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Not Tropeworthy: Five Bad Band

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Deadlock Clock: Sep 28th 2018 at 11:59:00 PM
QuantumMelody29 Trivialis, absent-minded Goddess of fact from somewhere you will never find me. Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Trivialis, absent-minded Goddess of fact
Aug 21st 2018 at 1:29:09 AM

Maybe also have a long term cleanup effort as a third?

Quite trivial, really?
Adept Plate of Germs from The Colony Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Plate of Germs
Aug 21st 2018 at 8:17:23 AM

We already have a clean-up thread for Five Mand Band in the long term projects, which also covers Five Bad Band.

naturalironist from The Information Superhighway Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Aug 21st 2018 at 9:02:50 AM

I don't think lock page is a good option- there is misuse throughout the wiki, so locking won't do anything.

In another point against this trope, I think the Elite Four should cover most situations where there is a team dynamic but the powers aren't opposite the heroes like in the Psycho Rangers.

Edited by naturalironist on Aug 21st 2018 at 12:04:30 PM

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"
papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Aug 21st 2018 at 3:47:57 PM

I'd rather lock it then leave it unlocked since that encourages more misuse. We did the same thing to Five-Man Band and it has helped.

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papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Aug 24th 2018 at 4:14:57 PM

If we decide to keep this trope we should redefine it to have only 5 characters and only female Dark Chicks.

  • Rplace the last sentence for the The Dark Chick paragraph with "This character is Always Female."
  • Change the last paragraph to "When adding entries to this list, please follow the order as listed above. Also remember, the individual character tropes are very specific character types. It is tempting to match one or two possible characters and then shove other characters in a Quirky Miniboss Squad to fit this trope. Like the Five-Man Band, they have a team dynamic, not just vague personality quirks. Also note that like Five-Man Band there must be five characters who each fit each trope individually, do not list any extra members or put one character under multiple tropes"

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papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Aug 24th 2018 at 4:26:04 PM

Also should we enforce the rule of only 1 or 2 female characters per team like in Five-Man Band.

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papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Aug 25th 2018 at 8:04:08 PM

Also I actually went through all of the subpages and less than half meet the number requirement with over half of those having male Dark Chicks this is without bringing up the lack of the proper team dynamic which I noticed in a number of examples from works that I know of which to me means that most examples lack that dynamic. Finally Legion of Doom is a good replacement trope.

Edited by papyru30 on Sep 16th 2018 at 3:04:34 AM

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SeptimusHeap MOD from Southern Italy Relationship Status: Mu
papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Sep 28th 2018 at 10:22:13 PM

Here's the crowner.

BTW the floor is still open for any discussion or proposed changes to the crowner.

Edited by papyru30 on Sep 28th 2018 at 11:46:11 AM

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nrjxll Relationship Status: Not war
Sep 29th 2018 at 3:56:31 AM

While I'm 100 percent on board the "it's not a separate trope" train, I do kinda think the crowner options are a bit stark. Particularly given the weird obsession some portion of this site has with shoehorning Five-Man Band, I kinda feel like there ought to be more discussion of alternatives short of cutting. (Again, I voted for cutting, so this isn't an argument against it so much as for a lengthier process).

Adept Plate of Germs from The Colony Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Plate of Germs
Sep 29th 2018 at 7:13:31 AM

The crowner options are not showing up for me.

Sep 29th 2018 at 7:33:21 AM

I think there is a villainous team dynamic that crops up enough to be troped but which is not the mirror of Five-Man Band. In that sense, I agree that Five Bad Band shouldn't exist because it is defined so strongly as the Evil Counterpart to Five-Man Band that it's not attempting to trope what really exists in works that have villainous team dynamics.

For example, people talk in terms of the evil team being led by the Big Bad. In my experience, works where the villainous team dynamic might mirror the Five-Man Band dynamic are actually led by The Heavy not the Big Bad. In these cases, the Big Bad has a protagonist counterpart — but in the form of the Big Good rather than The Hero, who is also unlikely to be part of the Five-Man Band.

If Five Bad Band is to be kept, it needs to be rewritten and reimagined to reflect the villainous team dynamics that actually exist in works. At the moment it's just troping a trope instead of troping works.

Edit: misread The Psycho Rangers trope, so forget about this bit.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Sep 29th 2018 at 3:45:03 PM

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KazuyaProta Porky from A Industrial Farm Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Porky
Sep 29th 2018 at 7:41:00 AM

I personally recommend keeping it. There so many derivates of it (The Brute, The Dark Chick, etc) that erasing the "Mother trope" would be pretty weird. Locking it and having a clean up thread is the best choice IMO.

Watch me destroying my country
Sep 29th 2018 at 7:48:17 AM

[up] Well, The Psycho Rangers states that the villainous team mirrors the protagonists' team as both a collective and in terms of specific individuals/powers as well. Works where the protagonists form a Five-Man Band and the villains are The Psycho Rangers will be using tropes like The Dark Chick because the villainous team will need a counterparty to The Chick. Those tropes therefore won't be obsolete.

Then again, I find it bizarre that Five-Man Band tropes can be used as independent tropes when Five-Man Band isn't in play in a work, so what do I know?

Edited by Wyldchyld on Sep 29th 2018 at 3:53:55 PM

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SeptimusHeap from Southern Italy Relationship Status: Mu
Sep 29th 2018 at 7:49:37 AM

Um, all of these tropes can exist without this one.

naturalironist from The Information Superhighway Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Sep 29th 2018 at 7:57:54 AM

Just a reminder to the crowd that hooked crowners don't work, so you will need to click the link in post 34 (or here).

I think Five Bad Band is largely covered by the Psycho Rangers and Elite Four.

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"
Sep 29th 2018 at 11:51:53 AM

Does anyone have a list of valid Five Bad Band examples? I want to say cut because I can't think of any examples when I can think of several good Five-Man Band examples.

papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Sep 29th 2018 at 3:09:42 PM

nrjxll, what options do you suggest then, I think that just changing the definition wouldn't be enough and I can't think of any other options.

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Karxrida Rokket Lawnchair from Darkness within Darkness Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
Rokket Lawnchair
Sep 29th 2018 at 3:36:05 PM

I voted to cut.

The trope is trying so hard to be something that doesn't really exist just to have an Evil Counterpart to Five-Man Band (which already has its own problems with how it's used), and any rework would probably just end up as a duplicate or way too similar to The Psycho Rangers and/or Elite Four.

Edited by Karxrida on Sep 29th 2018 at 3:39:50 AM

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody remembers it, who else will you have ice cream with?
papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Sep 30th 2018 at 10:21:23 PM

EDIT: I would like the crowner called now

[down] You mean Five Bad Band right?

Edited by papyru30 on Oct 6th 2018 at 11:41:16 AM

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SeptimusHeap MOD from Southern Italy Relationship Status: Mu
Oct 6th 2018 at 10:19:18 AM

Calling crowner in favour of cutting Five-Man Band.

Lymantria "Mordor!" from Toronto Relationship Status: Seeking boyfriend-free girl
"Mordor!"
Oct 6th 2018 at 12:14:14 PM

Just noting: We don't usually outright cut tropes with 1,000 wicks and 18,000 inbounds, but hey, we cut Hey Its That Guy and Hey Its That Voice, which both had (to the best of my memory) about 10,000 wicks and thousands of inbounds. Any valid examples will probably be moved to The Psycho Rangers or a similar trope.

Join the Five-Man Band cleanup project!
papyru30 The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru from Colorado Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
The Powerfu Popula Prestigiou Papyru
Oct 6th 2018 at 3:02:15 PM

Not all of the examples are Psycho Rangers (most of the ones from works I know are not). I'll delete wicks for the ones I know aren't and make a list of the ones I'm not sure about for people on this thread to look at. I'll also remove wicks from non-work/work subpages so that it's easier to deal with.

Edited by papyru30 on Oct 6th 2018 at 4:26:05 AM

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Lymantria "Mordor!" from Toronto Relationship Status: Seeking boyfriend-free girl
WaterBlap Blapper of Water Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Blapper of Water
Oct 7th 2018 at 9:15:33 AM

[up] It's normal to actually spell out which tropes are appropriate. Doing so will help current and future cleaners. So far, it sounds like The Psycho Rangers and maybe also the Quirky Miniboss Squad? Would the Elite Four be relevant to the clean-up (but not necessarily so)?

[witty saying]

Page Action: Five Bad Band
28th Sep '18 10:04:35 PM
What would be the best way to fix the page?
At issue:
Five Bad Band

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