Consensus has arrived at four criteria for Broken Base:
- A sustained conflict: short-term conflicts that are quickly forgotten don't count.
- Corollary: Conflicts about upcoming works based on previews, trailers, and speculation are short-term by definition and should be cut on sight.
- An exceptionally vicious conflict: a simple disagreement where the various factions have little problem co-existing doesn't count.
- Two or more large, vocal, and entrenched factions within the fanbase: a tiny Vocal Minority that won't shut up about their pet peeve but is vastly outnumbered by more reasonable fans doesn't count. Nor does a silent majority that likes what they like (or hates what they hate) but doesn't make a big deal about it.
- Corollary: the fanbase must itself be large enough to support two or more large and entrenched factions. This is more likely to be the case with broad fandoms (e.g. "Star Wars fans" or "anime fans") as opposed to narrow ones (fans of one particular work such as a single film or video game with no sequels, adaptations, or spinoffs).
- Little to no middle ground: Cases in which the vast majority of the fandom just plain doesn't care too much about the disagreements of a few fringe elements don't count.
- A sustained conflict: short-term conflicts that are quickly forgotten don't count.
- Corollary: Conflicts about upcoming works based on previews, trailers, and speculation are short-term by definition and should be cut on sight.
- An exceptionally vicious conflict: a simple disagreement where the various factions have little problem co-existing doesn't count.
- Two or more large, vocal, and entrenched factions within the fanbase: a tiny Vocal Minority that won't shut up about their pet peeve but is vastly outnumbered by more reasonable fans doesn't count. Nor does a silent majority that likes what they like (or hates what they hate) but doesn't make a big deal about it.
- Corollary: the fanbase must itself be large enough to support two or more large and entrenched factions. This is more likely to be the case with broad fandoms (e.g. "Star Wars fans" or "anime fans") as opposed to narrow ones (fans of one particular work such as a single film or video game with no sequels, adaptations, or spinoffs).
- Little to no middle ground: Cases in which the vast majority of the fandom just plain doesn't care too much about the disagreements of a few fringe elements don't count.
Broken Base is ostensibly about deep-seated arguments within a fanbase. Okay, fine. That's a thing that happens. The problem is that many entries are written in such a way as to side firmly with one side over the other, to the point where it's a thinly-veiled excuse for complaining. They tend to spend the majority of space laying out one side's argument for why a particular entry or element in a franchise is the Worst Thing Ever(TM), and then wrap up saying something like, "...but there are some people who like it."
Example: In YMMV.Mass Effect 2:
That's... just plain not the case. Broad consensus is that ME2 is the high point of the series. There are certainly folks who prefer ME1, some vociferously, but it's only a very vocal minority who tear into 2 the way the writer of this entry does.
(Mod edited to streamline, previous text in folder)
Edited by Mrph1 on Aug 19th 2025 at 9:31:48 AM
From YMMV.The Mandalorian:
- Broken Base: Luke's appearance in the season 2 finale. Many fans love seeing Luke as a hero at his prime, especially after his highly divisive potrayal inThe Last Jedi, and the recreation the iconic hallway scene from Rogue One. Others see it as shallow Pandering to the Base, disliked that Luke served as a Non-Protagonist Resolver and feel that his CGI model was too unconvincincing and distracting.
I have never seen anybody actually complain about this (apart from a smattering of "Young Luke was a Special Effects Failure but he was still cool" comments), which is really saying something given this is the Star Wars fandom being talked about.
I've seen complaints about season 2 Pandering to the Base by overdoing the callbacks to past Star Wars media and characters in general, but never with the Luke example is never singled out in particular. If anyone has an issue, it's either the Special Effect Failure, which is unrelated to the writing of the scene, or it's just a minor blip of a larger phenomenon and not considered the worst example of it.
Edited by AlleyOop on Jan 1st 2023 at 6:37:10 AM
I agree with the above points. Mando's season 2 finale was widely acclaimed, and you can find plenty of reaction videos of people with gleeful surprise at Luke's sudden appearance in it. Certainly not a divisive enough issue to count as Broken Base.
Edited by StardustSoldier on Jan 2nd 2023 at 12:22:49 PM
Actually, I think that the example was valid. I saw several people online, including popular Youtubers such as Films&Stuff and to a lesser extent The Cosmonaut Variety Hour complain about Luke's inclusion in The Mandalorian. They may be outnumbered by the people to who liked his inclusion but I think there are enough detractors to his cameo that to just sweep their opinion under the rug is unfair. Perhaps the example can be rewritten to less hostile towards Luke but it should be included none the less.
Edited by TBJack on Jan 2nd 2023 at 5:47:12 AM
Beware, I live!Did they suggest any alternate endings for S2? I've read some suggest that Din and Grogu should've met a Jedi whom Lucasfilm doesn't milk as hard as they do Luke, but that sounds off-putting to viewers who don't know much about Star Wars beyond the movies and The Mandalorian; especially since prior S2 episodes also generated some complaints of Continuity Lock-Out.
Edited by dsneybuf on Jan 2nd 2023 at 10:15:17 AM
What does suggesting any alternate endings for S2 have to do with this topic? Most of the complaints I have heard of Luke in Mandalorian where that he shows up with no foreshadowing and that the less than great de-aging effects on him detracts from what should have been a heart-breaking moment for Din and Grogu.
Edited by TBJack on Jan 2nd 2023 at 8:40:10 AM
Beware, I live!I can't take that side seriously unless I know that they remember all of the buildup to Luke's appearance; from the Armorer ordering Din to find another Jedi, to Ahsoka lamenting that there aren't many Jedi left (ie, they can't find anyone new), to Grogu calling for a Jedi from Tython. If they felt disappointed with the payoff to all of that, what did they expect instead?
Edited by dsneybuf on Jan 2nd 2023 at 11:28:36 AM
I'm not discounting people who don't like Luke being in Mandalorian, it's just almost always never a complaint in isolation. Thus it's better to make a general example for those who dislike the Mythology Gags including the appearance of Luke, than a single entry dedicated to Luke entry.
That suggests it's not a great example then. Broken Base is not for Vocal Minority, it's for when factions of comparably equal scale have highly polarized opinions to the point that the element/character is a common source of flamewars and debates.
Edited by AlleyOop on Jan 2nd 2023 at 12:54:18 PM
It's not about what we think. If all three of us equally disliked how Luke was used it still doesn't matter.
it's about following the spirit of how Audience Reactions are properly recorded. Despite the name the YMMV tab is for cataloguing broader patterns in the fandom, not about posting your personal opinion regardless of how valid it might be. That's for the Review tab.
Edited by AlleyOop on Jan 2nd 2023 at 12:58:00 PM
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This is irrelevant to the validity of the example, though.
Like, whether or not Luke was "used well" or the people complaining had an alternative plan in mind doesn't really matter - the trope is just for documenting a reaction, which may or may not hold up to scrutiny.
The problem is more just, again, that this doesn't seem to be anywhere near enough of a mainstream view to qualify for Broken Base.
Edited by nrjxll on Jan 2nd 2023 at 11:57:49 AM
YMMV.Trigun Stampede already has a few Broken Base entries even though the anime premiered more than a week ago. Any consensus to remove them?
She/Her | Currently cleaning: N/A
I think you can do so because of Broken Base's waiting period.
I'm confused as to how my recent entries can be construed as "kneejerk." SBMM has been a hotly debated issue even before its implementation, and the entries on Citan Titans and Ward of Dawn in Iron Banner were correct and are still up. To avoid such mistakes in the future, what constitutes as "kneejerk?"
I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but any Broken Base entries about changes that were implemented less than 6 months ago would be considered "knee-jerk." The Creating a Work Page for an Upcoming Work page says that any tropes that require a certain amount of time to pass should not be applied to unreleased content, and it's generally accepted that the timer starts ticking once that content is officially available in-game. (This is only referring to the Destiny 2 SBMM edit, I'm unfamiliar with the other two.)
Edited by indigoJay on Jan 27th 2023 at 1:45:58 PM
There is no war in Ba Sing Se.So this is my first time being here, but I wanna talk about these entries from Chikn Nuggit:
- Broken Base:
- Some time after Bezel’s introduction, since it was confirmed that Bezel would play a part in some kind of “storyline”, it was clear that Kyra wanted to take Chikn Nuggit in a new direction. Discussion sparked about that, or more specifically: should Chikn “become something greater than shorts”? in other words: should the series get rid of the shorts format, in favor of having longer episodes? One one hand, the series could expand. The series could have lore, episodes could have actual plot and story, and characters could be actually fleshed out and developed, with personality and motivations. None of that is really possible with just sub-30 second shorts. Another major point is that it’ll keep the series alive. This was around the time that the Chikn Nuggit was experiencing the most negative feedback it has ever seen. With people getting tired of the jokes and gags, finding the characters interesting, but flat, and just being bored of the format in general. People have thought that the series could rectify that by expanding the series out of shorts. Some have even argued that they want longer episodes, but with more of a casual slice of life style, rather than any epic adventurous story. On the other side, some fans believe that the episodes being bite-sized skits is the series’ main appeal, and what the series should always be. And that introducing serious stories and lore will ruin that. Some are even afraid that Chikn Nuggit would become “super serious” and it’ll lose its humorous appeal.
- Every time the series tried its hand at having some big serious lore or story, it’s been criticized, especially by those who were originally fans but left after some time. Is it an interesting way to take the series in a new direction and explore the characters more? Or is it part of a series that originally started off simple, but is now trying to make a half-baked attempt at trying to be deep and interesting for no reason other than to get people talking?
So putting aside that the first entry is really big, Ive been following these shorts for a while and I've never seen anyone really complain about the tone (which I should note is still very lighthearted atm) and story bits. If nothing else I think the entires could be rewritten to be less bloated.

Also the entry for Armored Core 4 and Armored Core: For Answer sort of repeats itself with the last sentence.
Beware, I live!