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Overshadowed By Controversy Cleanup

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Overshadowed by Controversy has several examples, particularly under the Fan Works, Webcomics, and Web Original folders, that don't fit the trope as described. The controversy is supposed to overshadow the work, so if it doesn't do that it shouldn't count as a valid example.

The media folders, such as Anime or Western Animation, could also use a look, as some entries deal with shows, while others deal with actors, fans, or creators. Additionally, some of the entries are not controversial anymore or are not known enough to overshadow the show completely, and others seem closer to Never Live It Down.

Some examples even point out that the controversy was debunked or died down eventually, which doesn't fit the trope, as well as examples saying things like "time will tell if [x] can recover." I originally tried the Real-Life cleanup section, and then a TRS thread, but I hope this is the right section to help us clean up this trope's examples. ^^

MOD NOTE: For something to be overshadowed by controversy; it has to have a significant, arguably overwhelming impact on that work/creator/thing that’s provable by pointing to actual evidence beyond social media likes or a news report. The controversy has to be bigger than the thing for it to overshadow the thing.

For a work, did it bomb directly due to the controversy? Was it pulled from shelves or streaming services? Nothing like this? Then it most likely doesn’t count.

For a creator, did they lose their job/get banned or lose all of their sponsorships or are unable to get any work directly due to the controversy? Did they at least retire directly because of the controversy? Nothing like this? Then it most likely doesn’t count.

Valid examples would be people like Gina Carano or Louie CK. As they were both fired and black listed for their controversies. Or Johnny Depp and Amber Heard are now more known for those controversies than their actual careers. Clearly being overshadowed by it.

If only chronically online people like us are going to be aware of something, it definitely doesn’t count. The controversy has to be so big that even people who are rarely online or know very little about something, would still have heard of the controversy.

Edited by kory on Oct 4th 2025 at 10:21:54 AM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#1751: May 27th 2021 at 3:25:52 PM

I knew about that, but it's not famous enough to actually overshadow the books.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#1752: May 27th 2021 at 3:27:30 PM

The Xi thing is more a joke at this point then a genuine controversy.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DDRMASTERM do you wanna have a bad time? from Someplace, Utah, USA Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
do you wanna have a bad time?
#1753: May 27th 2021 at 4:14:55 PM

It should be noted that comparing Chinese heads of state to pop-culture icons didn’t start with Xi and Winnie. Former leader Jiang Zemin was compared to the minions. Online Chinese dissidents like doing it to force conflict between the Chinese government and big corporations.

Thinking about it, yeah the Xi Jinping/Winnie situation probably does warrant a cut.

Edited by DDRMASTERM on May 27th 2021 at 5:15:44 AM

mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#1754: May 27th 2021 at 5:18:02 PM

I assumed the meme overshadowed Pooh in China, but they still sell Pooh products there, so I assume it's just a standard meme. Plus I think most jokes I see about it at this point aren't even from China.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
WackyPancake from My computer. Since: May, 2011
#1755: May 27th 2021 at 5:23:33 PM

China bans everything, anyway. So even if the entire Pooh franchise was banned in there it probably wouldn't qualify. I'd actually say it's the other way around, in that good ol' Pooh has cast a shadow over Xi Jinping without even meaning to. If you mention Pooh in casual conversation, most of the time you will not get a response about Jinping. However, any time Jinping is brought up, someone will inevitably mention Pooh.

"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."
themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
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#1756: May 27th 2021 at 6:02:58 PM

Guys I brought it up to make a point about a different entry. I am not suggesting adding or cutting it.

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SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#1757: May 28th 2021 at 1:11:13 AM

The example ooh brought up is definitively a fringe view and needs to be cut. The Xinnie controversy is far better known and even that does not quite count as overshadowed.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
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#1758: May 28th 2021 at 9:11:58 AM

From the main page, under Films — Animation:

As is, it borders on ZCE. Here's why I brought it up though. I am aware of the controversy over the Troubled Production, and at one point I would argue it did kind of overshadow the movie. However, today the film (at least as far as I have seen) is less well-remembered for that, and more for being criticized for being excessively edgy (or praised for its message about religion,) which themselves are not controversies. What should I do? Does the controversy still overshadow the film, or has it faded?

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Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#1759: May 28th 2021 at 9:31:57 AM

Never heard of the controversy, honestly. Also never seen the film.

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Nightshade92 from The Big Rotten Apple Since: Mar, 2021 Relationship Status: Remembering what Mama said
#1760: May 28th 2021 at 9:46:40 AM

[up][up] I also remember that controversy, and I agree that it no longer overshadows the movie. At this point I don’t think the movie itself is really “overshadowed” by anything.

Old Enough to Be Your Absurdly Youthful Mother
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#1761: May 28th 2021 at 9:52:36 AM

I think things that used to be OBC can be added, if they're particularly notable cases and/or held that status for a significant amount of time (I'd say at least a year).

DDRMASTERM do you wanna have a bad time? from Someplace, Utah, USA Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
do you wanna have a bad time?
#1762: May 28th 2021 at 10:14:08 AM

[up]Agreed.

WackyPancake from My computer. Since: May, 2011
#1763: May 28th 2021 at 10:57:53 AM

The only discourse I generally see around that movie is that it's criminally unfunny. I have heard something about workers being mistreated during its production, but not nearly enough to "overshadow" it.

"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
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#1764: May 28th 2021 at 11:36:17 AM

I think the movie's unfunny (except I think the Signature Scene is stupid-hilarious), but there's a lot of people who love it. And that doesn't count as "controversy" anyway.

It was controversial but I don't know if it overshadowed the film for very long. It didn't overshadow its theatrical release because the info came out after the film came out, I think?

Edited by mightymewtron on May 28th 2021 at 2:36:38 PM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
SkylaNoivern Since: Sep, 2016
#1765: Jun 5th 2021 at 7:55:06 AM

I'm starting to wonder if the list of historical US Presidents and Roman emperors on the Real Life section read like walls of texts that mostly consist of what bad things they did.

Nightshade92 from The Big Rotten Apple Since: Mar, 2021 Relationship Status: Remembering what Mama said
#1766: Jun 5th 2021 at 8:00:59 AM

[up] Oof, that politician section needs a serious clean up. Re: the US presidents, I would say that Buchanan, Hoover, and probably Harding can definitely have entries. I don’t think anyone else counts, except maybe Ford (I didn’t read the entry very closely tho).

There’s also an entry in that section that lists a bunch of countries allegedly overshadowed by ex-leaders which seems like an obvious cut.

Edited by Nightshade92 on Jun 5th 2021 at 11:02:35 AM

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WackyPancake from My computer. Since: May, 2011
#1767: Jun 5th 2021 at 8:04:27 AM

Wrong thread.

Edited by WackyPancake on Jun 5th 2021 at 5:04:54 PM

"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."
DDRMASTERM do you wanna have a bad time? from Someplace, Utah, USA Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
do you wanna have a bad time?
#1768: Jun 6th 2021 at 12:04:30 PM

Going through the US presidents examples:

  • For the duration of his life and for over a century afterward, seventh President Andrew Jackson was a much-beloved leader, presiding over an era of massive economic and territorial expansion for the country. His reputation has taken a significant hit in modern times, however, due to increased attention to some of the worst human rights abuses committed by an American president: Jackson was, more than any POTUS before or since, notoriously brutal toward Native Americans, with his policies including the infamous "Trail of Tears," in which the Amerindian nations known as the Five Civilized Tribes were forced under threat of violence to migrate on foot from their traditional homes in the Southeast to a reservation in what is now Oklahoma, resulting in thousands of preventable deaths. So fierce and deadly were Jackson's anti-Native American policies that they've been retroactively classified by some modern historians as acts of genocide. Also frequently brought up is the fact that Jackson killed two people in duels and bragged about it, and that he made one of the largest power-grabs in Presidential history by overruling a Supreme Court decision (something explicitly prohibited in the Constitution and which earned him a great deal of criticism and even compared his actions to monarchism in this political cartoon.). Today, even most historians who think he was a successful President will typically add the caveat that he was among the morally worst holders of the office.

Maybe. Andrew Jackson is highly controversial President in hindsight for many of these reasons, but one who is also credited for some impressive accomplishments (like being the only president to fully pay off the national debt). Could use some trimming though if kept.

  • James Buchanan is known less for anything he did and more for something he didn't do: prevent a devastating rebellion. He was president during the lead-up to the American Civil War when tensions over slavery reached unprecedented heights. When several southern states seceded from the Union after Abraham Lincoln won the 1860 election, Buchanan refused to intervene, under the questionable legal logic that while secession was illegal, taking action to stop it was also illegal. By the end, he was only interested in holding off the now-inevitable shooting conflict long enough to pass the buck to Lincoln. Not helping matters was the fact that he'd previously ordered military action in Utah Territory to attack the Mormons and their Native American allies, leading to accusations of gross hypocrisy. While it's doubtful that he could have done much to defuse the tensions prior to the election, his failure to stop the secession or even protect federal property in the South from being seized by the nascent Confederate States of America meant he was the president most to blame for the subsequent civil war. Because of this, while Lincoln is universally considered one of America's best presidents for bringing the country back together, Buchanan is considered one of the worst, if not the worst, for letting it be divided in the first place.

I'd say cut. Buchanan is widely acclaimed as one of the worst US presidents ever, so I'm not sure what there is to discuss about him except controversy

  • Rutherford B. Hayes is relatively obscure today,note  and those who do know who he is know him first and foremost for the extremely controversial circumstances of his election to the presidency rather than anything he actually did while in office. Nominated as a compromise candidate and nicknamed the "Great Unknown" by the general public during the campaign due to him being a political cipher, the election proved extremely close and was marred by allegations of severe electoral misconduct by Democrats and Republicans alike. In the end, Hayes' ascendancy was secured in a backroom deal, and his detractors would refer to him as "Rutherfraud", a name that has stuck to this day.

Probably cut. The circumstances around his election were perhaps notorious, especially as one of the few "popular vote loser wins election" results. But I'm doubtful that by itself qualifies.

  • Woodrow Wilson is best known for his foreign policy work, working to keep the United States out of World War One until it was no longer possible, then building up a vast military and economy to support it, bringing the United States fully onto the world stage. After the war, he worked to prevent the next one by supporting the League of Nations and continued to push for the US to maintain a strong presence in world affairs. He is widely admired for his idealism (even if it didn't all go according to his design), but his domestic policies were much less positive. Wilson was a racist even by standards of the daynote , had The Birth of a Nation (1915) as the first motion picture screened in the White House (though he did have a lower opinion of it than popular culture would have you believe, correctly worrying that the film would make incidents of racial violence worse than ever before), and talked about how African-Americans were better cared for under slavery. As President of Princeton University, he encouraged historical revisionism of the American Civil War toward a pro-Southern perspective, consequently being credited with popularizing the "Lost Cause" myth of the Confederacynote , and was the only scholar quoted in Birth of a Nation. He also introduced photo identification into the Federal Civil Service to make it easier to make sure that higher jobs went to people of the "right" color. In more recent years, this racist legacy has overshadowed his foreign-policy achievements, leading to memorials and buildings being renamed. In wonderful irony, Woodrow Wilson Hall at Monmouth Universitynote  is to be renamed for its co-designer Julian Abele, considered the first professional African-American architect.

Also a maybe. He's known probably most prominently for his efforts in international relations, but his nasty racism (even by the standards of the time) is also an inescapable aspect of his presidency. Also shorten if kept.

  • Warren Harding's rather short presidency has largely eclipsed by cronyism and corruption. The most notorious corruption case was the Teapot Dome scandal in which private companies bribed Secretary of Interior Albert B. Fall into selling off federal oil reserves at low rates without competitive bidding. On top of that, Harding also packed his administration with personal friends dubbed the "Ohio gang", several of whom were investigate but not indicted for bribery and fraud. Because of the scandals, Harding's name became synonymous with corruption until Nixon came along.

Keep. Aside from his very short time as president, his corruption is his biggest legacy.

  • Herbert Hoover's reputation was irreconcilably tainted by The Great Depression beginning on his watch and the perception of him being unable to properly address it, which in turn led to him ultimately losing badly in his re-election attempt in 1932. Nowadays, he is largely only remembered as the one-term president that badly mishandled the Great Depression.

Probably keep. Few presidents have been dealt a worse hand than he was, and bungled it so badly.

  • Lyndon B. Johnson is better remembered by many today as the man who ramped up America's involvement in the very controversial Vietnam War, later being forced to give up his initial bid to seek re-election because of it. This despite his hand in such major accomplishments as the Civil and Voting Rights acts, the War on Poverty (which, unlike the War on Drugs, was explicitly meant to benefit impoverished and otherwise lower-class Americans), and the creation of Medicare, among other major domestic accomplishments.

Maybe. The Vietnam War is a central part of his legacy, though so too was his passage of the Civil Rights Act.

  • Richard Nixon's presidency has been overshadowed by the Watergate scandal, which led to him being the only President to resign. Other memorable events during his administration, even good ones like him opening relationships with China, have been forgotten except for history buffs. Watergate is an especially interesting case in that it blotted out not only the positive aspects of Nixon's presidency but also earlier controversies and scandals related to him, as well. Few people discuss, for instance, his close association with Southern racists and rolling back of civil rights gains made under Kennedy and Johnson, nor his support for authoritarian regimes in Latin America due to seeing them as necessary buffers against communism.

Absolutely keep. The sheer infamy of Watergate single-handedly created its own trope, and overwhelmingly dominates discussion and discourse around him.

  • Gerald Ford managed to lead the nation out of the shadow of Watergate, and he even managed to bring the nation into a very brief economic boom. But Ford's leadership was completely blotted out by his pardoning of Richard Nixon for his involvement in Watergate, an overwhelmingly loathed decision that played a crucial role in costing Ford the White House to Jimmy Carter in 1976. Many people felt that Nixon should've faced criminal charges and that Ford was normalizing government corruption by pardoning Nixon. Also not helping is how Ford failed to publicly explain at the time why he pardoned Nixon, which in turn lead to accusations that there was a corrupt deal in which Ford would become president in exchange for the pardon.

Probably also keep, just because of how outraged people were at the time over the pardon.

  • Bill Clinton oversaw the largest economic expansion since the end of the postwar period (even if a lot of the .com stuff was a speculative bubble), signed a far-reaching trade deal with America's then-largest trading partners Canada and Mexico, helped negotiate the Good Friday Agreement which all but ended The Troubles, oversaw the Oslo Accords that led to direct Palestinian control over some the disputed territories with Israel, and became the first American president in at least a century to balance the federal budget (and the last). However, Clinton is also most remembered for his sex scandal with White House intern Monica Lewinsky, which led him to be only the second president in American history to be impeached. Note, however, that this did not hurt his popularity at the time; in fact, it backfired on his opponents, as many people saw the impeachment as a nakedly partisan power-grab (especially since Newt Gingrich, who helped spearhead it, was known to have had extramarital affairs himself) — Clinton's approval rating increased during the hearings, and he left office as one of the most popular presidents of the modern era. Unfortunately for Clinton, he lost much of his support for good in the late '10s when he was among the many powerful men accused of sexual misconduct in the wake of the Harvey Weinstein scandal (see below), with even the Lewinsky scandal being revisited as possible sexual abuse because of the vast power imbalance between a president and an intern, something that even Lewinsky herself began to question. His connections with the deceased billionaire sex offender Jeffrey Epstein certainly haven't helped. His economic policies have also become more controversial as of late, with many on both the left and right identifying him as part of the "neoliberal" school of thought that they blame for outsourcing jobs, stagnating wages, and allowing unrestricted corporate growth, which in turn was credited with leading to the 21st century's major recessions.

Possibly. His sex scandal isn't something he's ever going to live down, but that might be the better trope than this one (not that they're mutually exclusive). Perhaps a trimming if kept.

  • George W. Bush's presidency is almost exclusively associated with his poor handling of the Second Gulf Warnote  and Hurricane Katrina, and to a lesser extent the financial collapse and ensuing Great Recession that happened on his watch. Also, there are still conspiracy theories floating around alleging that his people somehow masterminded the September 11th attacks (usually framed as an excuse for the aforementioned Gulf War 2.0). What had at the end of 2001 been a highly-regarded presidency had become, by the end of 2008, one of the worst-regarded in American history, with Bush's approval ratings in particular eventually going from the highest ever recorded to the lowest ever recorded. Even after historians came to the consensus that Bush was more of a figurehead under Vice President Dick Cheney (generally considered the real ringleader as a result of the sheer power he held), Bush still bears the brunt of the blame for his administration's failures among the general public to this day.

Probably keep, most discussions of Bush tend to revolve around the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, with the occasional discussion of his actions during the 2008 crash also being a factor.

Edited by DDRMASTERM on Jun 6th 2021 at 2:54:33 AM

WackyPancake from My computer. Since: May, 2011
#1769: Jun 6th 2021 at 12:24:14 PM

Absolutely keep the part about Clinton. I'm not American, but the first thing I think of when I hear Clinton's name is "that time he time frigged his secretary". Maybe it's sort of unfair, but it kinda is his most enduring legacy and basis of most media portrayals.

I don't know about Ford. I'd see that him pardoning Nixon would be extremely controversial, but people don't usually discuss that when they talk about him. They mostly say that he was a very unremarkable President that did not do much of anything (although to be fair he didn't have much time), that he bumbled into the presidency almost completely by accident, and that he fell down a lot.

I think these sort of articles should focus not on these people's policies, but on their media portrayals. It's what the wiki is about.

To that extent, if any president does not have a particularly large presence in pop culture, it can probably be cut. Keep the ones that are culturally relevant to this day.

I'd also say we take a look The Men of Downing Street, which likely has the exact same issue.

It's also kinda a bit provincialist. Since this is an English language wiki, every single President/PM ever gets an article. But if I did that for my country, people would raise eyebrows. The only leader of my country that has a page is Francisco Franco, and honestly, that's fine.

Edited by WackyPancake on Jun 6th 2021 at 9:27:07 PM

"I like girls, but now, it's about justice."
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
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#1770: Jun 6th 2021 at 3:20:13 PM

When I think of Jackson, I remember that my highschool history class had us get into groups and debate on Jackson's politics to see if we'd impeach him or not. Mostly, when I hear about him it's in reference to the Native Americans or the Banks, and both in a negative context. Jackson might've been able to get things done, but he is a highly controversial president.

The question is, is is controversial nature the only thing people remember about him?

And TBH, I'm not sure most political figures can even technically apply for this trope anyway, since the things they're controversial for are things they did as political figures (in most cases) and it's sort of like saying that their career overshadows their career.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 6th 2021 at 6:21:51 AM

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#1771: Jun 6th 2021 at 3:24:37 PM

The only thing I know about Jackson besides being on money and having a musical about him is his racism, especially the Indian Removal Act. But that might be my own political biases speaking.

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bowserbros No longer active. from Elsewhere Since: May, 2014
No longer active.
#1772: Jun 6th 2021 at 4:05:25 PM

Hey, I know I haven't posted on the forums at all in my 7 years of being on this site, but after taking some time off throughout most of April and May, I've been trying to clean up a lot of my past messes on the wiki. As someone who contributed to the sheer bloat of the US presidents section (among other problematic edits I made in the past that I've been gradually weeding out), I feel I ought to do at least something to help with fixing this section.

I'd agree with DDRMASTERM regarding which ones to keep or cut for the most part. With Jackson he still ranks highly in opinion polls, so his reputation might be more negative among historians than among the general public. Wilson's a huge "maybe" because of how much more recently his reputation has declined compared to other presidents; until last year I mainly heard Wilson brought up in regards to his handling of World War I with little to no talk of his domestic policies. Then again that may just be because of how big the impact of WWI was.

With LBJ I'd say that there's a chance of him counting considering how deep the association between him and Vietnam is (though granted the "deeply associated" part of the Laconic page was added by HMSaph last February), while with Bush you could probably trim his point down to Iraq considering that in hindsight, it tends to be brought up way more than Katrina and the Recession.

Then again, as someone from the US I may also be approaching this with a heavy amount of Americentrism, since the presidents point as a whole was written with respect to their reputation within America rather than around the world. Still, if we were to keep the "maybe" points and cut the "definitely not" ones as DDRMASTERM lists them, my proposed idea is something like this:


  • Though Andrew Jackson spent over two centuries regarded as one of the most beloved presidents in US history, since the latter half of the 20th century, his reputation has been primarily defined by his anti-Native American policies. So severe and deadly were these measures and their effects that some historians have retroactively classified them as acts of genocide, and even those who describe him as a successful president frequently add the caveat that he was one of the morally worst officeholders.
  • Woodrow Wilson's legacy was defined for ages by his adept handling of US involvement in World War I and his idealistic foreign policy. However, in the 21st century it has been more heavily defined by his outward racism (reflected in his re-segregating of federal offices), to the extent where it led to many monuments and buildings named after him to rebrand themselves.
  • Warren Harding's relatively short tenure as president is primarily defined by its heavy corruption, with many members of his inner circle being investigated for bribery and fraud. The most notorious of these incidents, the Teapot Dome scandal, is widely considered by historians to be the biggest American political scandal pre-Watergate and resulted in Harding's name becoming synonymous with political corruption for half a century.

[Hoover you could probably leave as-is.]

  • Though his passage of the Civil Rights Act is widely considered one of the most important domestic accomplishments in the 20th century, Lyndon Johnson is more deeply associated with his escalation of US involvement in The Vietnam War, to the extent where the mass protests over it ultimately forced him to end his reelection campaign.
  • Richard Nixon's reputation as president is almost entirely defined by the Watergate Scandal. The affair was regarded as the biggest American political scandal in US history (to the point where it named a trope), ended in Nixon becoming the only president to resign, and resulted in him being consistently rated as one of the nation's worst presidents. Like Harding, his name became synonymous with political corruption in the ensuing decades.
  • While his tenure was considered mostly unremarkable, Gerald Ford's legacy is heavily defined by his decision to pardon Nixon after his resignation. The decision was met with staunch criticism at the time and played a direct role in his reelection loss to Jimmy Carter in 1976, and if Ford isn't brought up today to joke about his clumsiness, usually it's to mention the Nixon pardon.
  • Though Bill Clinton's presidency was marked by a myriad of both accomplishments and flash-in-the-pan scandals, the most notable element of his reputation is his affair with White House intern Monika Lewinsky. The scandal surrounding it led Clinton to become only the second president ever to be impeached, and though he was acquitted and became more popular for a couple decades afterwards, it continues to be an elephant in the room in regards to his legacy.
  • George W. Bush's reputation as president is almost entirely defined by his poor handling of the Iraq War, largely due to the rationale behind it being debunked as false and due to the political turmoil it caused in the Middle East. Even in the face of other negative events during his tenure that led to a record-breakingly-low approval rating, his mishandling of Iraq continues to be the most defining element of his political legacy.

Again, this is based entirely on DDRMASTERM's suggestions, and if consensus decides to cut any of the ones listed here, I'll oblige.

Edited by bowserbros on Jun 6th 2021 at 4:11:08 AM

Be kind.
Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#1773: Jun 6th 2021 at 4:25:56 PM

[up] Andrew Jackson's entry sounds more like a Condemned by History example, and even then, I'm not sure if Condemned by History accepts IRL people as examples.

Eh, good enough.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#1774: Jun 6th 2021 at 4:26:34 PM

Like I said, I'm really not sure most political examples even count since it's still their politics we're talking about.

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#1775: Jun 6th 2021 at 4:27:58 PM

Yeah I Mean this is their career. What's their to shadow of its decisions they made their?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."

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