Hasn't quite beaten out The Dark Knight Rises but getting there's inevitable.
James Wan is going to be getting a lot of offers after this.
Edited by ShirowShirow on Jan 14th 2019 at 10:25:33 AM
You are not alone.
Then do a Soft Reboot like Bumblebee. With some connections to the other movies, but being its own thing entirely.
Aquaman almost does feel like a Soft Reboot. It mentions the events of Justice League once, but other than that, it stands alone completely. Sure, so does Wonder Woman, but that took place in the past, while Aquaman is set in the present.
Anyone else feel like Arthur letting David's father die was treated as Informed Wrongness? I mean, not only was Jesse Kane a ruthless pirate but he'd tried to kill Arthur despite being shown mercy.
Edited by windleopard on Jan 14th 2019 at 1:17:10 AM
Eh, I mean that's what villains do. Letting somebody drown in a way like that is unheroic, period. He was incapacitated and no danger to Arthur, he could've easily turned both over to the authorities.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% ScandinavianI find it a little Informed Wrongness. It's still a bit cold on his part as mentioned but I think it'd have been better if they had removed the middleman and just had Aquaman mortally wound Black Manta's dad and leave. He shows no real problem with killing people before or after that scene, after all.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Like I said before, it's not what superman would have done. I think it's an important moment honestly; while it was a defensible act to leave them for dead Arthur learns that he has to aspire to be more than that if he wants to be a king.
You are not alone.Arthur isn't meant to be shown as wrong for leaving Manta's father to die, more that he made a standard call when a more gracious one might have spared everyone pain. As noted above me, the choice between being good and trying to be better is a theme for Arthur.
The conversation in the boat more or less spells it out. Maybe saving Manta's father would have turned him from taking the path they did. Maybe it wouldn't have, and they would still be trying to hurt people. But doing what he chose to do definitely made him a lifelong enemy, and no matter what comes of it he has to live with those consequences.
It's a reflection to his shift from "screw Atlantis, I'll just beat them all down" in the beginning to "I need to stop them, but end it with compassion" at the end, thus choosing to be King and opening the door to talk brother to brother with Orm. I'd argue it's not as well set up as Mera's shift in perspective on the surface world (in large part because Arthur gets no reason to believe his earlier perspective on them was wrong), but Manta makes it a decent contrast.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Jan 14th 2019 at 5:00:22 AM
From Arthur's perspective, he already showed mercy by trying to leave with both of them alive. Almost getting shot in back of the head with a grenade burned what forgiveness he had. Definitely an example of Good Is Not Nice, but the conversation on the boat and sparing Orm at the end is a reflection of how his perspective changed, he had every right to finish him by Atlantis law but chose a different path.
I don't recall him expressing that he thought that was mercy, even at the time. It was more of a "you two deserve what you're getting" gesture.
After stabbing the father in the chest, he berates him for not being a better example to his son and as he leaves urges them both to give up piracy. Considering how brutally he took out the others, that was being lenient. The scene on the boat was him expressing the truth that it wouldn't have cost him anything to help, but chose not to. Mera even says the same thing he told them, they chose a dangerous profession, but that doesn't make the moral decision any more clear cut.
I mean, yeah. I get that - and said as much in my first post. I'm saying that he doesn't appear to have been intending to be merciful when he left them to die in the aft of the submarine. He knows from standing there watching that the father is about to die, and is under no delusions that he might live.
He also isn't in the habit of executing people (every single person he fights elsewhere in that scene is taken down quickly in the heat of the fight), so given that and his general personality elsewhere he doesn't seem the kind of person to say "I didn't finish you off, so I'm being merciful to you."
Arthur was very clear about leaving their chances to the sea after they attacked and killed the members of the submarine crew. At the time, he was pretty pissed off by the blatant Moral Myopia they were displaying by expecting mercy after they had shown none to the submarine crew. That they were only in that situation because of their last ditch attempt to kill him didn't help either.
And while it's not brought up in the movie, it would have been pretty obvious that if Arthur had tried to save them they likely would have immediately tried to kill him again. Possibly during the rescue attempt.
That's completely in character for Black Manta btw if his comics incarnation is anything to go by.
"Y'see, deep down, in my most secret heart of hearts, I'm still a totally depraved sonuvabitch whose main goal in life is to watch you die. Slowly and painfully. Just like your kid."
Edited by M84 on Jan 15th 2019 at 3:09:13 AM
Disgusted, but not surprised

Outrageous!
have a listen and have a link to my discord server