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Needs Help: One Mario Limit

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Deadlock Clock: Aug 25th 2018 at 11:59:00 PM
thecarolinabull01 from North Carolina Since: Jun, 2014
#1: Mar 15th 2018 at 5:04:46 PM

A combination of "Needs Help" and "Misuse", there are some minor issues with the One Mario Limit trope. They aren't edit wars yet, but without a clearer set of criteria, I fear that it soon may head that way.

I'm well aware of the basic purpose of this trope: A character becomes so iconic that their names are not used by others in order to avoid being accused of ripping that character off. What is not clear/needs enforcing are the following:

  • "How obscure must the name be?": The trope definition clearly states "for a character to really achieve this distinction, their name must be sufficiently obscure enough to be distinctive but common enough that other writers would have used it." Yet there are many names listed that are so obscure that they probably wouldn't be used again even without the "Mario" in question (Linus, Schroeder, Beyoncé, Kanye, Cena, Lesnar, DiBiase, Ziggler, Peppa, Endora; I admittedly added that one but noted that it probably wouldn't be used again anyway.) Should they be allowed to stay or not?

  • "Does it only apply to human names, or can nicknames/monikers apply" There is one user who keeps deleting examples of nicknames and/or monikers even though the trope description does not say that they don't count. Two examples that have not been deleted yet are "Gaga" and "Undertaker". While they are words instead of names, the words have been used far less often since those stars used them as stage names. Few people call morticians undertakers anymore and virtually no one uses "gaga" as an adjective. Another example that was recently deleted was "The reason people don't call blimps zeppelins anymore is because the word was "led" away from that association in the '70s."

  • "Does the Limit apply to only one medium, or all?": There are some names that are more or less forbidden in one medium, but fairly common in others. Pro wrestling has a lot of these. Since it's not as mainstream as it was twenty years ago, there are names of wrestling figures that are fairly common in the real world, but probably unusable to any newcomers within the industry ("Goldberg", "Shane", "Vince", "Dusty", "Brock", "Eddie", "Foley", most female wrestler names). If it were expanded to all mediums instead of one, the the entry for pro wrestling would pretty much just be "Hogan", as he's the most recognizable wrestler with a name both common enough and obscure enough to fit this trope. Then there's the name "Ellie" which is practically unusable in future video games thanks to The Last of Us, but is probably fine to use outside video games.

  • "Is it truly a One Mario Limit?": There are some names listed that have two or three famous examples (Randy Savage and Randy Orton, Kurt Angle and Kurt Cobain, Demi Moore and Demi Lovato, Barney the Dinosaur, Barney Rubble, Barney Stinson and Barney Fife) but are unlikely to go beyond that. Should they be allowed to remain? or should it truly be a "One" Mario Limit?

  • "Aversions": Keep popping up alongside genuine examples ("'X' name is too common, but 'Y' name is off-limits"). Not a question, but more of a genuine annoyance as it clutters up the page and will lead to Trope Decay. Most have been deleted however.

I'm hoping that one way or another, these issues can be resolved without taking all the fun out of the trope itself.

edited 1st Apr '18 4:35:39 PM by thecarolinabull01

Darth_Marth Since: Nov, 2016 Relationship Status: She turned into the moon
#2: Jun 5th 2018 at 4:41:54 PM

The problem is this trope is inherently self defeating. Either a character has a totally unique name, in which case they don't qualify, or they share their name with other characters, in which case they don't qualify.

I get the general concept -"Mario" of Super Mario Bros is more well-known than any other Mario and as a result the name is associated with him- but there's always gonna be exceptions. Even if the trope namer's case, there's a couple examples of other works using the name non-ironically. How do we differentiate when a name has become sufficiently "owned" by a single character to qualify?

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#3: Jun 6th 2018 at 10:42:01 AM

It’s a name that showed up in shows before then X person got big so now no one wants to use it. The biggest reason is usually the name is in the title.

For example before Haruhi Suzumiya became big there were uses of the name Haruhi such as the lead from Ouran High School Host Club. But after 2006 no one would be caught dead using it. Even retroactively the lead from Ouran, which was kinda big in its own right, became known as ‘the other Haruhi’.

AnotherDuck No, the other one. from Stockholm Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Mu
No, the other one.
#4: Jun 6th 2018 at 4:37:53 PM

First of all, the real life sections are all horrible messes. There's a ton of stuff where it just happens to be the only name, especially when it comes to place names. Those names are just rare. Pretty much all names are too common anyway, since there's almost always someone else who uses them.

Aversions are pointless for this trope.

If a name didn't exist before, and isn't used again, I'd say it's probably just too rare. They also created the name, so it's linked to them for that reason, and not because they took over the association with the name. I don't think that fits the spirit of the trope.

Nicknames probably fit the spirit of the trope, but most nicknames are either too common or more or less unique.

There's probably a fair bit of Fan Myopia.

The description talks only about single names. Combining first and last name doesn't seem to follow the spirit of the trope, and it would most likely be too rare to begin with, since for a combination to be common enough both names have to individually be very common.

Names can probably be limited to a medium. However, with Professional Wrestling, I find that to be a little problematic, since I would guess many of those names are trademarked, and can therefore not be legally used within wrestling. Which is its own problem: If a name isn't used because of trademarks, it's not because it's too iconic; it's because it's not allowed.

Check out my fanfiction!
Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#5: Jun 7th 2018 at 1:52:53 AM

Yeah completely agree there. This is not Unique Name, which might be a trope in of itself, but more ‘my name now suckers’.

Trademarked names are more of an official thing and unless someone fights over it to enforce the One Mario Limit keep it off the page.

An example of an enforced thing the name ‘Conan’ which had Conan The Barbarian trademark the name and stopped Detective Conan from using its own name when it came over to the west and made TBS pay royalties for Conan even though it’s the host’s own name.

edited 7th Jun '18 1:53:05 AM by Memers

SeptimusHeap MOD from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#6: Aug 22nd 2018 at 11:21:44 PM

Clock is set.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#7: Aug 26th 2018 at 11:23:31 PM

Clock is up; closing.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
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