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Deadlock Clock: Jan 21st 2017 at 11:59:00 PM
Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#1: Feb 4th 2016 at 1:52:37 PM

The formatting for this page is a mess, and I'm not sure it went through YKTTW. May need a little spruce-up.

What's precedent ever done for us?
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#2: Mar 5th 2016 at 4:52:24 AM

That's because this page was created during a shoddy split years ago.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
#3: May 18th 2016 at 5:39:33 AM

What, specifically, is the problem here?

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#4: May 18th 2016 at 5:48:11 AM

Weird formatting, rambling description, only one example, little connection with the rest of the wiki. Basically, it's a mess in all regards.

What's precedent ever done for us?
Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
#5: May 18th 2016 at 5:56:17 AM

That seems to be the case with almost all of the tropes listed on Logical Fallacies. I wouldn't be opposed to a full-scale cleanup, but singling out this one strikes me as odd.

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#6: May 18th 2016 at 8:01:05 AM

I just stumbled across it on a trope search and thought 'holy crap that's bad'. I wasn't aware it was part of a broader pattern.

What's precedent ever done for us?
Berrenta MOD Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#7: Dec 17th 2016 at 7:41:47 AM

Clock is set.

Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#8: Dec 17th 2016 at 9:01:59 AM

As Septimus noted, this page is the end result of a ham-handed and unilateral decision by one troper to split the old Logical Fallacies page, C&Ping each section of the original page into a "trope" page, but not doing any rewriting to actually make them into tropes, nor trying to find valid examples.

I'm not sure how to fix it.

edited 17th Dec '16 9:03:17 AM by Madrugada

Iaculus Pronounced YAK-you-luss from England Since: May, 2010
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
#9: Dec 17th 2016 at 9:19:48 AM

Cut it and put it through YKTTW to see if there's something worth salvaging?

What's precedent ever done for us?
Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#10: Dec 17th 2016 at 9:35:43 AM

I think I'd prefer to see most of them re-consolidated and moved to a UsefulNotes/LogicalFallacies page. There are a few that are regularly enough used that they're tropes, but in a number of those cases, we have a trope page (sometimes under a different name) for it.

For instance the actual Logical Fallacy known as "Non Sequitur" is not the trope named the same thing; it's essentially the trope Insane Troll Logic; "Appeal To Technology" has a substantial, almost complete, overlap with Too Incompetent to Operate a Blanket; the fallacy "Appeal To Nature" is the trope All-Natural Snake Oil. Circular Reasoning is the logical fallacy. Catch-22 Dilemma is the plot trope that springs from it.

edited 17th Dec '16 9:41:51 AM by Madrugada

Xtifr World's Toughest Milkman Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
World's Toughest Milkman
#11: Dec 17th 2016 at 12:36:37 PM

Reorganizing the logical fallacies might be good for a short-term project. Otherwise, I agree that there's no particular reason to single this page out from all the others with similar problems when they're all part of a set.

I love Madrugada's ideas of how to tackle the whole thing, but again, seems better suited for the project forum.

Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#13: Dec 17th 2016 at 1:10:17 PM

Yes. If you look at the last cached version before the split, you can see that he simply took each section and made a new "trope" page out of it.

I have no objection to moving this to projects and trying to beat the whole mess back into some sort of coherent order.

Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#15: Dec 17th 2016 at 5:08:33 PM

That works for me.

SeptimusHeap MOD from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#16: Jan 18th 2017 at 12:19:55 AM

Clock is set.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#17: Jan 22nd 2017 at 8:41:30 AM

Clock expired with no further progress; closing.

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