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CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#51: Jun 2nd 2018 at 7:18:37 PM

I wonder how China reacted to Max and Chloe?

edited 3rd Jun '18 2:04:44 AM by CharlesPhipps

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#52: Jun 6th 2018 at 1:35:22 PM

It should be noted that Sam is actually hugely popular in China, with the Official TR China fan site even stating that she has a huge following there. The only reason that we don't here that much about is that China has a number of social network blocks that makes it at best hard to express that love and please note that Sam is half Japanese so her being hugely popular in China is no small feat.

Also with the newest God of War game, (why couldn't they give it a subtitle?!) the argument that Lara needs to work alone is even more flimsy to me then before as Kratos now has a son and works with a talking head for most of the game and the newest GOW is regarded as one of if not the best in the series. I don't want to see Sam turn into a villain that Lara has to redeem as the two have been through to much together and given up to much for each other. Lara has fought through Hell to save Sam from cults and crazed Demigods and Sam almost tried to kill herself to protect Lara from Himiko and has stood by more so then anyone else and unlike Jonah, who I do love btw, Sam had to be forced to leave Lara while Jonah has left her no more then 3 times of his own free will.

Again I like the big guy but it's almost as if the characters themselves are being forced in and out of stories with very little say in the matter. Jonah has left Lara several times and each time he keeps getting brought back despite not offering all that much to the series or Lara's character and Sam keeps getting parked despite offering more to Lara and her adventures then even Richard Croft has offered. And please note that so far every writer of the series has admitted to being a fan of Sam and feeling that her relationship with Lara is key to both characters growth and development. And I do mean every last writer, Rhianna Pratchett, Gail Simone, Mariko Tamaki, Phillip Sevy and Jackson Lanzing have all gone on record of being fans of Sam and have highlighting her importance to Lara and her own personal growth.

Sam also is the only surviving member of the Endurance who has gotten her own story arc and she is the one who ultimately defeated Himiko and when you describe the story of Choice and Sacrifice and the events of A Survivor is Born their more or less identical so if they keep it vague enough if Lara and Sam talk about said events anyone who hasn't read the comics will assume they're talking about the first game.

My personal hope, at this point, is that Lara finishes Shadow by killing the person who ordered her father's death and she resolves her personal issues but when she gets home she finds Sam there waiting for her in a scene like what we got in Uncharted 4 when Elena showed up at Nate's hotel room to confront him about lying. Now it should be noted that in a interview with fan group The Raider it was stated that Sam, and Reyes, would not be returning in Shadow of the Tomb Raider. That is their exact words btw, not that Sam would never be returning just that she wouldn't be returning in Shadow so I'm still holding out hope that Sam will return.

And as God of War proved you can have a former lone wolf who had no real help have a companion throughout their adventure and not only be well received but also add to the character. Just make Sam useful in combat, focus on her and Lara rebuilding their relationship, a worthy adversary for both of them, along with a good story that is simple instead of something huge and complected and you could have a great game that could stand as one of the best in Tomb Raider's history. Hell do it right and some fans might even demand that Sam should be playable for a mission or two like what we got with Atreus.

Lara and Sam are great characters who add so much to each other, I'd even go as far to say that Sam could have her own game that explores her dealing with the fall out of everything that's happened to her throughout the series. Not a Triple A game but maybe something smaller like Life is Strange but still having the adventure element as Sam deals with a threat like a agent of Trinity or something more supernatural. Sam was strong enough to take on a Demigod for control of her own body so its a safe bet that she can take on anything after that.

TheAirman Brightness from The vicinity of an area adjacent to a location Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
Brightness
#53: Jun 7th 2018 at 5:52:13 AM

Speaking as someone who never played the “first” game Sam is a non-entity to me.

Also not sure how to feel about this statement:

Neither of which get carried over as they seem determined to do Lara as Asexual for some reason.

What’s wrong with this version of Lara being asexual?

edited 7th Jun '18 6:14:02 AM by TheAirman

PSN ID: FateSeraph Congratulations! She/They
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#54: Jun 7th 2018 at 6:05:49 AM

It's the issue of dancing around the subject, really.

If Lara is asexual, say it and show it.

If she's bi, say it and show it.

If she's heterosexual, then allow her a boyfriend like she had in previous installments.

There's a strong fear of allowing women in video games to show any form of romantic interest.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#55: Jun 9th 2018 at 9:30:52 PM

I don't think they ever will go into Lara's sexual orientation for the same reason we have never gotten a straight answer if Link and Zelda have romantic feelings for one another or not for the past 30 plus years. Personally, while I would like Lara and Sam to get together given how much romantic subtext there has been between them over the series so far, and that the only person that even came close to being a lover interest for Lara in Rise was Nadia who is pretty much a Expy of Sam I would be okay with the two never being stated to be a couple as right now I am much more interested in the two just finding each other and fixing their damaged relationship, which could be a great story in and of itself.

I mean God of War had a whole game that was just about Kratos trying to connect with his son and move on from his wife's death. A game that is all about two friends rebuilding their broken friendship while fighting off crazy cults and supernatural monsters that are almost Lovecraftian in nature could support it's own game assuming that the two characters are strong enough to support the story on their own. And Lara and Sam have proven that to be the case in the tie-in comics alone.

edited 9th Jun '18 9:35:06 PM by TheMasquerade

rmctagg09 The Wanderer from Brooklyn, NY (USA) (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
The Wanderer
#56: Jun 10th 2018 at 4:28:20 PM

E3 trailer.

Eating a Vanilluxe will give you frostbite.
ZeroDozer Incinerate! ONE HUNDRED PERCENT!! from Santo André, SP, Brazil Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#58: Jun 10th 2018 at 4:32:51 PM

That thumbnail image is... her reflection is her tied up, but at a weird angle. EDIT: Looks better in motion, now I can see what it actually is.

So, I knew from the Death Battle that Lara was a Bad Ass, but that underwater takedown is... way more hardcore assassin than I expected. Isn't she an archaeologist?

edited 10th Jun '18 4:37:08 PM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#59: Jun 10th 2018 at 7:35:13 PM

Game looks good, knock on wood, but one thing that bugs me, and this might just be me, but does Jonah look different. Yes character models change due to advancements in graphics and motion capture but something about Jonah just seems off to me. Lara looks pretty much like she did in the last two games, Definitive Edition not withstanding, but Jonah, if it wasn't for his voice actor I probably wouldn't have recognized him. His eyes, nose and jaw, there's something that just looks off. If/when Sam should return I hope they do a better job with her face then they did with Jonah's in Shadow.

edited 10th Jun '18 7:35:38 PM by TheMasquerade

ZeroDozer Incinerate! ONE HUNDRED PERCENT!! from Santo André, SP, Brazil Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#61: Jun 11th 2018 at 9:27:59 PM

Also in regards to Jonah, and I really don't like saying this as I actually like him, he seems a bit more... whiny in this game then he did in the first two. There's his telling Lara to get over herself while she is blaming herself for unleashing Apocalypse and then in the resent demo for Shadow we have him screaming that there is noway he is going to jump out of the crashing plane while being a bit of a Cluster F-Bomb while doing so before the plane just rips apart with him in the back end as it rips off.

From what I've read the whole point of Jonah's role here is to question Lara and her motives which is good but from what I've seen so far it comes off more like he's just complaining about the situation instead of being there to make Lara question her own motivations. I will reserve judgment until I know for certain but at this point Jonah is reminding me a bit to much of Pr. Demur at this point.

To catch you all up, Professor Robert Demur was a major character in the Spore arc from the canonical tie in comics to the resent Tomb Raider games. In the Spore arc Demur was a useless, whiny idiot who was really just there to make the situation worse. There is not one issue of this arc where Demur wasn't complaining about something, getting captured or getting Lara and Jonah into danger and in the final issue of Spore, he abandons Lara and Jonah even though Lara needed his help to save Jonah's life, who was only in danger because he was helping Lara save Demur earlier. One of the more annoying moments from Demur was when he was having a tantrum which turned out to be lucky as it revealed that the people who were after him where on the plane but that didn't make the situation any less annoying.

Same thing here, Jonah screaming at Lara that he isn't going to F#(king Jump out of the F#(king plane, while not unreasonable, is rather annoying given everything he and Lara have been through. If/when Sam returns she had better be better handled then what I'm seeing with Jonah as she was under Himiko's control and she was much more calm and in control of herself then Jonah is being right now. This also might add to my, Jonah suddenly changing personality ever game without explanation as he's now gone from Spiritual Teddy Bear, to close-minded cynic to guy who screams in terror and yells at he's friend when she is relying from guilt for causing a disaster.

Again this might just be how the trailers are presenting him but given that Lara seems just as awesome as she was in the first two games and comics along with presenting the villain in a interesting light then that's not a good sign.

edited 11th Jun '18 9:28:08 PM by TheMasquerade

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#62: Jun 11th 2018 at 9:37:04 PM

I've seen one scene from the game where Jonah complaints and the context is...justified.

Basically, Lara floods an entire city in her fight with Trinity and potentially kills a bunch of people.

Lara then is ready to go murder some more.

Jonah says they should go rescue the people dying instead.

But Lara wants REVENGE.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#63: Jun 13th 2018 at 12:51:04 AM

I haven't seen that see that demo a few months ago I'll take your word as you've have seen it. But I do feel my point of Jonah screaming that he's not going to jump out of the F#(king plane, for me, was a bit hard to swallow because while Jonah terror is understandable it reminds me of a character I'm not fond of which is not a good thing. To help show what I mean imagine for a moment that in the next Star Wars film we met a major character who had the same speech impediment as Jar Jar it would likely annoy a lot of fans even if the character was nothing like him.

The bit with the plane as Jonah begins panicking on the plane, while completely understandable is something that bothers me because of how it reminds me of another TR story where Lara found herself in the same situation and while the idiot turned out to be right it didn't stop him from being annoying. It also doesn't help that while Jonah may not have witnessed any of the supernatural elements of the series like Lara and Sam have he has been in worse situations then this. At this point in the series Jonah has been on a ship that had split in two and kept his head to save Lara and tried to rescue other crew members, tried to be the voice of reason alongside Sam when Reyes and Lara kept antagonizing each other and kept his cool after being tutored and nearly dying.

And if we take the comics into account, Jonah has almost drowned, had to abandon another ship while going over to Yamatai, was held hostage by crazy cultist yet again, and most damning of all, was with Lara when Pro. Demur threw his tantrum and which revealed the villains of the week had taken over the small plane. Lara had over powered them but because they were the one's flying it this obviously didn't do much for the planes flight time. And instead of panicking along with Demur about how scared he was Jonah instead helped Lara land the plane. In fact throughout all of Lara's adventures Jonah has been someone you could count on to have your back, but that scene on the plane, even if it's an isolated incident it still feels out of place for Jonah to lose his cool like that. Add to that the fact that his Cluster F-Bomb makes him come off as more annoying then anything even though he's acting like many of us likely would in that situation.

Again, I will reserve judgement until I play the game and for the most part it looks like it will be a lot of fun to play. But the way Jonah has been presented worries me.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#65: Sep 11th 2018 at 6:08:06 PM

Okay, so I've gone through Shadow and I have to say that I really did enjoy it, It was paced, the acting is good and I like how much of a dork they made Lara in this game... however... I have to address the Elephant in the Room said elephant being... Why is Jonah still in this series!?!?

I like him I really do but he has had 6 years, 3 games and 39 issues of comics and in all that time he hasn't grown at all!!! And for all the talk about how important Jonah would be in Shadow he didn't really grow all that much in this game either, if at all. One point that was brought up again and again in interviews leading up to Shadow's release was how Jonah was going to be the one to hold up the Mirror and call Lara out on her obsession with hunting down Trinity but that only really happens at the start of the game and then he's his usually supportive self who doesn't really question Lara and her quest.

After all this time and all the buildup the developers put into Jonah's role it's more or less the same as it was back in A Survivor is Born and Rise of the Tomb Raider, he's Lara good friend who is there to support her on her quest. And while he has a cute little romance with new character Abby, (on with that Thank GOD they didn't have Lara and Sam end up together as true friendship between men and women in fiction is almost if not more rare then a same-sex romantic couple) there's nothing else going for him.

As of right now I honestly think that Jonah should just be retired from the series. Not killed off or anything but just have him decide that he's had enough of Lara's Tomb Raiding world and just have him settle down with Abby and start a family and just have Sam come in as Lara's permanent companion.

Just in the first game alone Sam has more development, depth, nuance and complexity then Jonah does in the entire series and when you include the comics she proceeds to blow Jonah out of the water. Sam has gone from a frighten young woman to a Action Girl who is just as awesome as Lara is.

I do think that Sam will return and if/WHEN she does I hope that the developers make better use of her character then they did with Jonah. Give her a truly great A.I. control system along with her own set of weapons like a Katana and Throwing Knives and make the next game's story about Lara and Sam rebuilding their relationship. God of War 4 and The Last of Us was about parents bonding with their kids, Life is Strange, another Square Enix game, was about two friends reconnecting and, depending on player choice, also falling in love with one another. Marvel's Spider-Man (PS 4) is, in part, about Peter and Mary Jane rebuilding their relationship after a rather messy breakup, Uncharted 4 is about Nate and Elena working through some marital issues and Uncharted The Lost Legacy is about Chloe and Nadine becoming friends.

And shows like Steven Universe, The Legend of Korra and Adventure time all showed that you can have same-sex couples and still be a huge hit. Again I do think that Sam will return and I feel that the story, or at least one game, should be about the two rebuilding their relationship and figuring out where they go next.

There's so much that can be done with Sam and her relationship with Lara she has the potential of joining Atreus, Ellie, Cortana and Garrus as one of the truly great companions in video games.

Jonah has, again, had six years to prove himself worthy of being Lara's partner and I honestly just don't think he's up to the task.

RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#66: Sep 15th 2018 at 2:39:00 AM

I'm with you on bringing Sam back. I really liked Sam even just from the first game, and while I like Jonah too, I always preferred Sam.

Anyway, I am... not liking Shadow much at all so far. I got the early unlock edition because I was hoping for something more like Rise, with the same exciting combat sections and stuff, but instead we have... twenty minutes of talking about backstory that feels lazy and tacked-on; fifteen minutes of NPC chatter that only gives you something to do 30% of the time; five minutes trying to figure out where you're supposed to go because the platforming is at once too obvious (hello, repetitive Lara hints) and not clear enough; and then you get to fire your gun once and then put it away while the whole cycle repeats.

I found myself skipping dialogue and cutscenes last night in Paititi because it just never. Goddamn. Ended. And I wanted to actually get to play the game.

It's been fun.
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#67: Sep 15th 2018 at 9:29:10 AM

I'm rather further in now, and can I just say that the whole Predator and Apocalypse Now homage area before the refinery was amazing?! I thought the whole game was going to be like that!

It's been fun.
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#68: Sep 23rd 2018 at 12:17:24 AM

So, going over Shadow I have to say that while I did enjoy it I do feel that the games haven't had the best supporting characters. I mean they're not bad or anything, they're likeable enough and the villains are good enough for a fight but I honestly feel that the first game, A Survivor is Born, and the tie-in comics have the much better supporting characters and villains.

At this point I think I've made my feelings about Sam pretty clear so all I'll say is that I think she is great and really think she should have been Lara's companion in the games following Survivor. She has a more interesting and fun personality, and much better dynamic with Lara and is just more memorable.

And as for the rest of the cast, I can't remember any of their names aside from Abby and I for the life of me I can't recall a single character trait of any of them besides stoic. I think the issue here is that so much work went into Lara's character that the others are pretty much forgotten in order to make sure that Lara has as much time as possible and the issue with that is it makes everyone else seem rather bland by comparison.

However, this isn't the case for the characters in the comics or Rise of the Tomb Raider's DLC characters. And most of those characters are just voices we hear from letters or recordings.

In the first game, while the supporting cast was rather flat they at the very least had memorable personalities. Grim was the badass grandpa, Whitman was the slimy TV show host obsessed with fame, Roth was the wise mentor and Reyes was the tough as nails, no nonsense cop. And of course there was Sam who was upbeat and loved to tell stories, yet was level headed enough to deal with the situation with all the seriousness that was required and while she was scared she was still able to keep her head for the most part and didn't complain about the situation.

Not much but that's more then what we've gotten in Rise and Shadow where you could honestly switch out the cast for both games and it wouldn't really change anything.

And then we have the comics which have some really good characters and villains. Mr. Cruz is one of the most vial and horrible characters I have ever seen in a work of fiction and it was so satisfying to see him get his comeuppance and how long and drawn out it was. And villains like Cortez and Nadija I honestly found them to be more interesting then Dominguez as we fully understand their motives and why they are the way they are without it feeling forced.

With Dominguez I never really understood why he wanted to remake the world. Yes, he wants to protect his home but how does that translate to making the world a paradise without conflict? With Cortez she also wants to protect her own little corner of the world and to do that she needs money for weapons and food. So she kidnaps one of Lara's friends to trade them for the money. Simple and easy and yet this makes her a more compelling threat then Dominguez who's seems to have two goals that don't really seem to have to do that much with what he's doing.

And over with Nadija, she's like Lara if she didn't have her friends to keep her in check as she's more interested with the secrets of the world and she doesn't care who or what she has to destroy to get to them. Again, very simple and yet she's honestly more compelling as a villain that any one we meet in Shadow.

And then we have the companions and the comics did a fantastic job in fleshing out Sam, Reyes and even one off characters like Dana, (a woman who is going blind but proves to be a skilled fighter as she teaches Lara and Reyes a thing or two) and Pro. Morrow who is turns out to be in league with a good spirit who informs Lara how Sam is doing with Himiko.

I feel that this is what Rise and Shadow are missing. Companions and villains that are just interesting as our hero but how never take attention away from her. Lara is great but she really needs someone like Sam to play off of as she is just as deep and complex as Lara who adds to her while still being her own great character. And also bring in Nadija, if she survives the comics, and just make TR 4 about her wanting to kill Lara out of revenge for destroying Trinity.

RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#69: Sep 23rd 2018 at 12:40:36 AM

I mean, Shadow was all over the place with its thematics, really. They do a lot of parallels with Ix Chel and Chak Chel's whole twin motif (though without ever actually explaining who they are), paint them as complements who work together to save the sun, and then... completely ignores any influence Ix Chel might have had on Lara, introduces an antagonist with zero personality and no personal connection to Lara no matter how much the game tries to force one, and tries far harder than it should have to get you to care about Paititi's interminable goddamn nonsense.

It's been fun.
TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#70: Sep 23rd 2018 at 1:50:44 AM

Before we go on I have a requests, I found out about a scene in Shadow that takes place at the start of the game during the Day of the Dead Festival where Jonah says that he got a birthday call from Sam and asks Lara when was the last time she spook to her. To which Lara says that she also got a call while she and Jonah were in Bali and that she has been meaning to get back to her.

Could someone PLEASE put this on Shadow's heartwarming page as it shows that while they still have their issues Sam still cares about Lara, and Lara still cares about Sam and that they seem to be trying to work out their issues. Please, it would mean the world to me!!!

TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#71: Sep 23rd 2018 at 1:51:54 AM

Shadow does have it's issues but thematically I think it was actually pretty strong. Though I do agree that Dominguez is, IMO, a rather weak villain with a lot of nuance but, as you said, no real personality. While she has only appeared in 3 issues so far Nadija is a much more compelling villain and the one I was hoping we would get in Shadow as she has a much more interesting dynamic with Lara as she is shows what Lara could be if her obsession over took her.

And again, while I like Jonah he also suffers from having very little personality and is really there more to flesh out Lara's character while having no real character of his own. The campfire scene is the best example of this as while it IS a great scene with fantastic dialogue, is wonderfully acted, directed, written and the music is great and helps us get a look into Lara's character in a way that felt natural and real, Jonah has no real character here. Him talking about his brother is just there to segue into Lara talking about her parents and him saying that he wouldn't change the world is also there more to tell us why Lara doesn't do it later.

We get an idea of their friendship and why it matters to Lara but we don't really get why Jonah is here and why His friendship with Lara matters to him. The thing of it is I wanted a scene like this but between Lara and Sam and for them to be working out their issues.

In the comics there's a scene where Lara is suffering from stage fright and Sam gives a little speech about why she loves Lara, (her words not mine). In this speech Sam says that she loves how Lara can look at a artifact and see the hands who made it, wonder about their family and the life they had and see that world for a moment. And then, and this is the important bit, Sam more or less says that she sees the world the same way and that the play Lara is about to star in, Pride and Prodigious, is everyone else's way of seeing what Lara sees and that the book of Pride and Prodigious is her favorite book and tells Lara why She loves it.

While more lighthearted then the scene between Lara and Jonah in Shadow I honestly feel that it is the better scene because while Sam is talking about Lara she is also revealing things about herself. Her likes and interests and as a result we see what Lara sees in Sam. But the campfire scene we don't really learn anything about Jonah. We learn he has a brother, who we've never seen more met, and that Johan feels guilty about his death but most damming of all is Jonah saying he wouldn't change the world because everything he loves is in it.

Well, what does he love? We know he likes people and that he gets a girlfriend with Abby and he cares for Lara but we never learn WHY he cares for these things. We learn about Lara and why she does what she does but Jonah feels like a poor mans Sully from Uncharted. Sam is the better character because the writers put the time into fleshing out her character and giving her a more interesting personality.

Again, I do hope that Jonah retires and settles down with Abby after Shadow and that Sam takes Jonah's place as Lara's companion for the rest of the series.

lara16 Since: Mar, 2018
#72: Sep 23rd 2018 at 10:19:06 AM

I like the game overall. The exploring is fun, the combat segmets are well spaced out, the set pieces are good, and I like that the "evil natives" are actually the good guys, if a bit... terrifying and overeager to slaughter. The end game was brilliant, watching them fight with you and all.

What I like less are the characters. Unuratu and her son are both fine supporting characters. I don't get why Abby exists — she gives some exposition but anyone could have had that role. Jonah is okay, but every single time Lara and him shared some kind of moment I couldn't help but think "if only this was Sam with Lara, then I'd actually really enjoy this". With Jonah, it just fell flat for me. I just don't find him and his relationship with Lara compelling at all.

The villains are a mixed bag. Dominguez is actually really interesting. I like how sympathetic they made him, even when he died, but I do think he was kind of underused. I think he would have benefitted if he'd had a few more scenes with Lara. Rourke was barely even a character, on the other hand. He's just... there sometimes. And taunts Lara like they're arch enemies or something. When he died, I barely registered it.

Oh, also did anyone else think Lara died at the end? I thought she had to sacrifice her life to put a stop to the whole thing and when she showed up a minute later I was so confused. I must have missed something.

Edited by lara16 on Sep 23rd 2018 at 10:21:33 AM

TheMasquerade Since: Aug, 2014
#73: Sep 23rd 2018 at 6:54:16 PM

I think Abby is there to give Jonah a love interest so fans who insist that Lara and Jonah are a couple would realize that's not the case. And in this case I'm okay with that as I Do like the fact that Lara and Jonah are only friends but other then that she's not really a character she's just Jonah's girlfriend. But again I'm okay with that as she's a minor character who servers her role in the plot and then leaves and, as I've said before, hopefully Jonah retires with Abby settles down a starts a family with her.

As for the villains, yeah they're really just meh. Not terrible and serve their role but neither Dominguez or Rourke really struck a cored with me and of their deaths really felt satisfying like Mathias or Himiko's did. Again their not terrible but I think even Ana was a better villain and as her motives and goal were something anyone can understand, she was dying of cancer and wanted to live and was willing to do anything to achieve that goal and Nadija from the comics was also very simplistic yet easy to related to. She lost all those she loved and has retreated into discovering the past as a means to escape her pain like Lara has.

Dominguez on the other hand, as I've said before, seems to have two goals and the game has to bend over backwards in order to connect them. He wants to protect his home and reshape the world to make it a paradise. We're told this is what he wants but the two seem to be almost unconnected and when he talks about either goal he seems to change his character.

And of course there's Jonah who is just, okay. He's so Okay he's average as while scenes around him like the campfire and Lara finding out he's alive during the Oil Refinery mission are great that's more due to Lara and her character but nothing to do with Jonah. Compare Jonah's Fake Out Death, with saving Sam from Himiko during the equally awesome burning palace mission from the first game. Do to the documents and bits you do see of Sam during cutscenes and just how worried Lara is for her safety that when you save her from the palace works in a away that Jonah's Fake Out Death didn't because there was more time to showing and developing the relationship between Lara and Sam even if you didn't read the Prequel comic. We see Sam being supportive and hear her having her own issues and why she wants to see Yamatai so and at the end, she's grown a little bit which is much more then can be said for Jonah.

The reason I think Jonah is weaker then Sam as a character, and this is only going off the games, is that he doesn't really grow and seems to be there more to give Lara someone to worry over and save. In just the games Sam needed to be rescued twice while Jonah has now been captured and needed to be rescued 4 or 5 times and so far he hasn't actually contributed anything to the plot or Lara's character other then give her a means to externalize her thoughts.

Sam helped fund the voyage to Yamatai, gave Lara the courage to share her ideas about where Yamatai was, managed to get in contact with Lara while she was captured, made her way through the palace as it was burning with no help from anyone after Lara saved her, supported Lara's idea of taking the boat inland in order to get off the island and stood up to Reyes when she threatened to leave Lara on the island. And, if we're taking the comics into account, was fighting against Himiko entering her body as revealed in the Choice and Sacrifice arc since the souls of host were removed before she would enter their bodies.

And what has Jonah done throughout the series? He shot a few people in the first game, off screen, shot a few people on panel in the comics first arc, helped Lara climb a mountain in Rise, and didn't really do anything in Shadow. I mean it Looks like he does but all those moments are scripted and if you go off script he doesn't actually do anything to help. I found this out the hard way as I had, gone off script and got into a fire fight with the Trinity thugs and not two feat away from me was Jonah Quietly killing a Trinity thug who seemed completely disinterested in the fire fighting going on not to feat away from him. And in regards to helping Lara move certain obstacles if you go back to those same areas you can just as easily crawl under them and finally there's the One puzzle Jonah helps with where all he does is hold a certain item until Lara figures out what to do.

He doesn't really help during combat, in stealth he's just an illusion and with puzzles if you get stuck he will NOT help you in anyway and only repeats what Lara says. It really says something when Nadia, aka Sam in everything but name, proved to be more useful then Jonah did in the entirety of Shadow as she's actually helps Lara by telling her what she needs to counter counter Baba Yaga's hallucination drugs and in Cold Darkness she will also tell you when the Zombies are about to attack and how to solve every puzzle while providing some funny comments. And then we get into the comics where Sam continues to be more helpful then Jonah who, as per usual at this point, isn't all that useful except in the Spore arc, aka the filler episode that doesn't actually matter.

Sam is more useful, has a more fleshed out personality, has had more development in the first game alone then Jonah has in the entire series and that's including the comics and adds a lot more to Lara's character then Jonah ever has.

Also could someone PLEASE make note of the fact that Sam called Lara and that Lara has been meaning to get back to her on Shadow of the Tomb Raider's Heartwarming page!?! I'd do it myself but I'm not allowed to edit on Trope pages due to a few mistakes I made thanks in part do to my dyslexia.

Here's the scene in question. :D

https://twitter.com/thevalkyriors/status/1041310727271723010

Edited by TheMasquerade on Jan 8th 2019 at 3:13:38 PM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#74: Jan 21st 2019 at 11:51:55 PM

So I played this....and it's basically the same game as the other two.

Which isn't normally a problem but it is very very noticeable.

It is weird how they did all this set up for Trinity and it's very clear that they tacked Trinity onto this game as they have absolutely nothing to do with this plot otherwise and get wrapped up completely.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#75: Jan 22nd 2019 at 12:20:13 AM

I would personally have preferred a little more of Rise in there, myself. Like, maybe another 40-50% of Rise.

It's been fun.

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