He got hit with the fanservice stick, in more ways than one
For instance the current Nightwing run is mostly about how wholesome and beloved he is than actually doing epic action stuff
There is action stuff but it's all second hand and very easy with little tension cause it's largely overfocused on moments showing what he a good wholesome cute person he is
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."It's this Double Standard where when male characters are ogling, it's creepy (rightfully so) but when it's female characters doing the ogling it's Played for Laughs instead of being deliberately creepy and uncomfortable.
It's weird as hell that they kept bringing up he was gay too, adds to the creepy factor.
Within Harley Quinn, I knew Nightwing would be joked about, everyone's joked about in this show, but there is a weird Double Standard going on where it would get called out if any of the female characters were getting as harassed and ogled as much as Nightwing is.
Edited by PhiSat on Aug 10th 2023 at 3:03:42 AM
Oissu!Granted Harley already has a whole history of sexually harassing characters and getting away with it.
Whenever she teams up with an attractive female hero, like Wonder Woman or Power Girl, she always acts like a horndog pervert. Constantly invading their space and even stealing their clothes so she can wear it later. And she is never portrayed pretty badly for this, with the female heroes even getting along with and liking her in spite of the perversion.
So of course they would fall into the issue of portraying sexualization as less heinous if Harley is the one doing it.
Edited by slimcoder on Aug 10th 2023 at 2:16:38 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."![]()
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The double standard that jumped out to me in the last episode was the conversation with Babs roommate, who loved murderous villain Harley, then agrees to go along with her 'since you're basically a cop now and I don't want any brown people getting hurt' like...you can choose either characterization, but both is a bit weird. Violence is only bad when the police/heroes do it is just incoherent.
Edited by ECD on Aug 11th 2023 at 10:22:34 AM
The two positions aren't really mutually exclusive, if she enjoys Harley harming the people she previously goes after (which tends to be rich people, mobsters, law enforcers, and other supervillains, she wasn't exactly a kill for the sake of killing villain, and the one time she was indiscriminate while working for Darkseid, it was considered her going too far, instead of embracing the villain she truly was), but don't like minorities getting injured. Kind of like people who enjoy murderous vigilantes who go after the mafia or minorities, but less likely to enjoy them if they also went after crooked cops and white supremacists, because they identify with law enforcement or the current structural hierarchy. It's not that they dislike the murderous killing, just who the murderous killing is targeting.
Edited by HeyMikey on Aug 11th 2023 at 10:53:50 AM
Amusingly the large majority of the supervillains in Gotham are white, so that concern is completely unfounded anyway.
I think the only rogues that are arguably not-white are the AL Ghuls and Bane.
Which granted being supportive of any kind of murderous killer is pretty fucked up. It's not like Harley previously was some noble warrior fighting for a great cause, she was just some maniac doing whatever for the luz. Hardly any kind of admirable figure unless you want to be a supervillain yourself.
Edited by slimcoder on Aug 11th 2023 at 11:39:18 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."The world of Harley Quinn is all kinds of screwed up already. The people of Gotham voted in the Joker after all and he was considered the lesser of two evils. It's not like we're supposed to find any of this admirable, just hilarious.
And even in this screwed up world, there is still social inequity, since supervillainy is both played seriously at times and also a publicly accepted career path, with all the corporate BS associated. All the Gotham villains being white is treated the same as all the world's biggest CEO billionaires being white, with Harley's earlier rampage treated less like villainous insanity and more a combination growing from an abusive relationship and creating her own startup business.
There's also how Psycho saying the c-word apparently makes him unworkable in a business' filled with all manor of murderers.
Bonus that Ivy later says it herself against the League.
Amusingly the whole bit has received some ribbing from non-American viewers since in European countries the c-word is considered a general insult that everyone uses.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."< Amusingly the whole bit has received some ribbing from non-American viewers since in European countries the c-word is considered a general insult that everyone uses.
That's mostly in Australia,everywhere else in Europe 'cunt' is the big c worse then the f bomb
have a listen and have a link to my discord serverOkay yeah this is definitely gonna be the most contested bit of the season yet.
The idea of the Batfamily having to take fighting lessons from Harley cause they are too reliant on gadgetry.
Which I realize that all this is an extension of the shows depiction of Batman as a hyperaggressive spoiled manchild.
Which it was funny when it was just applied Bruce but now they are applying it to the whole Batfam, making them spoiled rich kids too reliant on their expensive gadgets and it just winds up feeling mean-spirited and kinda nonsensical.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."I could buy it with Barbara. She's the least combat experienced, even if she probably learned a bit from her dad (probably before he became the burnt out husk he is now), but Dick and Damien?
The original Robin, who's been heroing since he was about 13, and the kid who's mom is the current head of the League of Assassins?
In what world do they rely too much on gadgets?
That being said....this is Harley Quinn. It's a comedy. So I'm not shocked it went for something this silly, because that's what it does.
In conclusion: don't take it seriously.
Edited by HandsomeRob on Aug 11th 2023 at 5:18:15 AM
One Strip! One Strip!![]()
What makes it eye-rolling is that they are taking advice from Harley of all characters.
If this was them going to Lady Shiva or Bronze Tiger for practice, I can buy that and we can get some cool characters out of it. But them seriously going to clown lady whose entire martial history is high-school gym and being doped on slight enhancement drugs from Ivy, then its just dumb.
It very much feels like propping up Harley as the voice of reason and most competent figure in the story at the expense of other characters. And thats when the parody starts feeling dishonest and shallow.
Edited by slimcoder on Aug 11th 2023 at 5:27:05 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."Eh. I'm just not taking it seriously.
I just think it's better for my sanity. When I do that, I can enjoy it pretty easily.
One Strip! One Strip!
Eh, not sure I'd agree, she's certainly the protagonist, but the key trait of a Mary Sue is the way the writer bends everything to make them look good. They aren't the main character, they're the only character. The show's total amorality means that it basically doesn't have to care how Harley looks, if that makes any sense?

That page actually precedes that movie amusingly enough.
The movie was released in 2017 while the comic ran in 2014.
Which granted butts page aside the Grayson comic is still very well regarded for the most part which the same can't be said for the Batman and Harley film.
Edited by slimcoder on Aug 10th 2023 at 11:43:59 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."