General Isekai Thread

Weak in terms of power, at least. Strongly characterized, I would say.

But yeah, at the beginning of Grimgar a party of five struggle to kill a single goblin (and have to deal with the weight of the act afterward), and Subaru in Re:Zero has never succeeded in brute-forcing a problem that I know of.

It's been fun.

The MCs in No Game No Life are not really weak in power considering how that universe is configured. It's pandering to their strengths. Although they're not really overpowered considering all the stupidly powerful powers some other races have.

Another of my favourite isekais is Dog Days. It's cute and fluffy fun. And the earth characters travel back and forth.

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I just realized that the first series of Digimon was my first encounter with Isekai. Now that one was definitely off setting it's own path. Looking back, it probably had more in common with Grimgar than anything else we've mentioned, with the large cast of people who have no idea what is going on whisked away to another world.

"What a century this week has been." - Seung Min Kim

Digimon is much more of a Mons Series than an isekai series. The only real reason for it being an isekai is that it allows for people from "our" world to fight with Mons. So that's why it's got more common with those.

Edited by AnotherDuck on Jan 13th 2019 at 4:26:05 PM

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Don't see why it can't be both. Plenty of Mons series take place solely in their own made-up world or have the Mons come to ours. Heck, Digimon does that latter on itself.

If the bookstore can have New Supernatural Teen Romance as it's own genre, I feel that Isekai-Mons deserves it's own place somewhere between all the Isekai-Comedies and Isekai-Harems.

"What a century this week has been." - Seung Min Kim

Three Hearts and Three Lions was a major influence on Dungeons & Dragons; both it and the D&D cartoon are about normal people transported to another world and empowered.

3H3L also shares a surprising number of elements with modern isekai.

Edited by Prime32 on Jan 13th 2019 at 4:45:08 PM

Kinda depends on how you define overpowered, doesn't it? Like Koushaku Reijou no Tashinami's protagonist is overpowered... because she knows how to do double book accounting and make hair conditioner.

Also depends on how broadly you define isekai, I suppose.

I feel like there's a difference between isekai as a descriptor of setting and isekai as shorthand for the suite of tropes (truck-kun, reincarnation, Analyze Is Overpowered, etc.) that is the current trend in light novels and so on. It's the dictionary definition ("involves another world", period) versus... well, any definition that is more constrained than that. So shows like Inuyasha and Digimon count as isekai under the dictionary definition, but not under the shorthand definition, and that makes it less useful as a descriptor for shows like that. You need a completely different set of criteria in your toolbox to understand something like Yu Yu Hakusho compared to Another World With My Smartphone or so on, even though they both involve a second world.

It's been fun.

I don't think most people would consider Inuyasha isekai since returning from the past is too easy. I don't think you're supposed to be able to return on demand. I'm really more wondering if isekai has to involve magic or super powers or at least fighting. I feel uncomfortable saying that Reijou Tashinami or Destruction Flag Otome are isekai, for example, but they're both reincarnated in a different world stories.

Yeah, those don't feel like isekai, but are still a bit iffy since they involve a lot more previous knowledge on the part of the main character... Tashinami seems to go almost immediately into new stuff where the main character doesn't have prior game knowledge.

(Speaking of, I just had another Kumo moment realizing that even 'reincarnating as the villainous ex-fiancee in an otome game' isn't a unique premise. Damn. I definitely still prefer Destruction Flag Otome more, though.)

(Also also, can Tashinami just go for an Iris/Tanya ship? Looks like it is.)

Edited by RedSavant on Jan 13th 2019 at 12:17:28 PM

It's been fun.

Yeah so far as I'm aware Destruction Flag Otome is actually something of a parody of that specific subgenre of reincarnating as the villainess. Too bad the translation died. And then Tashinami's quality varies wildly in quality from translator to translator. The current one is like an unedited machine translation.

But yeah, those aren't isekai even if they technically fit the definition. Kumo is kind of funny in that respect because the MC is definitely OP but it's kind of to be expected given that she's the villain. She's supposed to be way too strong. The actual hero is treated by the people around him like he's OP but is really just a small fry.

Edited by Arha on Jan 13th 2019 at 11:51:59 AM

And yet everyone seems to agree that Gate is an isekai, even though the protagonist can go back through the gate (that is controlled by the Japanese military) any time he wants (provided he is given permission by his hierarchy, or manages to sneak through).

Edited by gropcbf on Jan 13th 2019 at 6:58:38 PM

Orenchi ni Kita Onna Kishi to Inakagurashi Surukotoninatta Ken ("The Matter Regarding the Female Knight Who Came to Live With Me in the Countryside") is another reverse isekai series. The premise might sound like Magical Girlfriend, but the protagonist is a well-adjusted widower and the knight is depressed and homesick.

There's also a Gender Flip example with Buta Koshaku ni Tensei Shitakara, Kondo wa Kimi ni Suki to Iitai ("Because I've Been Reincarnated as the Piggy Duke, This Time I Will Say I Like You").

Edited by Prime32 on Jan 13th 2019 at 6:09:41 PM

GATE does have an OP protagonist, in the form of the JSDF being handy, and a harem though, so it's checking some of those modern Isekai boxes.

Or would the JSDF itself be considered the protagonist?

The setting is more traditional fantasy than JRPG fantasy though.

Edited by Parable on Jan 13th 2019 at 11:19:49 AM

"What a century this week has been." - Seung Min Kim

GATE stand out in that it tends to demonize everyone who's not JSDF or don't support them in BOTH fantasy world and so-called "real" world.

Edited by VeryVileVillian on Jan 13th 2019 at 10:28:54 PM

Don't see how I ever implied as much.

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You know going back on a whole family unit being transported to a magical world. I was thinking it would be interesting if they tried to set up a new life there and run a business. It would be a family sitcom in an isekai setting.

Back in the day, the science fiction equivalent was the Planetary Romance where a dude from Earth would be transported to an alien planet (sometimes indistinguishably from a fantasy transport) and turn out to be the most awesome dude they'd ever seen due to lower gravity giving him superpowers or his advanced Earth fighting techniques being centuries beyond the primitive local styles. Usually not so much on the harem, our hero would stick to his one princess, and repel the advances of the other women panting for his body.

The subgenre kind of died out as science fiction moved away from straight up adventure stories towards more scientific realism.

But there were fantasy versions too, enough that I read one story from the 1930s that initially made me cringe...until I realized it was a deadpan parody.

If we want to mention old sci-fi unrelated to anime & manga, one can mention Planet of the Apes (1968) or Planet of Adventure. In both cases the protagonist goes out on his way and takes a spaceship to the isekai.

Isekai is very old indeed. And then Gulliver's Travels is isekai as well.

Again showing isekai concepts have been as old as the past two century.

As someone who doesn't mind the use of analysis skills in these stories, what makes Kumo so different?

Gulliver never got a harem, he just became a misanthrope.

I think when people mock isekai, they mock the power fantasy inherent in the setup that a lot of modern formulas use. Ending up in another world is a trope as old as fantasy, but it's a recent stereotype of the loser that gains everything.

Calling Gulliver's Travels an Isekai is a stretch. It's a travelogue, a genre that no longer functions as speculative fiction because these days the idea that there are entire countries somewhere on earth that we know nothing about is no longer plausible. I guess you could claim it as a precursor to Isekai, but I, personally, am drawing a line in the sand where if nobody ever goes to different world, it doesn't count as Isekai.

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Star Trek is Isekai.

"What a century this week has been." - Seung Min Kim

@Gilphon

Gullivar's Travels as a good isekai would be interesting.