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Hate Sink cleanup

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The main concern of a Hate Sink is whether the narrative treats the character as someone intended to be despised.

The character in question must actually display detestable qualities, and be hated by other characters at least, or treated by the narrative like someone you are supposed to hate. The author's declared intent cements an example, but is not needed if the narrative itself treats the character as someone who is supposed to be hated.

A Hate Sink may have charismatic traits, a troubled past, or complexity, but in order for this trope to be in effect, such traits must be de-emphasized by the narrative in favour of their detestable traits.

Please note that we do not use Effort Posts.

Edited by gjjones on Dec 3rd 2020 at 7:43:25 AM

NicMasterTrope (Troper in training)
#6201: Jan 10th 2025 at 3:42:57 AM

Cut Sampson
Manga/Bleach

  • Szayelaporro Granz is by far the most detestable Espada of them all, surpassing even Nnoitra. He's an Ax-Crazy Mad Scientist who treats his own Fracciónes like crap, views people as research materials and has no qualms on murdering and experimenting on them, and a sadistic and arrogant bastard who enjoys hurting others. His past doesn't help as well, as it's revealed that when he was human, he was behind torturing and murdering many people through horrible and unethical experiments. His actions almost makes Mayuri Kurotsuchi look like a complete angel

[up] I would say cut, as having the Bleach myself, I can say that he’s way over the top theatric, eccentric and Laughably Evil, basically mirroring Mayuri, who himself portrayed as person “so detestable they’re entertaining”

Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the "Retromancer"
#6202: Jan 10th 2025 at 3:54:59 AM

Szayelaporro is a Sissy Villain and Smug Snake, so his odd mannerisms could either be Played for Laughs or Played for Horror. It's been a while so I don't remember which, if he's meant to not be taken seriously then he doesn't count, but otherwise it would just emphasize his creepiness.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
NicMasterTrope (Troper in training)
#6203: Jan 10th 2025 at 3:58:54 AM

Well, he is Laughably Evil, it emphatizes both his sissiness and creepiness. Does the combination of both count, but in his opinion, he might not count even with that one the account as said creepiness is portrayed in somewhat awesome and entertaining manner, but that’s just me voicing my opinion on him

AmNotMe Since: Apr, 2020
#6204: Jan 10th 2025 at 6:52:05 AM

Is Hunter Cain from Generator Rex a Hate Sink? I don't remember much about him, but I'm split on whether he counts or not, as while I remember hating his bigotry, I feel like he might have had some Evil Is Cool factors going for him.

PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#6205: Jan 10th 2025 at 8:29:58 AM

Szayelaporro Granz is absolutely a Hate Sink. The idea behind him is even Mayuri, a Token Evil Teammate, is "good" compared to him.

I don't remember any of his antics being "funny". Him being a Sissy Villain wasn't played for laughs, it was a tool he used to get people to underestimate him.

Oissu!
NicMasterTrope (Troper in training)
#6207: Jan 11th 2025 at 12:38:31 AM

I have a question. Can La Signora (or at least, her American localization) count as a Hate Sink due to her obnoxious and smug attitude and having the dub put more emphasis on her jerkish traits

Edited by NicMasterTrope on Jan 11th 2025 at 11:38:56 PM

PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#6208: Jan 11th 2025 at 7:01:35 AM

For Anabella from Final Fantasy XVI we've got:

  • Hate Sink: Anabella provides a primary target for the audience's scorn, which is intentional on the narrative's part. She is thoroughly contemptuous towards Clive, even calling him "worthless" and "a man like any other" to Elwin because Clive was rejected as Phoenix's Dominant. She's extremely strict on Joshua's well-being, and continues to go on elitist ramblings, even though Elwin clearly does not agree with them. To make matters worse, Annabella betrays her own family to Sanbreque, orders Clive to be enslaved, sheds no tears for her dead husband, and has the knights kill her handmaidens since she promised she would have their heads if anything happened to Joshua, something they had no control over. The only thing Anabella appears genuinely upset about is Joshua's death, and even that's ambiguous as to whether she was upset that her favorite son died or she lost a bargaining chip. While Elwin rejected her elitist philosophy, her second husband was poisoned by it. This, in turn, ends up causing his We Have Reserves mentality and allowing Annabella to install her new son to the throne. And the reason Anabella has for all of this is because she felt she was owed a better social position, despite being the duchess of Rosaria and queen in all but name. Anabella's continuous fall from grace as the story goes on is thus intended for the audience to find cathartic.

Like any character written to follow in suit with Cersei she's a hard sell to me, at least played straight. Her character page tries to claim it's for selfish reasons but she loves Clive's brothers and more to the point, while her fall from grace has catharsis to it, her final scene evokes pathos, like a reminder that as fun as that was to watch, there is still a human being falling apart.

Link:

https://youtu.be/JYRZFOmrSeY?si=Sje97qDNb82k7mlr

If she is going to stay at all I'm gonna say the entry should be rewritten to explain how her final moments make her a subversion, if not taken down altogether.

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
#6209: Jan 11th 2025 at 12:56:45 PM

Cut Lee but keep Szayelaporro. Moral of the story: Tropes Are Tools, and Laughably Evil is no exception.

As for Anabella, I say rewrite her entry since she is a subversion, after all.

Edited by LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime on Jan 11th 2025 at 6:57:45 PM

I don't want the world, I just want your half.
NicMasterTrope (Troper in training)
#6210: Jan 11th 2025 at 1:19:04 PM

Keep the Annabelle, just make her entry shorter
But what about La Signora post?[up][up][up]

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#6211: Jan 11th 2025 at 1:22:47 PM

Your posts don't give enough context for people not familiar with the work, Nic.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#6212: Jan 11th 2025 at 1:50:03 PM

I don't think La Signora is a Hate Sink given her tragic backstory and Alas, Poor Villain death.

Oissu!
LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
Silverblade2 Since: Jan, 2013
#6214: Jan 15th 2025 at 11:13:36 AM

Should HS be added as No Recent Examples, Please!? A certain villain from Skeleton Crew was added as HS before the last episode provided them some depths and freudian excuse.

Edited by Silverblade2 on Jan 15th 2025 at 11:33:11 AM

SarenApologist Since: Jun, 2023
#6215: Jan 15th 2025 at 8:56:33 PM

Yeah, there should definitely be a limit on when we can qualify a character. I still remember when Reva from Obi-Wan Kenobi was listed before the finale or the episodes where she was shown to have a genuinely traumatic past. Say what you will about her, but she absolutely wasn't meant to be one, and tagging her before the series even ended was kinda rash.

Edited by SarenApologist on Jan 15th 2025 at 8:57:26 AM

Here's my home address, social media, and bank account!
Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#6216: Jan 15th 2025 at 9:09:46 PM

Yeah that sounds like a good idea.

Bow to the Prototype
LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
kuchiki222 Since: Apr, 2015
#6219: Jan 23rd 2025 at 2:41:30 AM

About Danzo Shimura from Naruto, we have this entry:

  • Hate Sink: Despite being a Well-Intentioned Extremist claiming to do what's best for the village, Danzo is nothing more than a self-righteous and power-hungry man who believes he alone could save the village. He's responsible for essentially much of the problems that would plague the series. No one in the Leaf Village particularly likes Danzo or his propensity for dirty work, with even Hiruzen only keeping him around in authority because Danzo is willing to Shoot the Dog and undergo Bad Guys Do the Dirty Work for the sake of the village, but even that tolerance reached its limit when Danzo's schemes got the Uchiha Clan slaughtered. Even the other Kages despised Danzo during the Kage Summit and the Third Tsuchikage, a fellow hardliner, gave Danzo a well-deserved "Reason You Suck" Speech for being an untrustworthy ambitious cynic after he tried to manipulate his way to reach his goals.

And I would mostly agree. Danzo is a terrible human being who kickstarted the Uchiha Clan massacre and led to the villainy of Pain by allying with Hanzo, Sasuke due to the said massacre and Kabuto by making him kill his mother despite both being loyal to him. Most of his appearances post his death is just how his evil acts influence the present day.

But, his death is quite sympathetic. After Sasuke calls him out on taking Karin as hostage as a Not-So-Well-Intentioned Extremist, Danzo flashes back to his youth where he was in a team with Hiruzen, Koharu and Homura (the other Konoha elders) as well as Kagami Uchiha and Tobirama, the Second Hokage. Tobirama found out a large platoon was heading towards them, as Danzo froze up when wanting to nominate himself. Hiruzen volunteered to sacrifice himself which started their rivalry, as Tobirama made him the Hokage soon after while going ahead and sacrificing himself. After that, Danzo decided to sacrifice himself to stop Sasuke and Tobi from destroying the village by destroying Shisui's eye first and then killing himself in an attack that would have killed both of them hadn't Tobi saved Sasuke and used his abilities. He then has a sad flashback lamenting how he failed on being Hokage as we see a young Hiruzen and Danzo playing together before the wars drove him to a bitter old cynicist we see in the present day as he dies.

I am leaning towards a Cut, but what do you suggest?

Edited by kuchiki222 on Jan 23rd 2025 at 2:56:17 AM

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
#6220: Jan 23rd 2025 at 3:51:42 AM

I'm not familiar with Naruto, but that right there sounds too much like an Alas, Poor Villain for me to feel comfortable with calling this dude a HS. Cut IMO.

Edited by LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime on Jan 23rd 2025 at 9:51:53 AM

I don't want the world, I just want your half.
TiMBer1566 kittykat from Virginia Since: Nov, 2018 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
kittykat
#6221: Jan 23rd 2025 at 8:22:39 AM

Yeah, cut him. I absolutely loathe Danzo, but his death scene makes it clear he's not meant to be this.

TheGrayFox ....Phenomenal from A Lovecraftian fishing village Since: Sep, 2011
....Phenomenal
#6222: Jan 23rd 2025 at 1:26:33 PM

Thirding the cut. Danzo is an atrocious person and there's no denying that, but the series does at least attempt to generate some pathos for him by the end. (YMMV on how effective it is, but that's beside the point.)

There remains a foothold out of this mire — now climb.
PassingThrough Since: Feb, 2024
#6223: Jan 24th 2025 at 8:31:57 AM

Cut, an Alas, Poor Villain pretty well tells you what the author's going for and it ain't this trope.

KawhiMidoriya1 Bubsy the Bobcat Fan 420 from Quahog Rhode Island Since: Apr, 2020 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Bubsy the Bobcat Fan 420
#6224: Jan 24th 2025 at 12:06:41 PM

While Princess is a Spoiled Brat. There's stuff that prevents her from being a Hate Sink:

  • In Boy Toys she had an Enemy Mine situation where she teams up with The Powerpuff Girls so that all of them can stop the Rowdyruff Boys

  • Her fight against Blossom in Stuck Up, Up and Away is a well beloved fight in the show where it could be seen as an Evil Is Cool moment

  • Special mention to The Beatles Shout-Out episode Meet the Beat Alls where she, Mojo Jojo, Fuzzy Lumpkins, and him all team up featuring Beatles references.

  • Slightly subjective one but her voice makes her rather Laughably Evil. Granted as The Powerpuff Girls is an action comedy

LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime Raz (Season 2) Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
#6225: Jan 24th 2025 at 1:34:22 PM

I brought Morbucks up a few pages ago for the same reasons and she was agreed to be a keeper. Personally I still think she doesn't count honestly. Probably the reason she was chosen to be kept was because I brought her up during my "mass-cut" and thus didn't have much time focusing on her compared to everyone else I brought up in it, all of whom were themselves cut.

Edited by LoadsAndLoadsOfFreeTime on Jan 24th 2025 at 7:35:53 AM

I don't want the world, I just want your half.

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