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TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 11th 2020 at 11:06:30 AM

It could also be that Spider-Women animated spin-off they originally announced. It doesn't specify wether it's live action or animated.

[up] ...That's a good point. But a spin-off before the sequel? Didn't The LEGO Movie get a little too spin-off crazy before having the proper sequel?

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Feb 11th 2020 at 2:09:15 PM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
Akirakan Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Feb 11th 2020 at 11:52:45 AM

I was under the impression that It SV 2 would come out next year as well, but you're right, just checked and it will come until 22. It's probably still a possibility, they do already had announced a director and screenwriter, and they already have the assets, but as you mention, I don't think they might release it before It SV 2.

So, who knows? I don't think they had anything in production. The Silver & Black movie was canned for a tv show. Maybe Nightwatch? They were pretty serious into making it a thing....

alliterator How dare you? from Southern California Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
How dare you?
Feb 11th 2020 at 12:38:16 PM

The animation — especially the animation for ITSV — takes a long time to finish.

"What, you think I won't fight a dinosaur? Are you crazy? All I want to do is fight dinosaurs." — Squirrel Girl
alliterator How dare you? from Southern California Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
How dare you?
Feb 13th 2020 at 10:20:43 AM "What, you think I won't fight a dinosaur? Are you crazy? All I want to do is fight dinosaurs." — Squirrel Girl
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 13th 2020 at 10:53:44 AM

[up]Just found out about this via this page.

It included this interesting piece:

[ETA: This article has been edited to clarify that Drew will start in a Sony film, like Venom and friends. But that doesn't preclude potential future connections to the MCU as a whole.]

There is SOME precedence going on here:

  • Jessica Drew has her backstory of being an agent of HYDRA and has worked with SHIELD, and SWORD.
  • She's a friend of Captain Marvel, aka Carol Danvers.
  • We heard rumblings of Secret Invasion getting adapted in the MCU in the near future, and Jessica had an important role in that storyline, namely getting impersonated by Veranke, the Skrull Queen. With the Fox buyout, nothing's REALLY stopping Marvel to just plain use Veranke...

Might it be that Sony is gearing up for Spider-Woman so Marvel Studios can have her in the MCU version of Secret Invasion? Like a sort of reversal on how MCU!Spider-Man got established in Captain America: Civil War before having his own movie?

In any case, it sounds like something Feige would want to sound off on.

I'm cautiously optimistic...

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Feb 13th 2020 at 1:58:37 PM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
alliterator How dare you? from Southern California Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
How dare you?
Feb 13th 2020 at 10:55:50 AM

[up] Hmmm. So this might be another Sony/Marvel deal? But in this one, Sony keeps 100% of their solo movie profits, while Marvel can use the character in their own films and not pay Sony for it? Might be interesting.

Edited by alliterator on Feb 13th 2020 at 10:57:37 AM

"What, you think I won't fight a dinosaur? Are you crazy? All I want to do is fight dinosaurs." — Squirrel Girl
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 13th 2020 at 11:01:46 AM

[up] It might be the evolved form of the Disney/Sony deal to share Spider-Man (and I guess his friends and foes?) that will take effect once the third Spidey movie and whatever MCU thing he'll show up in comes and goes.

And Sony getting 100% of the solo movies' profits so Marvel can freely use Spider-Man characters sounds like a deal that works in Sony's favor since they're getting all the loot and not just a big chunk (assuming that's what it ends up being)...

Hmmmmmm...

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Feb 13th 2020 at 2:02:33 PM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
TobiasDrake Exposition Dragon from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Feb 13th 2020 at 11:03:01 AM

I figure that Sony just wants to have a "Spider-Man" like character for their Sonyverse without needing to bicker with Marvel over Tom Holland's scheduling. That way they can have their cake and eat it.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Feb 13th 2020 at 12:03:46 PM

Drake's Razor: Never attribute to cold unfeeling logic that which can be equally explained by emotional outburst.
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 13th 2020 at 11:42:02 AM

[up]

I figure that Sony just wants to have a "Spider-Man" like character for their Sonyverse

That's pretty funny when you take into account how Spider-Woman and Spider-Man don't have a lot in common most of the time.

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
fredhot16 from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Feb 13th 2020 at 11:42:43 AM

[up]Yeah, but who knows about that?

Suspension of disbelief: I can believe in time travel but it still has to make sense with it's own rules.
TobiasDrake Exposition Dragon from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Feb 13th 2020 at 2:15:12 PM

It depends on how they play Jess, really. This is, after all, an adaptation; they are by no means required to collab with Disney and make her a Hydra agent that joins S.H.I.E.L.D. and then becomes an Avenger.

They could base her on Ultimate Jessica Drew, who was literally a clone of Peter Parker. But it's unlikely they'll want to get into that whole Clone Saga mess.

They could draw in some of the other Spider-Women. Make her a Composite Character with Julia Carpenter or Mattie Franklin, who have more of a connection to Spider-Man; in fact, Julia's costume is actually the inspiration for the Venom symbiote's "Black suit with white spider logo" design. When Spider-Man first acquired the Black Suit that would later become the iconic Venom symbiote, he designed it to look like Julia's spider-suit.

They could also go the Miles Morales route and just have her be bit by the same spider that gave Pete his powers.

Drake's Razor: Never attribute to cold unfeeling logic that which can be equally explained by emotional outburst.
alliterator How dare you? from Southern California Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
How dare you?
Feb 13th 2020 at 3:00:17 PM

They could also go the Miles Morales route and just have her be bit by the same spider that gave Pete his powers.
You mean the Silk route; Miles was bitten by a different spider.

It would also be weird if Venom got his iconic spider emblem from Spider-Woman instead of Spider-Man, but it could work.

Edited by alliterator on Feb 13th 2020 at 3:00:47 AM

"What, you think I won't fight a dinosaur? Are you crazy? All I want to do is fight dinosaurs." — Squirrel Girl
Feb 13th 2020 at 3:26:32 PM

I'd find it amazing if Sony sets up a Spider-Verse just without any Spider-Man in it. Perhaps spectacular even. [lol]

alliterator How dare you? from Southern California Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
How dare you?
Feb 18th 2020 at 10:04:25 PM

Okay, after reading about the Silver & Black script and thinking about what the Sony Marvel universe needs, I had an idea. An idea for a movie that would introduce new characters, but would also be something narratively different, that we haven't seen before.

So here we go. This movie is called THE SCARLET SPIDERS or LET'S DO THE CLONE SAGA AGAIN:

THE SCARLET SPIDERS

ACT ONE

Ben wakes up in a glass chamber full of fluid just as it opens at the bottom and dumps him on the floor. Next to his chamber is another one, this one with a woman. When her chamber also opens and she falls to the floor, Ben gets to her and together they share what little information they know. His chamber is marked with the name "Reilly"; hers with the name "Drew." All he remembers is the name Ben and she remembers her first name is Jessica.

Hearing the sound of another chamber opening, they go to the next room to find two more chambers. A man has already come out from his and Ben goes to talk to him, but the man grabs him by the throat and asks him angrily if he put him here. Jessica grabs the man's shoulder and ends up throwing him across the room by accident. After he recovers and they tell him they don't know anything, they find his chamber labeled "Kaine" and the other chamber, with a still sleeping woman, labeled "Witter." The final chamber opens up and the three of them greet Charlotte Witter as she wakes up.

In a control room, Professor Miles Warren sips from his "World's Greatest Professor" coffee mug and looks at the screens monitoring the four of them. Behind him, the guards who had previously been monitoring things have all been shot by Warren. As Warren programs something into a computer, his cell phone rings and he sighs, exasperated. The person calling is Herbert Wyndham, who asks what the hell Miles is doing. Miles says that he has to test the subjects in chaotic ways. "Did that require killing everyone in the building?" Wyndham says. "Yes, it did," Miles says. "There is only so much a person can look past, especially with what we were paying them. Now they don't have to look past anything; their consciences are all clear. Just like Jonathan Drew's." He cuts off Wyndham and says, "Now let the tests commence!" He puts on a cheap plastic Halloween mask of a green jackal.

In the chamber room, a monitor turns on and Miles starts talking to the four of them. He tells them that they are test subjects brought to him at the point of death and since he cured them of death, their lives belong to him. So he is seeing if they deserve live by sending things to kill them. The first test: robotic Spider Slayers. As they battle the Spider Slayers, the four of them realize that they all seem to have super strength and agility; two of them (Ben and Kaine) have a mysterious sixth sense for danger, while Jessica has a bio-electric blast that short-circuits several of the Spider Slayers. As more doors in the facility open up for them, Jessica tells Kaine that it's definitely a trap, Kaine tells her, "I don't care. I'm going to find that stupid jackal and kill him."

ACT TWO

In Buenos Aires, Argentina, INTERPOL agent Lindsay McCabe gets a phone call from Herbert Wyndham telling her that he will help in her investigation of Miles Warren, even though she is also investigating him. He directs her to the New You Technologies, a biotech company that Warren and Wyndham started, and gives her the passcode to get inside. She requests backup from her superiors at INTERPOL, but they deny her, so she decides to go alone.

Ben, Jessica, Kaine, and Charlotte wind up in a cafeteria where they find the dead bodies of the people who worked there. Most of them are wearing "New You" badges, which Ben takes in order to open more doors. Jessica wonders what killed them and then wonders if it was poison (causing Kaine to spit take a soda he was drinking). But Charlotte actually sees that all of the dead were stabbed with some sort of sharp implement.

Suddenly, the Jackal appears on a nearby screen again. This time he tells that that although they passed the first test, the next one is harder. "After all, we all love beating on poor little robots who have no feelings and feel no pain. But what about an actual living creature?" The lights start to flicker as Spidercide, an animalistic humanoid creature, enters the room and starts attacking them. Unlike the Spider Slayers, Spidercide manages to avoid almost all of the attacks on him, his spider-sense letting him know when to dodge and avoid the coming blows. After it incapacitates Charlotte and Ben, Kaine tries to choke it, but it throws him to the side and attacks Jessica. Before she can do anything, however, Spidercide is shot through the head by Lindsay, who was just outside the cafeteria when she heard the attack.

"No fair," the Jackal says on the screen. "That's cheating." Kaine kicks his foot through the screen before asking who Lindsay is. She shows them her badge and then asks who they are.

In his control room, Miles Warren takes off his mask and wonders how she got inside and to that exact spot just in time. "Because I helped her," Herbert Wyndham says, his face appearing on a nearby computer screen. "You aren't the only one who can play puppeteer. Now stop this game and come back to Wundagore, Miles." Warren smiles. "I didn't know you cared, Herbert. Or do you only want me for my expertise? It doesn't matter. I'm not leaving here until the tests are complete. And I have plans, my friend, plans within plans, wheels within wheels."

ACT THREE

Lindsay is explaining to the others about Miles Warren and how he became obsessed with cloning as a process to cheat death after his wife and daughter died in a car accident. Jessica asks Lindsay how she got there and Lindsay leads them to a nearby elevator which brought her directly to this floor. The elevator, however, is no longer working, it's power turned off by Warren. So they decide to climb above it and go directly to the top of the facility, which should lead outside into Buenos Aries. There is some flirtation between Lindsay and Jessica, while Ben talks to Kaine about Spidercide and how sorry he was when he died. Kaine says he shouldn't feel sorry; Spidercide was a mindless beast, but Ben says that he saw something in his eyes, a pleading, but it appeared like it couldn't control itself. "Perhaps it was once a person, like us, but they changed him, altered his mind to make him do whatever they wanted." Kaine says, "They sound like people who need killing," but Ben says, "I don't think anyone needs killing. I hope I never have to kill anyone."

Charlotte listens to their conversation and smiles. As they finally reach the top floor, right after Jessica opens the door with the badge she took, Charlotte grabs Ben and Kaine and throws them down the elevator shaft and then pushes Jessica and Lindsay into a room filled with spiders in various plastic cages. There are images of Peter Parker throughout the room, too, taken from the video in Spider-Man: Far From Home, along with blood samples labeled 1 through 8.

Jessica goes to attack Charlotte, but Charlotte grows a stinger and holds Lindsay hostage. Charlotte tells her that she remembers everything; Miles found her in an Argentinian jail set for execution, but rescued her in order to perform experiments. The others were near dead, just like he had said Ben had been in an accident, Jessica had a rare genetic disorder, and Kaine was a homeless man taken from the street. Only Charlotte was still healthy during the procedure, so Miles left her memory intact and told her his plan to test the others. She agreed to it as long as afterwards, she could be there when they were dissected and be given whatever powers they had to her. Charlotte gloats about all these powers coming from the blood of a murderer of Peter Parker, the blood he left behind in London. That's why Miles had everything spider-themed. She gloats that she's going to kill Lindsay and Jessica and take her bio-electric powers for herself.

And that's when Ben and Kaine come up from behind her and, while Ben pulls Lindsay to safety, Kaine fights Charlotte, eventually breaking her stinger and throwing her through a glass window into an enclosure filled with spiders. She gets entangled in their web, which allows Lindsay to shoot her in the chest. Charlotte then falls, apparently dead, with her body cocooned by the spiders.

Jessica asks how they survived the fall and Ben says that it turns out they can stick to walls. Together, they break down the door to the control room where Miles Warren was, but all they find is the plastic jackal mask and a note that states:

TO MATTIE,

SORRY I CAN'T GO TRICK-OR-TREATING WITH YOU THIS YEAR, BUT I HOPE YOUR MOTHER TOLD YOU HOW IMPORTANT MY STUDIES ARE. I KNOW THIS IS DISAPPOINTING, SO I HOPE THIS MASK WILL HELP I KNOW YOU LIKE EGYPTIAN MYTHOLOGY AND ANUBIS WAS THE GOD OF THE DEAD, SO IF YOU WEAR THIS AS YOUR COSTUME, YOU CAN RULE OVER ALL THE ZOMBIES AROUND YOU.

I LOVE YOU,
DAD

EPILOGUE

Two weeks later, in San Francisco, Lindsay hands new Social Security Cards and IDs to Ben, Jessica, and Kaine, since all three of them were declared dead. She tells them that she still has contacts in INTERPOL, even if she no longer works there, having been fired for going off book. She's kept the three of them a secret, because she knows that if INTERPOL or other agencies knew about them, they would try to take advantage of their powers. Kaine asks what their supposed to do. "Live your lives, I guess," Lindsay says. "What about you?" Jessica asks her. "You kind of lost your job protecting us. We owe you." Lindsay smiles and says she was thinking of starting a detective agency and could use someone like them someone like her. "Plus, I kind of need a detective to find out what happened to my father," Jessica says.

Ben says that he's been wondering about the man whose blood changed them, about Peter Parker. Charlotte called him a murderer, but Ben can't believe that. Kaine asks if he wants to find Parker; Ben shrugs and doesn't really know what he wants to do. He only knows that he has an innate desire to protect people. "Sounds like a hero to me," Lindsay says. "Like the Scarlet Pimpernel." "Or the Scarlet Spider," Ben says with a smile. (And yes, if possible, he should be wearing a blue hoodie at this moment.)

In Mount Wundagore, Miles Warren shows up looking disheveled and beaten. "You didn't have to have your men be so rough," he tells Wyndham. "You left me no choice," Wyndham says. "I need your mind. Life and death are easy to cheat; it's evolution that we needs to control, Mr. Warren."

END

Edited by alliterator on Feb 18th 2020 at 10:12:36 AM

"What, you think I won't fight a dinosaur? Are you crazy? All I want to do is fight dinosaurs." — Squirrel Girl
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 19th 2020 at 4:46:44 PM

[up] It's pretty ambitious, that much I'll say.

Anyway, Tom Rothman and Alan Horn talk about how sharing Spider-Man was a win-win-win situation.

Tom Rothman also hopes the deal extends to beyond the third Spidey movie...

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
Akirakan Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Feb 19th 2020 at 5:31:04 PM

So while we're pitching how this cinematic universe should go, here's mine I made a few months ago, I call it the "Spider-Man Legacy Universe".

Edited by Akirakan on Feb 19th 2020 at 8:34:03 AM

TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 27th 2020 at 12:27:41 PM

So remember how both Disney and Sony had dibs on the October 8, 2021 date?

Looks like Disney has revoked their dibs on that date just now.

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Feb 27th 2020 at 7:52:49 AM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
TobiasDrake Exposition Dragon from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Feb 27th 2020 at 4:41:17 PM

I'm not sure I understand how you get from "Disney is not releasing a film on this specific day" to "Sony's Spider-Woman Film CONFIRMED!"

Drake's Razor: Never attribute to cold unfeeling logic that which can be equally explained by emotional outburst.
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Feb 27th 2020 at 4:57:29 PM

[up] Good point. I've already gone ahead and deleted that piece. Sorry about that.

Still pretty curious what kind of Marvel film Sony be able to cook up by October 2021.

In any case, the plot thickens...

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Mar 10th 2020 at 4:30:10 PM

Bump.

Roberto Orci is writing an untitled Spider-Man spin-off...

Didn't he co-write The Amazing Spider Man 2?

(*continually presses X to doubt Sony's judgment*)

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Mar 10th 2020 at 7:31:41 AM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
fredhot16 from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Mar 10th 2020 at 4:34:23 PM

Dude.

Edited by fredhot16 on Mar 10th 2020 at 4:35:51 AM

Suspension of disbelief: I can believe in time travel but it still has to make sense with it's own rules.
Akirakan Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Mar 10th 2020 at 5:28:06 PM

They have Phil Lord and Chris Miller on the payroll, just hand the whole universe to them and let them do whatever they want!

TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Mar 10th 2020 at 5:29:18 PM

[up] Exactly! Is it really that hard to comprehend?

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Mar 10th 2020 at 8:29:37 AM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
fredhot16 from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Mar 10th 2020 at 5:35:43 PM

(Draws a line in chalk on the thread wall)

Suspension of disbelief: I can believe in time travel but it still has to make sense with it's own rules.

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