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Joker (2019)

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TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
ReynTime250 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Aug 22nd 2019 at 4:46:58 PM

[up] That's cool. A good comic book movie doesn't matter whether it's R or PG-13 though. Dark Knight vs Logan is a great example.

HailMuffins from Ceará, Brazil Relationship Status: How YOU doin'?
Aug 22nd 2019 at 4:57:16 PM

True, but it's not like they could do justice to the concept of a solo Joker movie in the restraints of a PG-13 rating.

Bow-chicka-wow-wow... Now bow chicka bow down.
Lyendith I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane! from Bègles, France Relationship Status: Buried in snow, waiting for spring
I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane!
Aug 22nd 2019 at 5:30:48 PM

With the Romero Joker, maybe they could. tongue

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Aug 22nd 2019 at 7:23:09 PM

Sure they could. Joker isn’t a particularly R-rated character - he’s scary and does horrific things, but rarely in a gruesome, risqué or profane way. The trend of making him more gruesome is a comparatively recent thing, and comes off as kind of try hard sometimes (“this week, the Joker’s wearing his own face! Edgy!”).

I hope this ends up feeling more like Deadpool 1 or Jessica Jones, where the R rated stuff flows well from the story, and not like Deadpool 2 or Luke Cage where the R rated stuff came off as superfluous and felt like they were reaching for the rating.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 22nd 2019 at 7:24:44 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Weirdguy149 Space Traveller from Space Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Space Traveller
Aug 22nd 2019 at 7:43:58 PM

You can certainly do a PG-13 Joker well, as Nicholson and Ledger have shown in the past.

Daisy, daisy...
Nightwire Humans inferior. Ultron superior. Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Humans inferior. Ultron superior.
Aug 22nd 2019 at 7:48:11 PM

And you know, Mark Hamill. The Joker and Deadpool doesn't need to be R-rated.

Bite my shiny Vibranium ass, Avengers.
Aug 23rd 2019 at 4:37:12 AM

The Arkham game series did that as well - the backstory is how Joker and Harley butchered a kindergarten and stitched the bodies back together as a way of luring Robin in.

TBH it felt off - as the Joker is mad and has an obsession BUT that just doesn't strike me as a modus operandi he'd do. There's a scene in a comic where a kid is terrified of him and the Joker comes across as scarily sane when he says it wouldn't be actually funny to kill the kid. There'd be no POINT.

He does big elaborate setpieces and all that, but as I said, it felt weirdly OOC from the way the Hamill Joker is portrayed.

slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Aug 23rd 2019 at 5:18:13 AM

The Joker is a true comedian, he’s very particular about his humor.

Which is kind of a failing with the modern portrayal of him. They are lazy comedians.

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
Nightwire Humans inferior. Ultron superior. Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Humans inferior. Ultron superior.
Aug 23rd 2019 at 5:33:54 AM

The Joker is just not funny any more. He's just an inhuman monster as commonly depicted nowadays.

That's why I still think DCAU Joker is still the best Joker. DCAU Joker is a monster, but he is still human. DCAU Joker can be beaten. He can be humiliated.

DCAU Joker can be tricked and threatened by a regular schmuck.

He's caught with his pants down and can't take it when other people are laughing at him.

He is afraid of the IRS.

Terry McGinnis can heckle the hell out of him.

DCAU Joker is a fun character. He's a competent and threating villain but he's not a Boring Invincible Villain like Modern Comic Joker. You can't do anything to win a victory against Modern Comic Joker, because Modern Comic Joker is just a monster who gets off on murder and causing misery who doesn't care about anything else.

Edited by Nightwire on Aug 23rd 2019 at 5:37:48 AM

Bite my shiny Vibranium ass, Avengers.
theLibrarian That all you got? from his own little world
That all you got?
Aug 23rd 2019 at 7:51:06 AM

They're not even comedians at all, they just keep portraying him as some angry misanthrope that got driven insane by society, when the actual Joker didn't have that as his motivation at all. Not Nolan Joker, not this Joker. It's one of the main reasons that I'm decidedly unimpressed with this movie. The Joker's not someone you feel sympathy for.

Edited by theLibrarian on Aug 23rd 2019 at 9:52:48 AM

That is the face of a man who just ate a kitten. Raw.
Prowler Caw! Caw! Relationship Status: On the prowl
Caw! Caw!
Aug 23rd 2019 at 8:54:21 AM

I didn't feel sympathy for him when I read the script. He's basically a killer incel.

Aug 23rd 2019 at 9:28:27 AM

I think writers forget that Joker’s MO is based on irony, not just killing people. He doesn’t just kill everyone he meets: he targets and exploits the false senses of security, he forces people to pay attention and then mocks them for doing so, he toys with expectations and flips them on their head.

It’s still awful and murderous, but it’s a distinction that forms his whole personality. Without it, he loses what makes him interesting.

One of my favorite Joker stories is the one where he crashes a game show and plays with the contestants, poking at the fact that they all clearly expect him to start killing people at any second. The whole thing was a trick to ruin the execs who tried to use his appearance to spike ratings and mock he audience for being captivated by it, and he doesn’t kill a single person.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 23rd 2019 at 9:31:32 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Pichu-kun ...
...
Aug 24th 2019 at 10:45:40 AM

[up](x4) The best Joker to me has always been the '66 Joker, but he's not exactly intimidating. He's not supposed to be.

The DCAU one is probably the best version of Joker who kills. The series being so constrained by regulations let them get away with a lot of good, more subtle stuff.

Edited by Pichu-kun on Aug 24th 2019 at 5:52:29 AM

slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Aug 24th 2019 at 10:53:08 AM

There’s also when DCAU Joker truly went too far that was the last straw & why he died.

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
HailMuffins from Ceará, Brazil Relationship Status: How YOU doin'?
Aug 24th 2019 at 10:54:42 AM

[up][up]Yeah, but it's also the Joker that went the hardest past the Moral Event Horizon, what with the torture of Tim Drake and the implied pedophilia with Ace.

Edited by HailMuffins on Aug 24th 2019 at 2:55:46 PM

Bow-chicka-wow-wow... Now bow chicka bow down.
Aug 24th 2019 at 10:57:12 AM

That wasn't so much implied as it was Batman making Harley think that was the case to trick her into leading him to where Joker was.

HailMuffins from Ceará, Brazil Relationship Status: How YOU doin'?
Aug 24th 2019 at 11:02:01 AM

Really? I don't remember it like that.

Well, not that it makes it much better, he was a horribly abusive person either way.

Bow-chicka-wow-wow... Now bow chicka bow down.
Aug 25th 2019 at 1:21:47 PM

New trailer Wednesday[1] plus short clips cut together.

TargetmasterJoe Much more than meets the eye! from The City, USA Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
Much more than meets the eye!
Aug 28th 2019 at 9:16:47 AM

Send in the clowns...

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Aug 28th 2019 at 6:03:43 AM

Status: Evil beware, I have Twitter!
Aug 28th 2019 at 9:29:28 AM

Well, that makes it look like a very different kind of movie. It looks like it could be a trailer for a bio-pic of a real life entertainer.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 28th 2019 at 9:32:36 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Lyendith I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane! from Bègles, France Relationship Status: Buried in snow, waiting for spring
I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane!
Aug 28th 2019 at 10:45:13 AM

Oh hey, a comic book movie trailer that doesn't spoil the whole goddamn movie, for a change.

Edited by Lyendith on Aug 28th 2019 at 7:47:49 PM

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Tuckerscreator Icon by Umayma @coIoured_braids from Traveling through the Multiverse Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Icon by Umayma @coIoured_braids
Aug 28th 2019 at 10:48:30 AM

I find it kinda amusing that neither trailer has yet shown him doing anything really bad, so if one doesn't know who The Joker is, it just looks like trailers about a really sad guy who dresses like a clown.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Aug 28th 2019 at 10:49:40 AM

Lyendith I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane! from Bègles, France Relationship Status: Buried in snow, waiting for spring
I'm not insane, I'm not… not insane!
Aug 28th 2019 at 11:01:29 AM

Maybe he doesn't actually turn bad, who knows. tongue At this point it almost feels like this started as a completely original IP on which they slapped the "Joker" title at the last minute before submitting the script.

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