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Joker film series (by Todd Phillips)

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dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#1601: Oct 8th 2024 at 9:40:36 AM

I'd assume the De Niro "You think this is funny?" Bit from the first one is getting a lot of mileage.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#1602: Oct 8th 2024 at 9:51:04 AM

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/sony_warner_brothers_have_announced_the_ultimate_crossover_v0_1j2k036rqrrc1.jpeg Morbius got the last laugh.

Just Makima.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#1603: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:18:28 AM

Todd Phillips: Everyone says that about [Heath Ledger's] Joker. "Joker's nihilistic." I'm like, okay, "No, Joker's cool." He gets to go to mafia meetings and blow up hospitals. Okay? I want to do that. But he doesn't, like, get raped in prison. That could happen in my movie. If you want to talk about dark, that's how that would go.

Edited by FOFD on Oct 8th 2024 at 2:20:13 PM

Ego-Man25 Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#1604: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:24:00 AM

Was that an actual quote from Todd Philips?

Self-professed Wild Card who thinks cynicism isn't so bad.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#1605: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:24:48 AM

Oh no, it was a quote from Zack Snyder.

It was a whole thing that got meme'd about years back that Snyder's vision for the DCEU was being edgy and dark, and he vaguely implied that Batman could be sexually assaulted in his movies.

Edited by FOFD on Oct 8th 2024 at 2:26:28 PM

Ego-Man25 Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#1606: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:42:08 AM

Speaking honestly here though, words cannot do justice to my sheer level of disappointment that they felt the need to throw in a rape scene at all. That is the kind of fucked-up territory that needs to be earned, something this film clearly didn't do, and it makes me wonder why the fuck they thought this was a good idea. To be EDGY? Hell if I fucking know.

Self-professed Wild Card who thinks cynicism isn't so bad.
The10thGeek Mysterious Fan from Somewhere in England Since: Feb, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Mysterious Fan
#1607: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:45:37 AM

[up]To be fair and honest with you, from what I heard about Phillips when I was on Reddit about five years ago, that wouldn’t surprise me one little bit.

TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#1608: Oct 8th 2024 at 11:54:42 AM

This exact scenario being a 4Chan greentext meme before the movie came out says it all.

Once Upon A Time.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#1609: Oct 8th 2024 at 12:01:48 PM

I honestly have trouble interpreting that scene. There's evidence for and against

  • We see the guards emotionally and physically abusing Arthur earlier, and he's clearly dazed/or in shock when they throw him in the cell. He's very clearly injured/upset when they strip him and the energy of this scene is that the abuse he's receiving is going a step beyond the norm. His jacket's still on but his pants are removed which I think is, well, a common metaphor specifically for male rape. His sudden change in demeanor occurs in the very next scene, and assault would explain that, certainly. For the first time in the movie Arthur seems utterly defeated.
  • The one guard who participated in this did seem genuinely concerned about Arthur's behavior, they established earlier that the guards clean/shave him. There's nothing explicitly shown and they appear to be angry that he's talking crap about them, and we're not led to believe any of them are molesters/rapists prior to this.
  • I was more focused on the inmate being strangled in that scene, so did the rape happen before he was dragged to his cell, or was the slow close-up supposed to be a metaphor for this happening and, if so, why have the inmate be strangled at all. The movie never discusses or elaborates on it because the courtroom explodes. None of the guards face comeuppance.

The most I want to say is that it was very very clumsily handled if it did happen, and the movie's weirdest most uncomfortable moment if it didn't.

This makes two comic book adaptions this year where male rape was glossed over.

Edited by FOFD on Oct 8th 2024 at 3:20:06 PM

Ego-Man25 Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#1610: Oct 8th 2024 at 12:05:55 PM

Severe Spoilers For Invincible's Animated Adaptation: I swear to god, they better not fumble the ball a fucking third time with Mark. They need to treat that scene seriously.

Self-professed Wild Card who thinks cynicism isn't so bad.
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#1611: Oct 8th 2024 at 12:12:36 PM

[up][up] What was the other movie that did that?

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Hawkeye86 Spirit of Battle from Classified (Searching for Spock) Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
Spirit of Battle
#1612: Oct 8th 2024 at 12:16:12 PM

The Boys

You and I remember Budapest very differently
Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#1613: Oct 8th 2024 at 1:15:12 PM

I know last page there was the whole "Finding memes about Joker 2 Bombing" but I wanted to throw my hat in the ring in what is probably my new favorite template for a movie bombing (like last years Wish):

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lets_fight_somewhere_empty_joker_2.webp

Watch Symphogear
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#1614: Oct 8th 2024 at 1:42:57 PM

[up]https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/1728327964715888.jpg "That's not funny...That's not..."

Edited by Mizerous on Oct 8th 2024 at 4:44:32 AM

Just Makima.
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#1615: Oct 8th 2024 at 1:55:45 PM

Idea came to Joaquin Phoenix in a dream

Well, this explains everything.

king15 Have Faun Since: Mar, 2024
Have Faun
#1616: Oct 8th 2024 at 2:19:47 PM

I think it was just the idea for a sequel to be musical focused that came in the dream.

Ernestin (Newbie) Relationship Status: A heart full of love
#1617: Oct 8th 2024 at 2:23:29 PM

While the movie wasn't good, that Harley Quinn's “love” was a case of Loving a Shadow where she "loves" the Joker as a concept but not the person he really is, is something I like as a concept, and could have been developed better.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from The Wiggle Room (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#1618: Oct 8th 2024 at 2:59:21 PM

> Idea came to Joaquin Phoenix in a dream

so what you're saying is that a dream demon gave him a bad idea for a movie

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Ego-Man25 Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#1619: Oct 8th 2024 at 4:43:34 PM

…But there is one thing I'm thankful for, regarding this movie. It gave me a whole new bit I get to use~! I get to use this movie as a PUNCHLINE now~!

Self-professed Wild Card who thinks cynicism isn't so bad.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#1620: Oct 8th 2024 at 6:30:05 PM

If anything, this movie is fun to make fun of.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#1621: Oct 8th 2024 at 7:32:21 PM

That quote from Return of the Joker comes to mind when I see all these memes.

"It'd be funny if it wasn't so pathetic. ...Oh what the heck, I'll laugh anyway. AHAHAHAHA!"

The legend has returned.
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#1622: Oct 9th 2024 at 5:09:13 AM

So I’ve seen an interesting theory that Arthur’s character regression is because he’s on meds.

Makes sense.

Edited by RedHunter543 on Oct 9th 2024 at 8:09:32 PM

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
Ego-Man25 Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#1623: Oct 9th 2024 at 5:40:21 AM

…You know what kills me? Even as is, even with the film we ended up getting, you know, bridge-burning mess and all, this in and of itself still could have been genuinely compelling. If there's anything that Tropes Are Tools has taught me, it's that you're going to have to accept the fact that it isn't the ideas that are inherently bad, but rather how people execute them. There is a timeline where this film has damn near close to this plot, yet this film instead has folks exploding in cheers and praise at this being a pinnacle, shining example of everything that can be GREAT about sequels unafraid to deconstruct the core themes of the original.

Self-professed Wild Card who thinks cynicism isn't so bad.
lalalei2001 Since: Oct, 2009
#1624: Oct 9th 2024 at 5:50:49 AM

A D score means some people liked it, right?

The Protomen enhanced my life.
king15 Have Faun Since: Mar, 2024
Have Faun
#1625: Oct 9th 2024 at 6:02:11 AM

If it means anything, the Wikipedia page keeps shifting between describing the critical reception as 'mixed' and describing them as 'negative' (it's now settled at the more neutral "Although various reviewers praised the performances of Phoenix and Gaga, the film was poorly received by critics"), so it has a decent amount of average to positive reviews. Of course critics don't equal audiences, though I have heard (second hand, mind) some people enjoying this. It does sound like, for whatever this film's faults, it isn't just a by the numbers sequel (even though that likely would have been much better), so that likely buys it some fans, and some people might enjoy how the deconstruction is handled. I've yet to see it (will probably wait till it releases on streaming) so can't say how I'd feel.

But yeah, reception overall has not been pretty (even Joker, which was divisive with critics, found a lot of love from audiences and built a big fanbase).


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