluding him, but doing so would only hurt themselves in the long run.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 15th 2020 at 7:05:31 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
RedHunter543 Nothing is absolute. Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Nothing is absolute.
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:04:03 PM

[up] Plus Boyega is associated with black protests. Sure the mood is supporting that actions, but studios and PR are a fickle thing.

Sep 15th 2020 at 7:07:23 PM

Clearly they should take a page from Disney and its handling of Live Action Mulan.

HamburgerTime The Merry Monarch of Darkness from Dark World, where we do sincerely have cookies Relationship Status: I know
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:08:00 PM

[up] Collaborate with a dictatorship?

The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."
Tuckerscreator from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:10:43 PM

The general aim of most big businesses in the last months is try to appear that they support the Black Lives Matter movement, even if few of them actually enact anything internally to address their own racism.

Boyega probably can't be quietly fired and therefore likely won't be, but I doubt more places are lining up to hire him than were already.

If your good mood was ruined because you got into an accident with a car...
RedHunter543 Nothing is absolute. Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Nothing is absolute.
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:12:32 PM

[up][up] And thanking them for letting them film next to genocide camps?

Sep 15th 2020 at 7:19:47 PM

Well the thing is that Boyega is being more vocal now precisely because he's already out of contract with Disney. There is a difference between being fired and just not being hired in the first place. Momoa is different as he is the lead of a big movie franchise that just got started, it seemed to take a lot for him to speak out but for him to get fired would take significantly worse, almost criminal behavior to justify firing him.

RedHunter543 Nothing is absolute. Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Nothing is absolute.
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:23:02 PM

[up] I imagine Disney and WB would passive aggressively get back at Boyega and Mamoa in some way.

Still, this isn't the first time DC actors have stood up for their rights, Gal Gadot threatened to quit unless Brett Ratner was kicked out of Wonder Woman. She has my respect for that.

Sep 15th 2020 at 7:24:59 PM

[up]Boyega being done means they can simply ignore him. Its why I expect anything post TROS to say Finn died offscreen.

"That's right kid. Never play an ace when a two will do."
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:27:13 PM

It's not Disney specifically that we need to look at for Boyega, it's all of Hollywood. Not being currently on contract with Disney doesn't mean Disney can't spread word around and get him blacklisted.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 15th 2020 at 7:29:01 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
RedHunter543 Nothing is absolute. Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Nothing is absolute.
Sep 15th 2020 at 7:27:38 PM

[up][up] And that would land them in hot water.

Ironic.

[up] Yeah, that's what i'm thinking, still Boyega can still enjoy the protection of being visible due to current issues he's championing.

Edited by RedHunter543 on Sep 15th 2020 at 7:28:35 AM

Sep 15th 2020 at 7:29:39 PM

That's it, yeah. Nowadays, with the image he's gotten over the past year, doing that now would be PR suicide. He's one of several stars who are starting to realizing that and using it to hold Hollywood accountable for things.

And that's also among the reasons why LucasFilm putting Finn's character on a bus or dropping a bridge on him would be an incredibly stupid business decision, even (or especially) if Boyega no longer plays him.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 15th 2020 at 7:29:56 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Aleistar Invoked from The Rabbit Hole Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
Invoked
Sep 15th 2020 at 8:09:01 PM

Wait, Bret Ratner was going to direct WW?

And to keep it semi-on topic: what're the odds that the not-Love Interests like Zorii and Jannah come back?

Profile pic credit: Dark Diety | Uptown Funk is the universal language. - Adam Neely
Blueace Blue Reflection Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Blue Reflection
Sep 15th 2020 at 8:14:46 PM

Depends on whether they can think of a character for them. Wonder if Rose would be treated better in comics or a cartoon.


Total posts: 20,129
Top

How well does it match the trope?

Example of:

/

Media sources:

/

Report