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Cleanup thread: Magnificent Bastard

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous post 
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

  • Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.

  • What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
    • Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
    • Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
    • Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
    • Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
    • Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.

  • What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.

  • Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.

  • What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
    • Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
    • Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
    • List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
    • The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.

  • How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.

  • What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.

  • What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.

  • What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.

  • Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.

  • What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.

  • Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.

  • What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.

  • Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.

Thread rules

When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.

Resolved items

In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.

However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.

This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.

Definitely an MB

Definitely not an MB

  • South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#9826: May 20th 2019 at 1:11:10 PM

Hm. Considering Cobra Commander seems a shoo in, perhaps I should consider Viktor Zaitsev, the Heavy from Vanquish whom I successfully EP'd as a CM some years back.

Thing is, I'd probably have to rewrite his write up since I may have called him a coward, which isn't the case now I think about it. And his plan is awful - cooking people alive with microwaves. But he wins and it's more a means to an end than sheer sadism. He's uncaring rather than sadistic and it doesn't actually matter if the second attack fails because his true goal was to expose President Winters' corruption and weaken the US.

A possibility I think.

...I really gotta finish those write ups. AND SEPHIROTH GODDAMN IT.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#9827: May 20th 2019 at 1:29:53 PM

[up]Actually, the writeup doesn't call him a coward. It does call him "smug" and "condescending", though, so a slight rewrite may still be necessary.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#9828: May 20th 2019 at 1:31:20 PM

Thanks for elucidating me, with that I'm fine for him going up!

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#9830: May 20th 2019 at 3:02:31 PM

Cut this unapproved entry from The Princess Diaries:

  • Magnificent Bastard: Magnificent Bitch: Grandmere borders on this sometimes. At one point she puts on a school play to help Mia raise money enough to save the student government, ensure her own purchase of an island in Dubai, and get her granddaughter closer to a boy she thinks is more suitable consort material. She succeeds on all counts.

I used to read the books, but lost interest. I have no interest in re-examining the books to see if she counts.

Edited by SkyCat32 on May 20th 2019 at 7:23:18 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#9831: May 20th 2019 at 3:22:06 PM

No worries, if someone feels strongly they can come talk to us.

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#9832: May 20th 2019 at 4:09:16 PM

[tup] To the Cobra Commander. I was thinking of looking into Lord Business from the Lego Movie. I seem to remember him being pretty smart and likable.

Brainulator9 Short-Term Projects herald from US Since: Aug, 2018 Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Short-Term Projects herald
#9833: May 20th 2019 at 5:37:14 PM

YMMV.Bugs Bunny has a Zero-Context Example.

Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#9835: May 20th 2019 at 8:23:42 PM

Seems like Film!Cobra Commander is a pretty solid Keep, which is cool, so since I'm on a roll let's move onto the next G.I. Joe candidate...I might have one more from the films but first I want to get the more obvious ones out of the way.

What's the work?

G.I. Joe (IDW) is a reimagining and reinventing of the G.I. Joe franchise by IDW, featuring more mature and long-spanning stories and arcs than many Joe comics.

Our first candidate from it is one... you've all just voted on, lol, but one that is an even more easy Keep.

Who is Cobra Commander? What makes him a candidate?

Affably Evil, Wicked Cultured, charming as hell and rocking a damn snazzy get-up, Cobra Commander is the current leader of the terrorist organization Cobra and the Big Bad for the first part of the comic.

Now, the organization Cobra has existed for centuries, with a high council that elects a "commander" to be in charge for periods of 7 year increments before another vote takes place...this Cobra Commander? Has been re-elected five times, the most in the organization's history, due to his rule over the organization bringing it to some of its greatest triumphs ever.

Orchestrating countless events over the course of his arc in the comics, being so capable that he never even encounters the G.I. Joes as a whole and yet stays one step ahead of them, the Commander notably orders construction of the MASS device, a teleportation device that will enable Cobra to pull off heists and create a moon base all without suspicion or threat, and puts one of his lieutenants, the Baroness, on it.

When a test of the MASS device results in the death of top Cobra assassin Zartan, the Commander is disgusted and infuriated that such a valued Cobra agent was killed, and immediately commissions a clone of him be made...once the highly dangerous Zartan clone goes rogue, he eventually contacts the Commander and makes a deal: In exchange for treating him like an actual person and giving him resources, he will serve Cobra loyally as the real Zartan once did. The Commander agrees, and even gives "Zartan" approval to execute his abusive creator, with the Commander remarking that it is "just."

Using the young and upcoming scientist Glynis MacDougall to spy on the Baroness and MASS device for him, the Commander personally oversees the final testing of the device, approving of it only once assuring no more troops would be endangered by it, and then immediately promotes Glynis to overseer of the project for her loyalty.

Once the Commander learns that James McCullen, Destro, was the one who made the initial MASS device, the Commander ignores the bloodthirsty Baronesses's requests to kill McCullen, and mocks her belief that he has Outlived His Usefulness. The Commander keeps Destro in a secure prison in case he needs him at a later time, and when Destro actually manages to pull a successful takeover of the prison, the Commander congratulates him and offers him a position in Cobra thanks to his obvious resourcefulness.

When the Joes manage to find the MASS device and lead a full scale assault on the Cobra base it is located in, the Commander regretfully destroys the entire base with an explosion to prevent the Joes from obtaining the information themselves, remarking with cold logic that he can't be clouded by "sentiment" when the Baroness points out that some of their own troops are still in the base.

In easily his most prominent and magnificent outing yet, the Commander and two of his lieutenants, Tomax and Xamot Paolie, are hunted down by the brutal G.I. Joe "Chuckles", seeking revenge for the death of his lover at the Paoli's hands....when Chuckles is mortally wounded during a firefight, the Commander tracks him down and sees Chuckles passed out from his wounds.... six miles from where he had been shot.

Deciding that such talent could benefit Cobra greatly, the Commander brings Chuckles to a secret Cobra island and sets him up in a luxurious room, heals of him his wounds, and personally visits him many times throughout a few weeks, showing him around the base and telling him of Cobra's successes....the Commander does this to many potential recruits, using his genuinely friendly attitude to convince them that Cobra is nothing but a particularly dirty business model and that they're best off working with it...he has convinced many highly skilled individuals into Cobra's ranks this way.

Though the Paoli twins are horrified at the Commander's attempted recruiting of Chuckles, the Commander keeps the two psychotic twins under control while continuing to convince Chuckles to work for Cobra. When Chuckles escapes confinement and into a nearby forest, the Commander reveals himself, having known the forest was the most obvious choice of where Chuckles would flee if he ever escaped. Chuckles pulls a gun on the Commander, but, after many confident assurances that Chuckles wouldn't get far if he killed him, the Commander promises Chuckles that he can kill the Paoli twins in the very soon future if he swears loyalty, as truthfully? The Commander finds the twins sadistic, cruel, and despicable (and they are lol) and along with finding it not good for Cobra's ventures as a whole, is personally distasteful of them as well.

This works and Chuckles lowers his weapon....at which point we see that the Commander had snipers hidden in the trees ready to kill Chuckles at any given moment if the Commander deemed it necessary.

The Commander continues inducting Chuckles into Cobra, later informing him that a mistake by a group of soldiers let a nearby fishing village spy a Cobra boatcraft heading for their hidden island base. Proclaiming that this could lead to potential spreading of the word that Cobra is near that area, the Commander has the village's communications cut off and then reveals that he has planted bombs in strategic locations on every populated island in the area in case of such a situation, and is ready to blow the bombs and flood the village. The Commander hands Chuckles the control as a final test of his loyalty, and Chuckles uncaringly detonates the bombs and floods the village without hesitation, solidifying his loyalty.

Eventually, Xamot Paoli decides to take matters into his own hands to get rid of Chuckles (as he realizes that Chuckles will kill him and his brother eventually) and attacks him in a hallway, then claims Chuckles attacked him. After Chuckles is seemingly locked away, Xamot stages a "breakout", kills many of his own troops, and frames Chuckles for it. He then strolls into the Commander's chambers and reveals he plans to kill the Commander and pin it all Chuckles, then kill Chuckles himself. Xamot then orders the masked guards in the room in his employ to kill the Commander.

Unfortunately for Xamot....the Commander believed Chuckles that Xamot had framed him, and has disguised Chuckles as one of those masked guards, with the Commander just sighing and treating Xamot as impulsive annoyance he is, at which point he orders Chuckles to kill Xamot.

Unfortunately for the Commander.....Chuckles has played the long game and suddenly turns on the Commander, aiming his gun at the man's head to which the Commander simply gives a Flat "What" before having his brains blown out.

It would later be revealed that the Commander had a wife and son at one point....during a rebellion by a group of rogue Cobra agents, they tracked the Commander's family and killed his wife before moving in on his son. The Commander arrived with his own forces, slaughtered the rogue agents, and when the lead agent tried to give a monologue, the Commander shut him up by shooting him in the face.

The Commander then hid his son Billy away, promising the young boy that he would never be hurt again...and when Billy was in a skiing accident that broke a bone in his leg, the Commander had a failsafe installed in the broken bone: a data drive filled with every single Cobra secret and contact and agent in the world, so the Commander could always have blackmail and control over anyone who tried to extort him from inside the organization, which simultaneously made Billy even more safe thanks to no one willing to try to even track down the boy until years after the Commander was dead.

Is Cobra Commander a Chessmaster? Manipulative Bastard? Capable of Xanatos Speed Chess?

Ayup. The Commander plans out a hellton of the first part of the story, orchestrating the rise and fall of various minions and he changes the MASS device from "glorified bank robbing tool" into a weapon to spread Cobra's resources everywhere, even the damn moon.

He gains many recruits to his cause through sheer charisma, and is genuinely Affably Evil and polite, always having a kind word to say but also a gun ready to be pulled if the need arises.

When Zartan is killed by the faulty MASS device? The Commander uses the opportunity to shift many pieces to get his hands on a raw "blank" human slate and turns it into a superpowered clone of Zartan, planning to potentially create an army of Zartans.

When the Joes find the MASS device after a long time searching for it? The Commander forgoes contacting the high council as is protocol in such a dire situation, remarking that it would take too long for a decision to be made on what to do and so blows the base and device himself.

The Commander never loses his cool beyond raising his voice to express his disappointment to his minions should they spectacularly fail him, and though his death only comes about because he trusted the wrong person, it's frankly not a knock on the Commander but rather an impressive outing by Chuckles, considering he floods a village on the Commander's orders to prove his loyalty, which would fool many villains in any media.

The Commander has a simple quote that explains him extremely well:

"The key to success is to consider every possible road toward it, and let nothing—not military, law, or personal preference—influence your choice of the best one. You'll be surprised how often that road is not a violent one."

Is the Commander a Bastard? Is he charming? Does he have any traits worthy of respect?

For all his charm, the Commander runs a terrorist organization. He orders invasions, robberies, assassinations, and his grand moment of villainy is flooding an entire village when they could expose one of his bases, and having fail-safes for other villages if need be to do the same to them.

Nonetheless? The Commander is downright tame compared to many of his iterations, both in this comic canon and just in general real life, and everyone, from Cobra itself to the G.I. Joes to the narrative, acknowledges that this Cobra Commander was infinitely better than the next, Krake. Krake completely screws up the Cobra infastructure, reveals the organization to the world as the terrorist group it is, and kills thousands of innocent people in murderous glee....meanwhile, this Commander is a respectful leader who runs his organization like a business (even selling infomercial products under cover names!), has standards and loved ones, praises and promotes his minions, and is always willing to strike a deal rather than cause more bloodshed.

He won't hesitate to do something brutal, but it is never his preferred choice of action, and even when he does something notably evil it's in such a cool, to-the-point way, without any cruelty or sadism involved that it's impossible not to at least mildly respect his conviction.

This Commander doesn't want to Take Over the World, at least not for power, but just so he can "run" it like the rest of Cobra; strict, orderly, but overall efficient and organized. He even chastises Chuckles for assuming he's a purely evil monster, snarking "You still see me as some villain in a Saturday morning cartoon."

Final Verdict?

I do not hesitate to say that this Cobra Commander is the Magnificent Bastard of Cobra Commanders. I'll be proposing more, I've already proposed one, but this one above all others is the easiest Keep.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#9836: May 20th 2019 at 8:32:17 PM

[tup] Cobra Commander

[tup] Cobra Commander

Watch me destroying my country
DocSharp Since: Jun, 2011
#9837: May 20th 2019 at 8:32:54 PM

Easy yep to Cobra Commander #2.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#9839: May 20th 2019 at 8:35:48 PM

[tup] To Cobra Commander 2 (is that Krake CC)

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#9842: May 20th 2019 at 9:07:21 PM

Yep to the IDW comics version of the Commander.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#9843: May 21st 2019 at 1:10:09 AM

[tup] to both Cobra Commanders. I think we should also consider that live-action Cobra Commander's retreat could be seen as Pragmatic Villainy on his part rather than Dirty Coward since you can't really Take Over the World if you get caught.

Anyways, here my write-up for Rex Dangervest:

The LEGO Movie 2: The Second Part: Rex Dangervest is the evil, time-traveling Emmet Brickowski from the future who seeks to break the LEGO world. Desiring revenge upon his former friends for not saving him from under the dryer, Rex constructs a Time Machine spaceship to travel back in time, pick up a crew of raptors, and rescue his past self from the accident that got him stuck there in the first place. Presenting himself as the cool brotherly figure and exploiting the poor communication on everyone's part, Rex successfully manipulates Emmet to ignore his kind heart and use his anger to break the wedding of Queen Watevra Wa'Nabi and Batman, thus bringing forth Ourmamageddon upon the LEGO world. When Emmet realizes the truth and rejects Rex's teachings, Rex throws him under the dryer and tries to break his child-like spirit to ensure that he'll become just like Rex himself. After being thwarted by Lucy, who saves Emmet and destroys Rex's time machine, Rex calmly admits defeat and wishes Emmet to be a better man than him as he fades from existence.

If you think there can be better potholes, feel free to notify me.

Edited by Shadao on May 21st 2019 at 9:25:34 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#9844: May 21st 2019 at 2:38:15 AM

[tup] other Cobra Commander.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#9845: May 21st 2019 at 4:30:44 AM

Yes to the next Cobra Commander.

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#9846: May 21st 2019 at 4:33:55 AM

In contrast to my previous concerns, this second Cobra Commander seems an easy yes.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#9848: May 21st 2019 at 5:42:27 AM

So I finally did my pending write ups. Edits and suggestions are, as ever, encouraged:

  • Kill Bill has Beatrix Kiddo fight many devious opponents, but the following stand out with charm matching their skill:

    • Bill himself is the retired leader of the Deadly Viper Assassination Squad. After his lover Beatrix leaves him and becomes engaged to another man while pregnant, Bill massacres the wedding party and leaves Beatrix in a coma. Deciding to leave her alive in the hospital, he took their child she gave birth to while unconscious and raised her as a loving father. Finally confronted by Beatrix, the three share a family night together of a life that could have been while Bill also leads Beatrix into a false sense of security, shooting her with truth serum to have her admit to him and herself why she left him. Accepting defeat with grace, Bill reassures Beatrix that she's his favourite person, never stopping loving her and regretting what he did, telling her "I... overreacted."

    • O-Ren Ishii, AKA Cottonmouth of the Deadly Viper Assassination Squad, is the most ambitious of Bill's former underlings. Starting her career at age 11 by avenging her parents' death, O-Ren went on to be one of the world's most dangerous women. After leaving Bill's employ following the wedding massacre, O-Ren travelled to Japan, conquering the criminal underworld and rising to the top of the Yakuza, feared and respected by the bosses of the families. Confronted by Beatrix, O-Ren sent her underlings to fight her before engaging Beatrix in single combat, admitting respect for her opponent as the fight closed. The most successful of Bill's former associates, O-Ren was one of Beatrix's toughest fights.

  • Mortal Kombat Deadly Alliance: Nitara is a vampire whose Realm was conquered by Shao Kahn. Seeking to free it, she finds an Orb which, if destroyed, will free her Realm. It being submerged in lava, she decided she needed the cyborg Cyrax to obtain it. Earning Reptile's loyalty with a Saurian artifact, she has him damage Cyrax's teleportation device. Nitara, having the means to travel the Realms, offers to send Cyrax home if he retrieves the Orb for her. He agrees and she keeps her word, afterwards destroying the Orb. One of the few to save her Realm from Shao Kahn - all by her own cunning - Nitara was willing to use underhanded means to save her home and people.

  • God Of War Chains Of Olympus: Persephone, Goddess of Spring and unwilling Queen of the Dead, was forced into marrying Hades. Disillusioned with the gods that abandoned her and mortals for their selfishness, Persephone decided to destroy the world and return it all to Chaos. Freeing the Titan Atlas, she sent him to kidnap Helios, causing the sun to fall and Morpheus' influence to spread, putting the gods to sleep, neutralising them. She then sent Atlas to break the pillar that held the world up while at the same time using a vision of Kratos' daughter to lead him to her. Playing on his love for his daughter and his apathy towards humanity, Persephone tricks him into giving up his powers to purge his sins so he can join his daughter in Elysium, scorning him afterwards for how selfish he is. Driven to nihilism by the fate thrust upon her, Persephone came close to destroying the whole world.

  • Predator: The Predator itself is a dangerous, cunning and honourable warrior. Hunting in Republic of Val Verde during a Guerrilla War, the Predator stalked and killed numerous insurgents and elite forces, including a band of Green Berets. Cautiously hunting Dutch's group, it picked them off one by one as they split up, careful not to let itself be outnumbered even with its superior technology. Avoiding their first trap, they eventually catch it in a net, which it escapes by firing it's Plasmacaster rapidly. Feigning ignorance of Mac and Dillon's presence when they pursue it, the Predator turns the tables and kills them both. Finally confronting Dutch, whom had figured out how to exploit the Predator's thermal imaging tech, the creature is so impressed that, even when it had Dutch in its clutches, it lets him go and disarms itself to fight him unarmed. The hunter is finally beaten when it falls into a trap Dutch had set and only because Dutch made two traps. Noble and terrifying, the Predator hunts for sport, will not go after those it doesn't consider a threat and is an alien icon that spawned an entire franchise.

Edited by PolarPhantom on May 21st 2019 at 1:42:44 PM

lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#9850: May 21st 2019 at 6:48:36 AM

Found this on Morning Glories.

* Magnificent Bastard: It's questionable if Ike truly pulls this off, but he certainly sees himself this way.
  • However, both Gribbs and Daramount definitely qualify.

Ike is a egocentric, arrogant asshole teenager. He's such a massive jerk that he becomes endearing, especially when he has Pet the Dog moments.

However, as much of a jerk he is, he really isn't evil in a way to count for this trope. His actual evil acts were commited in the backstory and motivated for a Evil Is Petty motivation.

He might count if he continues going for a dark path. But so far, he's, so far, a Particularly Assholish Guile Hero.

He's a Rich Brat, a very dickish, arrogant yet also very smart Brat. But still a Spoiled Rich Kid.

And Miss Daramound and Gribbs??????

Both are sadistic as fuck. With Gribbs choking his favorite student to prove a point and constantly delivering brutal beatdowns.

Daremount is more cunning and in terms of witts, she might count. But She's also a massive Sadist Teacher with a cripping Superiority Inferiority Complex. She literally crushed the eyes of a student before whipping him, add that said student was Afro-descendent and well...while Daramount is no Politically Incorrect Villain, the author really want us to be disgusted at her.

Both are good villains, but not this trope.

I'm thinking on Daramount's sister, Miss Hodge. She's secretly trying to take The Academy down, but she's still in a wait and see. IDK if EP her or not. She might even be considered too heroic to count.

But yeah. Cut this.

Watch me destroying my country

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