Hate Sink cleanup

How is she a Magnificent Bitch?

She’s listed on MagnificentBastard.Fullmetal Alchemist.

Oi. I still think she should be a candidate for the trope.

Edited by OpeningDesk on Sep 19th 2020 at 6:53:51 AM

Lust absolutely does not qualify for this trope, in no way.

Care to explain why that is, even as I literally gave a direct quote from the page on how she is irredeèmable? Need I remind that she stabbed someone in the back, literally I might add?

Hate Sink = / = "irredeemable". It means they're designed to be hated by the audience, often in lieu of a proper antagonist.

So a proper antagonist can't be a Hate Sink?

Edited by OpeningDesk on Sep 20th 2020 at 12:43:52 PM

Technically yes but antagonists in general get audience hatred; the idea here is that the character is like the hatred lightning-rod and exists so the audience can have someone to direct that hatred towards; antagonists can count if they're so utterly despicable and unlikeable for reasons beyond their antagonism, especially in works that might not have an actual villain to root against. (Basically, are you hating them because their personality is grating and they do nothing but irritate you, or are you hating them because they did evil things?)

But an MB can't be a Hate Sink, or at least it'd be a Hate Sink done wrong, as MB's by design are liked by the audience. They have admirable traits.

Edited by WarJay77 on Sep 20th 2020 at 3:50:08 PM

How can someone who has a hate-boner for the entire human race and wouldn't think twice about killing any of us be so-well liked in the fandom?

You’re telling us why you don’t like the character, basically and citing erroneous information. “Completely irredeemable” that ignore the fact she looks after Gluttony and cares for Father and wants to see his wish come through. Most of her screen time is devoted to how intelligent and crafty of a planner she is and after her death Bradley even makes the point she died fighting for what she believed in. This trope is “The author wants you to hate this character” not “I don’t like this character.”

Here I do honestly blame this thread's roots in trying to replicate CM and MB in operating style and as a result it's become something people like to do a hardcore analysis about, weighing pros and cons to adding someone when it's a much simpler matter than that. I've got my issues with iZombie but let's take Vaughn for instance... he's a smug, cowardly Complete Monster but the first thing that's almost always played up is how zany he acts, coupled with a Beware the Silly Ones in regards to his crimes. I'd contest "Hate, hate, hate" is the first thing in the author's mind with him and I worry this operating style is leading to people trying to stretch out the definition and capture as many "complex" examples as they can, while as a result deviating from how the trope was defined. I see the trope page has become embarrassingly long and a TRS might be useful to really truncate and boil it down to its core points, so we don't keep running into "I'd argue X should count", when we're clearly relying on personal opinions and debatable points rather than simple indicators of authorial intent, which has made the whole thing much more complicated than it needed to be.

Edited by 43110 on Sep 20th 2020 at 11:46:44 AM

Fair point. I actually think we should remove the EP thing altogether, and wonder why we haven't done so yet.

A TRS would also be a good thing at this point. When I attempted in vain to improve the HS description, I tried getting more input, but nobody here seemed to pay any attention to my posts, IIRC.

Feel free to put it on the TRS sandbox.

HateSink.Other Media

• Supermarioglitchy4s Super Mario 64 Bloopers: SMG3 is also this by completely erasing SMG4 and his gang through time paradox, replacing them with his team and himself by making it so they never met Mario.

That's a single evil act as opposed to how their character/personality is designed to be consistently hated. I'd say cut.

• Every single main character of a Go Animate grounded video is intended to be this, as the intention is to have the character act up, destroy property or kill people, or just be rude to someone so much that you'll be happy to see them get grounded grounded grounded grounded by the video's end. It's worth pointing in this case, however, that this sometimes doesn't work and the opposite happens, with the intended Hate Sink being Unintentionally Sympathetic while the other characters become Hate Sinks themselves. This is especially noticeable in the typical character dynamic between Caillou and his dad Boris, the latter of whom has more qualities of this trope than the intended Hate Sink Caillou. Boris's typical portrayal is that of a borderline Ax-Crazy abusive dad who grounds, punishes or even murders Caillou at the slightest provocation without getting in trouble for it himself. Because of this, videos depicting Boris getting his comeuppance for his actions have become very common.

Is complaints agains the trope appropriate for a a non-YMMV? And can a protagonist count if an HS by definition also lack any enjoyable to watch traits which a protagonist is supposed to have hence their being the main focus of the work (then again this would explain the hatedom this work gets).

Mmm, SMG3 from the beginning was meant to be hated his first appearance in fact was his attempt on killing SMG4 just because he was caught plagiarizing him. Ultimately it's a slow progression towards his acts in the YouTube Arc.

Understood. The entry could use some expansion explain such.

• SMG3, the Arch-Enemy of SMG4, had been envious of him from the beginning, attempting to kill him when SMG4 caught him plagiarizing his work. From there, the two had a long-lasting feud culminating in SMG3 manipulating Mario into helping him steal the YouTube Remote so he could erase SMG4 and his gang from existence. He becomes more despicable upon taking over the channel and subjecting his crew to electrical torture if they fell out of line. During the WOTFI 2020, SMG3 threatens to toss Fishy Boopkins from a roof and decides to kill his crew when they revolt.

Edited by AustinDR on Sep 27th 2020 at 10:08:13 AM

I agree that the EP thing should be removed from my original post.

It'll let you edit it out if you'd like.

Done. Any other suggestions that could be added to my post?

Maybe “DO NOT POST EFFORT POSTS.”

Agreed; this trope simply doesn't work with that particular system.

I’ll hold off commenting further suggestions until those interested get the TRS underway. Currently I’m not even sure we’re all talking about the same thing in regards to this trope.

Get a trs up and maybe hash things out better their.

The Cat in the Hat

• Hate Sink: The Cat may be a [invoked]Designated Hero in the film with barely any redeeming qualities, yet he is a vast improvement over the manipulative and self-serving Larry Quinn, who’s actions throughout the film cause the kids grief. In fact, it seems that the only thing the audience likes about the Cat is that he causes Larry to sneeze since the latter is allergic to cats. That and it’s implied the Cat’s rather unpleasant actions throughout the film was just part of a job of helping kids develop, making him more redeemable.

I think this character could be an example, but this entry is poorly written, it read off like an audience reaction.

Focuses too much on the Cat and not on the actual Hate Sink.