Duplicate tropes discussion thread

Honey Trap vs. Femme Fatale Spy? Was looking into the spying-kind of Pillow Talk.

Ambiguously Evil characters are mostly those who are helpful to the protagonists but whose other actions raise questions about whether their alliance is sincere or convenient/exploitative. Most of the clearest examples are also either Double Reverse Quadruple Agent (e.g. Garak, the consummate liar who apparently keeps betraying Cardassian intelligence, repeatedly, and refuses to admit he's ever worked for them), Mysterious Backer (e.g. Neow, who's helping the protagonists in order to get her own revenge and won't let them die until they succeed, but keeps them oblivious to the endless loop of death she's trapped them in), or Blue-and-Orange Morality (e.g. Dormin is obviously corrupting Wander's body until it can possess him and escape its prison, but Wander is the one who insisted against Dormin's own advice, and no one ever says why Dormin was originally sealed), but none of them are strictly subtropes.

Edited by Noaqiyeum on May 19th 2023 at 9:51:19 AM

Not an answer but would like to point out that Go Seduce My Archnemesis also seems indistinguishable from these two.

I actually asked the diff b/w Honey Trap and Go Seduce My Archnemesis some time ago [1] and have put both on my personal "do a wick check" list because the answer I got wasn't satisfactory

Edited by amathieu13 on May 19th 2023 at 7:00:12 AM

I don't understand the distinction between Disney Dog Fight and Let Him Choose. Both pages reference each other in the trope description (with the former saying "compare Let Him Choose" and the latter saying "contrast Disney Dog Fight"), but without any explanation of their relationship.

I don't think the contributors to the pages see much difference either: out of 29 top-level examples on Let Him Choose, and 36 on Disney Dog Fight, 12 are duplicated between the two tropes (assuming Brown Wolf is the "major Tear Jerker" on Let Him Choose).

Not saying all of them are redundant, but why do have so many romance tropes?

• Romance Arc
• Romance Novel Tropes
• Romance Novel Plots

I asked this exact question a few weeks ago. The answer I got left me dissatisfied.

Catch a Falling Star and Improbable Falling Save? Isn't this the same concept of the stress of an abrupt halt experienced by the falling versus the catching character? According to Newton's law this would seem like two sides of the same coin, no?

Catch a Falling Star says on its description that it usually applies to moving characters (usually in vehicles) whereas Improbable Falling Save applies to stationary characters, but honestly they do read to me as basically being the same trope. the pictures would make me assume CAFS is the case of catching someone as they're falling whereas IFS is catching someone before they fall, which might honestly be a more notable distinction?

No, IFS is about catching people as they're falling, too. CAFS has the catcher swoop in to catch the faller, while IFS has the catcher stay in place and grab the faller as they fall past.

Edited by badtothebaritone on May 22nd 2023 at 9:33:40 AM

oh yes, sorry, i didn't make it clear that i was referring to the catcher there (CAFS is the catcher moving in mid-air and IFS is the catcher stationary but in a position where they should be pulled down). that's such a minor distinction though, and again the images don't really help imo

Activist-Fundamentalist Antics vs. Soapbox Sadie?

Like ostensibly, the difference is that the former is/should be motivated by religion, but a lot of the listed examples aren't.

Edited by JethroQWalrustitty on May 23rd 2023 at 1:02:38 PM

feels like that should definitely just be merged into Soapbox Sadie because that's the off-wiki term anyway

Activist-Fundamentalist Antics should be made into a disambig page consisting of Dry Crusader, Heteronormative Crusader, Moral Guardians, Soapbox Sadie, The Fundamentalist, and a few others.

What’s the difference between Red Herring Twist and Halfway Plot Switch ?

from the looks of it, Red Herring Twist doesn't necessarily require the plot to change completely like Halfway Plot Switch, it's just that an important plot element is revealed to be irrelevant and the plot continues from there. basically it'd be the difference between a whodunnit revealing that the main suspect was actually innocent but the investigation continuing anyway, versus a whodunnit being solved halfway through and the plot switching to covering the culprit's arrest and trial

Indy Escape vs. Run or Die?

Edited by petersohn on May 24th 2023 at 1:35:15 PM

One is running away from a a trap that moves linearly the other is unwinnable fights.

What is the exact difference between Two-Act Structure (especially the parallel variant, but really both) and Kishōtenketsu?

Dp

Edited by Synchronicity on May 24th 2023 at 9:04:16 AM

For one, Kishōtenketsu is a four act structure… but I wouldn’t worry too much about trying to squish preexisting terms together.

Kishōtenketsu is also a very particular type of plot structure in japanese media without driving conflict; the four acts are introduction, development, twist, conclusion. in a Two-Act Structure the only real requirements are that the plot has two parts where the first is more light-hearted and the second is more serious. kishotenketsu also doesn't have the requirement that it needs to become more serious — it's the basis for yonkoma gag comics, after all

Edited by NoUsername on May 24th 2023 at 8:36:32 AM

So, how is Sinister Sorority Sisters and Fiendish Fraternity meaningfully different from each other, besides the fact that one is for "girl-groups" and the other is "guy-groups"?

Edited by Adept on May 26th 2023 at 10:45:33 PM

They're evil in different ways. Sinister Sorority Sisters are more catty and Alpha Bitch-y. They're going to humiliate their pledges, they're prone to backstabbing and cruel acts of bullying, and will show up in a "Sorority Horror" genre film.

In the Fiendish Fraternity, things are a little more... rape-y. They're the Jerk Jock types who throw wild parties, spike drinks, and abuse women.

Basically, it's the grown up group equivalents of Alpha Bitch and Jerk Jock.

Grew Beyond Their Programming and Instant A.I.: Just Add Water! are both about machines becoming more intelligent than they were built to be. From the names, you'd think the latter is a sub-trope where it happens very quickly or in weird ways, but the description seems to include gradual self-learning in the vein of realistic futurism.