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Cleanup thread: Magnificent Bastard

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous post 
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

  • Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.

  • What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
    • Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
    • Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
    • Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
    • Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
    • Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.

  • What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.

  • Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.

  • What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
    • Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
    • Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
    • List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
    • The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.

  • How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.

  • What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.

  • What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.

  • What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.

  • Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.

  • What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.

  • Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.

  • What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.

  • Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.

Thread rules

When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.

Resolved items

In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.

However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.

This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.

Definitely an MB

Definitely not an MB

  • South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#12901: Sep 15th 2019 at 8:29:21 AM

[tup] Puss in Boots

The issue with Gendo is that he's too emotionally damaged. I simply can't upvote for him

Watch me destroying my country
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#12902: Sep 15th 2019 at 8:36:23 AM

The reason why I said that about surrealism, I seem to remember reading that it was one of the primary reasons as to why Gendo didn't count. Correct me if I'm wrong there. Having not seen the show myself, can't really comment on his emotional stability.

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#12903: Sep 15th 2019 at 8:41:04 AM

[tup] to Puss. Abstain on Gendo.

Also, mind if I pothole some of the entries?

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#12904: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:08:40 AM

Go for it dude, I ran them through locked pages, so you can just ask there.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#12905: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:14:47 AM

@Imperial Majesty XK I won'g mind with adding potholes. If you want, you could also add some potholes for Guilty Crown MB entry too haha :3

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#12906: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:24:23 AM

[tup] Puss. I almost considered effortposting him myself.

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#12907: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:34:50 AM

[tup] Puss. What happened to Moira from Overwatch?

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#12908: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:49:48 AM

Cut after Warthog presented a counter argument.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#12910: Sep 15th 2019 at 1:58:33 PM

Speaking of Overwatch, think I'll start there.

  • Akande Ogundimu, the third Doomfist, is a hulking man with an idea to strengthen humanity through conflict. Murdering his greedy teacher for his lack of vision, Doomfist ascended to the inner circle of Talon's leadership through his political skill, intending to start the war that would change the world. Even when locked away by Overwatch, Doomfist simply bided his time, keeping tabs on the outside world until Talon was ready to free him. Once they did, Doomfist orchestrated a plan to sack the money-grubbing acting leader Vialli and his cohorts, bringing Talon back to its Darwin-esque roots, ready to bring forth the bloodiest battle the world's ever seen.
  • The sassy, enigmatic Sombra, born Olivia Colomar, was a former member of the Los Muertos gang, where she used her penchant for manipulation and hacking to play various corrupt Mexican officials to her whims, with her escapades making her a local hero to the town of Dorado. After a power trip gone wrong where she unwittingly ended up noticed by a terrifying secret global organization, she purged all records of her existence and decided to increase the scale of her hacking schemes. Emerging under Talon's employ, Sombra properly introduces herself in the "Infiltration" short, working behind Reaper's back to save Katya Volskaya from Talon's assassination attempt, only to blackmail her by threatening to expose her shady dealings with Omnics. When Katya tries to beat her at her own game by sending Zarya after her, Sombra quickly bounces back by revealing she knew she was being hunted and rigged her base to explode to make her escape.

Edited by ImperialMajestyXO on Sep 15th 2019 at 1:59:03 AM

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#12911: Sep 15th 2019 at 2:02:53 PM

Yes, please hold off on NGE until 43110 has his say.

I think 43110 reserving Rebuild gives him a little authority here. Maybe it won't mean anything but we'll see.

If Rebuild is a complete reboot then we can discuss both Gendos separately.

And let's not forget Gendo has many alternate versions, like the manga or Super Robot Wars. There is much Gendo to discuss on this thread.

Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#12912: Sep 15th 2019 at 4:35:41 PM

Abstain on Gendo.

Frankly having scene the show and End of Evangelion. My issue with the original Gendo was never the Surrealism, rather it was that I felt in End of Evangelion he was a bit too...Broken? Or pathetic? Like were shown deep down He was really just too scared to actually Connect with people hence why he was so harsh toward Shinji.

Things are really about to get Fun around here
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#12913: Sep 15th 2019 at 6:25:04 PM

Eh... not sure I agree with these emotionally unstable/pathetic points being made but if it's cool, can we wait until next year to see if Rebuild's finale sheds some light on the sequel thing?

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#12914: Sep 15th 2019 at 7:51:23 PM

Abstain on Gendo but yes to Puss in Boots.

I was thinking of proposing The Hidden Figure (the Giant clown guy) from Wario Land 3 but I draw pause at his lack of personality until the end. Does a MB need a consistent personality?

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
GeorgieEnkoom Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II from Somewhere. Since: Feb, 2017 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
#12916: Sep 15th 2019 at 8:21:41 PM

[up][up] IIRC, candidates have been rejected because their personality was too inconsistent. So, someone who's personality is too inconsistent won't leave the needed effect on the audience.

That being said, I could be wrong. If I am, please tell me.

[down] You meant MB?

Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on Sep 15th 2019 at 8:20:23 PM

J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#12917: Sep 15th 2019 at 9:32:03 PM

I can't see Rudy (said Hidden Figure) as a CM. Too nondescript in personality aside from generic "muahaha I'm really the evil bad guy" and too lacking in genuine charm. Particularly compared to, say, Syrup.

Klavice (Elder Troper)
#12918: Sep 15th 2019 at 11:21:05 PM

So I've been replaying Mario and Luigi Dream Team to see if this was the rare instance if Bowser counted and considering he doesn't appear till the end and for 3/4ths of the game Antasma is the main villain who is pretty generic as far as baddies go and has no charm, I'd say an easy no to him especially since Bowser seems no more competent in this than Galaxy which still portrays him as a buffoon, in spite of him being extremely successful. And I cannot in good conscience vote yes to a baddy that is basically a buffoon 99% of the time but for one game gets competent.

Edited by Klavice on Sep 15th 2019 at 11:23:05 AM

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#12919: Sep 16th 2019 at 4:21:14 AM

[tup] Shadar and Puss

[tdown] Stumpy

Abstain on Gendo.

Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#12920: Sep 16th 2019 at 12:55:24 PM

[tup]Puss.

So, a short while ago I watched Batman: Assault on Arkham to see if the Riddler's unapproved MB entry was valid, and concluded it wasn't due to his lack of any real presence. However, there actually is a character I didn't consider in my previous viewing, which is ironic as he's the closest thing the film has to a main character, that I'm bringing up now.

Who Is He?

Floyd Lawton, better known as Deadshot, is the leader of Task Force X, the Suicide Squad, under the employ of Amanda Waller. Referred to by Penguin as the best assassin he's ever met, Deadshot is renowned for never missing his shot, in addition to his love for his daughter, Zoe, his Living Emotional Crutch.

What Does He Do?

Making his first appearance nearly escaping prison using a pen as a projectile weapon, Deadshot, along with several other criminals, are taken by Amanda Waller to perform an infiltration of Arkham Asylum, supposedly to recover a thumbdrive in the Riddler's cane containing data on the Suicide Squad's past and potential recruits, with Waller forcing their compliace through nano-bombs implanted in their necks. Deployed to Gotham City and meeting up with the Penguin for their mission, Deadshot displays his persuasion by convincing Penguin not to kill Harley in revenge for a previous confrontation, and later on, during a dart game, casually catches a dart aimed for his eye thrown by Captain Boomerang. He also has a one-night stand with Harley Quinn, which proves to be a mistake later on...

Dropping Harley off at a toy store specifically to lure in Batman and get her sent to Arkham Asylum, Deadshot then impersonates a guard and attempts to activate a device to allow the others entrance. Though he meets a setback due to the Joker's presence causing Harley to flip out, he nevertheless plants the device in a damaged wire, allowing them to rendezvous with the rest of the group. At King Shark's suggestion, the group then plays yesterday's footage to throw Batman and Waller off their trail. Shortly afterwards, the squad gets in a shootout due to the Boomerang and King Shark accidentally alerting security to their presence, managing to defeat the guards, with Deadshot employing techniques such as using his grappling hook to kill one of the guards. He then asserts his control over the rest of the squad, making it clear they won't make it out alive without him, and makes it to the storage room to collect Riddler's cane, which they discover is empty. They then get ambushed by Batman, and though clearly outmatched, Deadshot triggers an explosion in the storage room, seemingly ending the fight (though in truth, Batman had actually impersonated one of the squad members).

Realizing that the true purpose for the mission was for Killer Frost to kill Riddler, as he knows how to defuse the bombs, Deadshot leads the squad in rescuing the two from security before having Riddler use electroshock therapy to deactivate the bombs. Another confrontation with the Batman and Joker ensues, and Harley joins back with the Joker, who attempts to kill Deadshot for "touching his stuff". Deadshot proceeds to stare down the barrel of Joker's gun and bluffs him into wasting his only bullet, forcing him into retreat and regaining his wrist-gun in the process. As the Joker triggers a prison riot, the squad disbands, and while the remaining members are either killed or trapped in Arkham, Deadshot succeeds in escaping via helicopter in the midst of the chaos, only to be ambushed again by Joker. Enraged when the Joker makes a comment regarding his daughter, Deadshot takes on the Joker one-on-one while Harley mans the helicopter, ultimately crashing it in a building. Though Deadshot receives multiple near-fatal stab wounds from the Joker, he nevertheless defeats the supervillain, tossing him into the downed helicopter as it plunges off the building.

In the final moments of the film, it's revealed Deadshot has escaped and reunited with his daughter, and spends the final moments of the film scoping Amanda Waller a distance away with a sniper rifle, intending on making good on his earlier warning to Waller: "Play fair and I'll shoot straight; jerk me around and I'll kill you."

Is he smart? Charming?

Yeah. Deadshot is suave, no-nonsense, and confident, always staying focused on the mission at hand, and is by far the most competent member of the squad. Though he meets numerous setbacks on his mission, usually a result of his more reckless teammates, he always finds a way to improvise, and by the end, he's the only one to make it out of Arkham alive.

Is he a bastard? Too much?

Deadshot's got a bit of a bodycount on him, mostly security guards, but considering the people he's sharing the spotlight with, including the man-eating King Shark, Serial Killer Killer Frost, and the freaking Joker, it's not nearly enough to be a problem. He also has a number of positive traits, moreso than his teammates, saving Harley in the medical room despite not needing to, and genuinely caring for his daughter.

Final Verdict?

Your call. I should note this is only taking into account his actions in the film, and he's apparently appeared in the games as well, though according to his character page, his film incarnation is an Adaptational Badass from the games.

Edited by Clown-Face on Sep 16th 2019 at 1:15:52 AM

Why so serious?
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#12921: Sep 16th 2019 at 12:57:31 PM

[tup]Deadshot

Neal McDonough was excellent in this role.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
#12925: Sep 16th 2019 at 1:29:09 PM

Well, that reminds me of someone. New comics candidate:

What is the work?

Wanted, a superhero comic by the much-derided Mark Millar that was also the basis for a film starring James McAvoy and Angelina Jolie. Wesley Gibson is a total nobody loser working a lousy job when he is suddenly told that his late father used to be part of an evil secret society, and that Wesley has now inherited his position. Otherwise, the film and comics are largely different, as one focused on assassins, the other on supervillains.

Who is the Killer? What has he done?

No, not Wesley Gibson himself, despite him also being named "The Killer". At the end of the day, he's just a smug, petty weasel of a Villain Protagonist. The original Killer is Wesley's father, a supervillain loosely based on Deadshot. In the old days, when superpowered individuals roamed the world, the Killer fell in love with a normal woman and had a son with her. However, an alliance of supervillains gathered together to destroy all the superheroes once and for all, a task at which they succeeded, then rewrote reality to make the old heroes the stuff of fiction. The world was carved up by the Fraternity, who divied up the continents to various Houses. The Killer realized that in order to protect his wife and son he would have to leave them, and for years made a career as the most dangerous man on the planet until he was finally killed in an elaborate set-up.

Wesley then joins the Fraternity, trained by his new mentor/girlfriend the Fox (Catwoman expy) to become a supervillain, and starts climbing the ranks of the Professor's (Lux Luthor expy) organization until a civil war erupts with the rival house headed by Mr. Rictus (Joker expy) because the latter is more interested in pursuing evil for its own sake. At the end, as Wesley gets revenge on Rictus and his gang, The Killer emerges from the shadows and reveals that he faked his death. Over the course of a long conversation and dinner, the Killer reveals that he has been watching Wesley his entire life, then set up events so that Wesley would inherit the main seat at the fraternity. See, the Killer is a living legend, but he knows that his days are numbered, and doesn't want to become a feeble old man. At his father's request, Wesley shoots his kneeling father in the back of the head while shedding a tear.

How do his actions and personality show he is a Magnificent Bastard?

The Killer is a smooth, Silver Fox of a man who is a professional killer but very Affably Evil. Obviously he has made a career out of killing people, but it's indicated that he joined the Professor rather than Rictus because he didn't see the point in shooting babies in their cribs, or eating people. He doesn't have any real issue with setting up the Professor to be wiped out by Rictus, in order that his son come out as the victor at the end. He genuinely loved his son and Wesley's mother, and is also one of Fox's lovers, who is nothing but loyal to him.

Even his own son surpasses him in evil, as Welsey takes to murdering people for various petty reasons and at one point casually admits to having raped a female celebrity before disappearing her. The Killer, despite being a declared supervillain, isn't indicated to be ok with this. We do see him in a sexual situation at one point, as he has a habit of engaging in a gay orgy once a year for a week straight, as in his own words "it makes the smell of a woman that much better after all those hours of man-sex". The guys are being paid for it (and later are the innocent bystanders in a shoot-out when the Killer's rivals show up unexpected), but otherwise it's completely consensual. Keep in mind, this story is later revealed to be fabricated to some degree, but everything but the Killer's death seems plausible. Or at least, he's fine with this type of information about his habits being public knowledge.

Mitigating Factors?

Nope. In a comic filled with cackling Card-Carrying villains and scumbags, he passes all criteria for this trope with flying colors.

Verdict?

World's best dad.

Edited by Morgenthaler on Sep 17th 2019 at 10:36:37 AM

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"

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