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Nightmare Fuel cleanup and maintenance

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It appears that many Nightmare Fuel pages have problems, including:

1. Listing non-scary things that made the viewer feel slightly uncomfortable at worst.

2. Having spoiler tags on them (which is against the page's guidelines).

3. Listing Fridge Horror and fan theories.

And much more!

On a few occasions, people from outside the site's community have pointed out our overly lax usage of Nightmare Fuel to make fun of us, meaning that it can legitimately harm our reputation to let this go unchecked.

The TRS thread meant for redefining Nightmare Fuel started to become a place for cleaning up Nightmare Fuel pages in general, so we may as well move these discussions to Long Term Projects where they belong.

Here are the guidelines to determine whether something is Nightmare Fuel or not.

    Nightmare Fuel rules 
  • This is a page whose name is intended to be taken more literally than most. It's not enough for material to be scary; to truly qualify, it has to be frightening enough to legitimately unnerve/disturb the viewer, with actually being nightmare-inducing as the ultimate endpoint.
    • Good signs that something IS Nightmare Fuel include if:
      • It left you feeling shaken even after the credits had rolled, you turned the last page, or are otherwise done with the work.
      • You have a hard time falling asleep if you think about it at night, or have a literal nightmare about it.
      • You dread that episode, scene, level, chapter, or song during re-watches, and consider skipping it.
    • With that said, don't add something just because it happens to be your personal phobia. For example, spiders can be scary and many people have arachnophobia, but just because a spider happens to be in the work, it does not make a Nightmare Fuel entry. It needs to reasonably be scary to someone without the phobia.
    • Don't confuse tension with fear. If the hero is in trouble, but you know he'll make it out okay at the end, it's probably not Nightmare Fuel unless the threat is especially disturbing.
  • Explain WHY the entry scared you. Try to convey your sense of fear to your readers. Avoid putting up Zero-Context Examples.
    • Remember that Weblinks Are Not Examples, and neither are quotes on their own. You should explain the horror in your own words, rather than rely on others to do so.
  • Don't add things that might have scared someone. If it didn't scare you, and you don't personally know anyone else who was scared, you shouldn't be adding it to Nightmare Fuel.
  • Nightmare Fuel should stick to you even after you're done with the work.
    • If something is initially presented as scary but turns out to be harmless, it's most likely not Nightmare Fuel since The Reveal makes the scariness vanish.
    • Jump Scares are a good source of Nightmare Fuel, but not all of them automatically qualify: being startled is not the same as being scared.
  • Hypotheticals are not Nightmare Fuel:
    • Remember that Trailers Always Lie: a scene that is presented as scary in the trailer could very well turn out to be inoffensive in the finished work. Only add examples from unreleased works if they were especially terrifying in the previews.
    • Fan theories do not belong on the Nightmare Fuel page under any circumstance. No matter how much evidence they have to support them, don't add them until they've been officially confirmed. In the meanwhile, take them to Wild Mass Guessing.
    • Fridge Horror goes on the Fridge page, not Nightmare Fuel. Don't add it unless it's Ascended Fridge Horror.
  • Keep in mind the work's intended audience when considering whether or not something is Nightmare Fuel.
    • If something is normal or expected in the genre, it does not automatically qualify. Violence in a Fighting Series or gore in a horror movie must be especially disturbing or gruesome by the work's standards to be Nightmare Fuel.
    • Remember that Kids Shouldn't Watch Horror Films. If a work is rated PG-13 or higher but would only be scary to young children, it's not Nightmare Fuel.
    • The standards on what qualifies as Nightmare Fuel are especially stringent on works aimed at children and pre-teens: kids have hyperactive imaginations, so even something benign can give them nightmares.
  • Spoiler tags do not belong on Nightmare Fuel pages. Much of what scares us comes from inherently spoilery stuff such as death and the unknown, so finding spoilers on these pages should be expected.
  • Nightmare Fuel is an Audience Reaction, so it needs to be scary for the audience. Describing how the characters react to something scary isn't needed. Just because something scares them, that doesn't mean it scares us as well.

Guidelines when proposing cleanup of a page:

  • Some rules are pretty objective. If you see a Zero-Context Example, Fridge Horror, speculation, In-Universe reaction, examples that describe themselves as not being very scary, or examples that are just scene summaries without going into detail about why it's so scary, you should remove them immediately without coming here to ask.
  • You should also strip all spoiler tags from the page. Itty Bitty Wiki Tools has a tool for that, but it can cause problems, so if you use it be sure to preview the page and thoroughly look it over.
  • Once you've fixed the objective issues with the page, bring it here so we can look at the more subjective problems, such as examples that may not be scary enough to qualify. If a consensus is reached that a certain entry does not qualify, it can be removed.

Edited by Zuxtron on Nov 16th 2018 at 3:14:41 PM

rjd1922 Paladin from Illinois Relationship Status: Love is for the living, Sal
Paladin
Oct 2nd 2019 at 1:57:37 AM

I think NightmareFuel.Twitch Plays Pokemon and its subpages were prematurely cut since, as bwburke94 said here, the fan interpretation is what makes TPP tropeworthy. Also, NightmareFuel.Deagle Nation only has three bad examples.

EDIT: bwburke94, not WarJay.

Edited by rjd1922 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 4:27:36 AM

Steel be with you.
WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 2nd 2019 at 2:01:13 AM

[up] Wrong person, I was pro-cutting

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
GastonRabbit A troper draws near! from Robinson, Illinois, USA Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
A troper draws near!
Oct 2nd 2019 at 3:18:28 AM

I was in favor of cutting, and I think the cutlist reason is accurate. Nightmare Fuel subpages are not for Fanon, memes, or Wild Mass Guessing.

I previously mentioned the various non-canon subpages that got deleted a while back.

Edit: There's this part in the opening post, regarding what isn't allowed on Nightmare Fuel subpages:

3. Listing Fridge Horror and fan theories.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Oct 2nd 2019 at 1:26:58 PM

"Guess what? You got it for free. Are you proud of yourself?"
Oct 2nd 2019 at 11:20:13 AM

NightmareFuel.Sonic The Hedgehog IDW is organized by years of publication, which other Sonic comic NF pages don't have, and while some of the examples have merit others are like " Issue #21: It becomes immediately apparent that the Zeti are going to take advantage of Starline's offer of alliance to stab him and Eggman in the back." and " Sonic meets up with Amy who's trying to coordinate rescue efforts. At one point losing contact with a ship and trying desperately to get them to respond. The expressions of Sonic and her speak volumes."

Edited by lalalei2001 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 11:20:36 AM

The Protomen enhanced my life.
WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 2nd 2019 at 12:09:01 PM

But yeah, the fact that the fandom surrounding Twitch Plays Pokemon is a big part of the work doesn't mean it is the work. For a while now we've been operating under the rule of "something that is not present in the work itself can't make the work scary", and this still holds, even if the work is loaded with fan interpretation.

I'm even wondering if TPP shouldn't be moved to, say, JFF, because it's literally all fan interpretation, and I'm not even sure if we can actually trope things that aren't literally present in the work. Seems like a bit of a stretch. I'm just not sure how to handle a work that isn't tropeworthy alone, but has tropeworthy fandom, unless it's in a namespace where the entire point is to be silly and unrealistic.

Tl;Dr: I'm not convinced fanon should even be tropeworthy on the main page, let alone on Nightmare Fuel. But this concern opens up a big rabbit hole, and we're best not discussing it all here.

Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 3:12:31 PM

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
AlleyOop Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
Oct 2nd 2019 at 12:27:15 PM

I feel like that kind of stuff should be posted under WMG or Analysis rather than moving the whole thing to JFF which is essentially consigning it to an asylum.

WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 2nd 2019 at 12:30:06 PM

Maybe, but if that's the only tropeworthy content...like, even just skimming the Let's Play/ page, a good 75% of the page is fanon.

And, again, this probably isn't the place to discuss it as a whole, it was just a worry that occurred to me when typing the previous post.

Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 3:31:48 PM

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
Oct 2nd 2019 at 6:17:11 PM

Okay, for the fanfic, Remnant Inferis: DOOM, one troper added a lot of entries to the Nightmare fuel page. However, while creaturefeature1 and I cleaned up most of the spelling and grammatical problems with that tropers entries, a lot of them feel too... nattery. Can someone go to the page and give the entries he added a look-over?

FridgeGuy2016 No-lifer from United States
No-lifer
Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:34:46 PM

Bad news.sad The real life examples I deleted on NightmareFuel.Other have been recreated.

Limpin' with the bizkit.
WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:40:28 PM

Let's ping them in for a chat.

Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 11:40:49 AM

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
rjd1922 Paladin from Illinois Relationship Status: Love is for the living, Sal
Paladin
Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:41:43 AM

I think the broadcast hijackings should stay, since they could be considered works.

Steel be with you.
Oct 3rd 2019 at 11:50:51 AM

Hey everyone, it seems like several of our requests to look at pages (like my Chulip request) were ignored. Can someone please reply to let me know that they are looking at them? Zuxtron or otherwise?

WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 3rd 2019 at 11:52:06 AM

[up] I mean, usually on this thread people just bring pages and look at them themselves and then we all pitch in. The only reason I've asked others to look at a page for me is because it's a page I made and I'm not objective about it.

This isn't really a "ask people to do this thing" thread.

Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 3rd 2019 at 2:59:48 PM

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
Oct 3rd 2019 at 12:07:29 PM

[up]Oh, so that's how this works. Got it. Never used the nightmare fuel thread forums until now, so I wasn't aware. What would you suggest I do to fix up the moments pages for Remnant Inferis: DOOM?

WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 3rd 2019 at 12:10:16 PM

[up] I usually paste the source code into a folder and then go through entry by entry and write my personal thoughts. Then others will pitch in. For a start, Fridge Horror, blatant shoehorns, natter, and ZCEs are all things to look out for, with anything else being up to personal interpretation. So just start looking for the obvious problems.

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
rjd1922 Paladin from Illinois Relationship Status: Love is for the living, Sal
Paladin
Oct 3rd 2019 at 12:39:44 PM

As well as the aforementioned Deagle Nation, Chuggaaconroy, and Dragon Ball Z, most examples on NightmareFuel.Awkward Zombie lack context and violate Weblinks Are Not Examples.

Edited by rjd1922 on Oct 3rd 2019 at 2:41:03 PM

Steel be with you.
Oct 3rd 2019 at 1:38:26 PM

[up][up]So where do I put the folder? Do I need to make a Sandbox page first then add the folder there? I've never done this before despite being on this site for a year, so any advice would be appreciated.

Oct 3rd 2019 at 1:44:04 PM

Just put the folder in your post, the markup works even on the forums.

Oct 3rd 2019 at 1:58:55 PM

Alright, here's the info from the page:

    Remnant Inferis: DOOM Nightmare Fuel Page 
  • Things already start off horrific in the opening with a gruesome White Fang assault on an Atlas facility. The thoughts of the faunas show that they started out as kind and peaceful, but once Adam came along and brought about more radical changes, they became just as bloodthirsty as him. The dog faunas (Aiden Hansen), in particular, feels no remorse for anything he did.
  • Once the Slayer wakes up, shit hits the fan for the White Fang, as he slams one's head into his pod hard enough to jam his nose into his brain, outright punches the jaw clean off of another, and blowing the head off the last one. The kicker with the one who got her jaw punched off? She was still alive! Even after something like that, she survived long enough to attempt to crawl to the exit, only to get her brains blown out. Aiden survived his initial attack and lived just long enough to witness all the above. All any of them can do is beg for mercy that will never come.
  • The nightmares that team RWBY goes through get incredibly morbid.
    • Ruby's is probably the worst of them. She wakes up naked, surrounded by blood, flesh and guts. She then hears a voice behind her, which turns out to be her mother. Before she can run up to hug her, it's revealed that this Summer had her eyes bored out of her sockets and has a giant, bloody hole in her stomach, indicating that her womb was torn out of her body.
      Summer: Please, Ruby. Come rot in Hell with me.
      • If that wasn't bad enough, she then tries to drown her daughter in blood and rot, all while her daughter begs for help.
    • In Blake's nightmare, the Slayer, in his DOOM Eternal suit, kill everyone in the White Fang, including her father and Ilia in front of her. After that, undead White Fang members catch her and just before being killed, she sees Adam's reflection in the Slayer's visor instead of her own.
    • Weiss dream is that she was defeated by the Arma Gigas and had to submit to her father's will. After that her father, flanked by Classic Doom's Imps, reveals that he sold the world to the demons. Just before being killed she had to watch Atlas being destroyed by Hell.
      • She later suffers from mind rape via a Pain Elemental, forcing her to remember every bad thing about her family.
    • Yang's nightmare is tamer, but having her stepmother killed in front of her by an Imp's arm that comes out of nowhere is very disturbing.
  • The cults are horrific enough on there own with sacrificing anyone to bring demons to Remnant, but the fact that almost anyone can be a member of these cults is Paranoia Fuel at it's most disturbing. The person right next to you could be a cultist just waiting to sacrifice you for a ritual, and you don't even know it.
    • Not only that, but the cults are really charismatic, convincing an entire city to just allow everyone to be sacrificed to Hell, including parents, like the human woman that allowed herself to be sacrificed and her two daughters to be taken to the cathedral. They also corrupted Team GRVE with only words and showing two humans being sacrificed to the demons.
  • The fact that a wrong word in the satanic rituals can kill the cultists is also terrifying. The cultists in the cathedral misread a syllable, and it alone was enough to kill everyone in the room with the exception of Fiola.
    • That being said, it was a good thing, because if he hadnít misread the texts, a real gore nest and a portal would be created. In other words, Remnant just survived this one through sheer dumb luck.
  • The Marauder. A terrifying, demonic version of the Slayer, bearing the appearance of a demon/human hybrid. Imagine the ferocity and power of the Slayer in the hands of a demon. That's the Marauder.
    • It took the Slayer everything he had just to snap his neck! What happens next? The Marauder just gets back up and twists his neck back into place!
    • Seconds after having his neck twisted back into place, he was ran over by an combat APC, but hours latter he was together with a group of possessed Atlas soldiers in Bullheads. Yang even says that he is stronger than the Slayer. We'd like to repeat that. There is a demon stronger than the Doom Slayer!
    • And, in the hours that it takes for Team RWBY to escape from him on the road and the initiation of the teleportation, he still caught up and they are saved by sheer luck, because they were teleported seconds from being hit. And, it's likely that now the Marauder is in Remnant (even if he wasn't sent to the same place).
  • The demons and the cultists turned every other evil faction into a minor evil, because they're an unexpected opponent and far more evil, intelligent, and cruel.
    • The Grimm are dangerous in great numbers and the older they are, the more intelligent they become, but they're nothing near the demons, because with the exception of the normal possessed all demons are more intelligent than normal Grimm, and while all huntsman in Remnant train for their entire lives to fight the Grimm, almost no one knew about the demons until some weeks in-universe.
    • In fact, demons can easily deal with Grimm. They have no souls and can be possessed easier than any human. Their bodies can be manipulated like clay; in chapter 15 an Alpha Beowolf was turned into a goat-like being that was inert until a possessed body was kicked into it. The "idol" was possessed and had to be blown apart with a super shotgun shot to be killed, even creating a maw with rows of teeth from his chest and tentacles to grab the Slayer. Later a group of 6 Beowolfs that tried to attack Deag Grav while he was weakened are all easily killed and possessed, one of them even tried to run away before being dragged back into the cave.
This one should probably either be re-written or cut-down. It feels like it's just discussing these events rather than going over why it's scary. Maybe delete the last bit and just focus on the disturbing appearance of the possessed Grimm would work.

  • That deserves special mention. The Grimm, soulless monsters that feed on fear, are absolutely terrified of the demons!
  • The demons that attacked the academies were "just testing their strengths" according to Ozpin, even with only the Imps, Possessed and some Hell-knights and other few stronger demons (like the Prowler and the Harvester in Beacon), they killed most of the students, and were only beaten because the portals were closed. With Shade Academy, they could keep up a siege for an entire week because Vacuo has no military, the result is that somehow the demons took the Relic of Destruction.
  • Marcus Black, father of Mercury, was a known assassin that abused his son everyday and stole his semblance, but was killed before the canon story started. In this story, he's alive, and is the leader of the cultists. He is dangerous, able to fight against Qrow and later fought for some time against Qrow, Ozpin, Hazel and the Slayer combined! He somehow got his hands on the Unmaker (the laser weapon from Doom 64), which can slice through buildings and turn into a laser sword that even Qrow tried to avoid, because it could cut to pieces even his own weapon. In fact, even after being defeated, he took advantage of the arrival of a Sea Feilong and turned the Grimm's body into a portal to hell, throwing the Slayer and Team RWBY into it before an entire Atlesian airship was sucked in.
Like the above one, I think should be either cut down or re-written. It feels more like it's just discussing the events that happened in the chapter rather than explain why it's scary or creepy.

  • He's so dangerous that Ironwood had to make Roman use his contacts in the criminal underworld to try and find him. At that point he is a far greater threat than even Cinder, and only Deag Grav itself is a greater threat to Remnant.
  • Deag Grav itself, the hell priest that tainted the Wraiths, turning them into living batteries for Hell, merged Argent D'Nur with Hell, and planned the trap that captured the Slayer, is the main threat to all Remnant. He has no problem with dirty tactics, including using dead bodies to hide himself before attacking (once in the cathedral and the second in the old ruins, killing Fox). He also doesn't give any chances to his enemies. In fact, he was the only one that objected to the idea of keeping the Slayer alive in the sarcophagus and despises the Dark Lord of the Fourth Age for punishing him for the Slayer's rampage and denying his ascension to a Baalgar, to the point of calling him ungrateful when the Lord called him in the D'Nurian ruin.
    • Had the rest of itís kind actually listened to Deag Grav, they would have won! Had they killed the Slayer while he was sealed away like it suggested, there would be no one to stop Hell.
  • The Marysville Cathedral. After 3 chapters without any demons, they make their presence known in the church of the two brothers. Even the Grimm in the town don't dare to enter the once holy place out of fear. In the cathedral, the bodies of half of the town lie in the seats, all having committed suicide in a ritual, including the children. And then a Lazarus Wave drops the Slayer in the underground while the townsfolk are resurrected as Possessed. In the catacombs, they found the half-breed girl they came to save, but were attacked by Deag Grav itself, with more zombies coming in the dark and confined space of the catacombs.
The end of this one just feels like a small synopsis of the events in the chapter.

In general, I think some of these edits just need to be cut back some so they feel less like synopses. What do you guys think?

Edited by ssjSega on Oct 3rd 2019 at 4:18:56 AM

Oct 3rd 2019 at 4:08:11 PM

[up]Where are the personal thoughts in bold?

Edited by MasterN on Oct 3rd 2019 at 4:08:21 AM

Oct 3rd 2019 at 6:43:42 PM

I edited my previous post so that my personal thoughts are bolded.

WarJay77 Spooky Scary from Upstate New York Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Spooky Scary
Oct 3rd 2019 at 6:44:32 PM

I would agree with your thoughts on the matter.

Female troper who likes Pokemon, ARGs, Writing, and more. / Links: Sandbox.Zero Context Example Thread - Sandbox.Roleplay Cleanup Thread
Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:30:10 PM

[up]Thanks, but I think I could use more input from the other thread users. I don't think it's a good idea to just start making edits after approval from a single troper. Can anyone else provide some input and advise on the matter?

Oct 4th 2019 at 11:48:13 AM

[up] I also agree, a lot of these are basically just describing stuff that happens (which was also a big problem on NightmareFuel.RWBY, so it seems like the RWBY fandom really doesn't understand this rule). Also, I haven't read this story, but since DOOM is a very violent game, surely the kind of person who is enough of a fan to read a crossover story about it would be desensitized enough to fictional violence and monsters to not get scared from this kind of violence. The example about the Slayer's awakening seems like it's more Gorn than horror (meaning that the violence is meant to be cool, rather than disturbing, since I'm guessing that the White Fang are meant to be villains who deserve to be killed rather than sympathized with).


Anyway, this was added to NightmareFuel.Steven Universe:

    Steven Universe: Future 
  • From the opening alone, we already get an indication that there is something seriously wrong with White Diamond. She has a pink color-scheme instead of a white one, and is holding her head with a pained expression as light comes out of her gem, eyes, mouth and her nose.
  • Also, there is a Cactus Steven. With a huge chest and several heads growing out of it.
  • There is also a gem that is likely Aquamarine due to the same gem placement and body structure. There's also something off about her, as she has patches of red all over her body.
  • Behind all of them seems to be the season's antagonist, a giant worm who shoots light at the audience while the Crystal Gems appear to momentarily scream.

This is all based on this video of the Season 6 opening, and more specifically the part 11 seconds in. This brief, out-of-context picture probably isn't enough to give anyone bad dreams on its own. The first two examples are just describing things while trying to make them sound scarier than they are, and the last two are speculation.

The part about how "the Crystal Gems appear to momentarily scream" is actually just them going "aah" as part of the song. It's definitely not meant to represent screaming.

EDIT: I got rid of the last two examples myself due to how blatantly speculative they were.

Edited by Zuxtron on Oct 4th 2019 at 2:51:28 PM

Oct 4th 2019 at 12:41:37 PM

[up]I can clean up anything that just describes things (I'd like to point out that I've worked on this page also and some of the early examples are mine, so I am at fault as well since I'm not 100% familiar with moments pages). Though I did legitimately find things disturbing. The part where the White Fang member got her jaw punched clean off and desperately tried to get away was legitimately disturbing when I first read it. I also do consider the cults to be Paranoia Fuel with how the common Remnant citizen or even huntsmen-in-training can hide in plain site to acquire sacrifices, and Ruby's nightmare and the Body Horror involved did actually freak me out. Since Nightmare Fuel isn't my area of expertise at all, could I get some advice on which ones to remove outside the ones I put my thoughts under and which ones to modify? The ones that I added could also have problems that I'm not seeing that need to be looked into.

Page Action: Nightmare Fuel Other
24th Aug '19 5:20:24 PM
What would be the best way to fix the page?
At issue:
What should be done with this page? Options are mutually exclusive.

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