The Chronicles of Narnia: The Silver Chair

Nope, it happens in the book too, though Jadis herself never appears.

edited 19th Feb '16 7:07:46 PM by theLibrarian

In the movie, the ritual starts and nearly succeeds before Edmund stops it. In the book, the ritual is stopped before it can begin.

Fun fact about the "magic words" in the movie ritual.

In Lewis mind, they certainly weren't the same person, but I feel it would wrap up things more nicely to make them the same person, and also distract from Lewis' unfortunate, implicitly misogynistic tendency to make villains attractive women in positions of authority.

Also, Tilda Swinton. ;)

They'd have to make it so that the ritual partly succeeded and she returned in a weakened state, or whatever.

edited 23rd Feb '16 8:35:12 AM by Gowan

It's kinda repetitive having the White Witch always be behind EVERYTHING. I say keep them separate. There's nothing in the book that indicates they're the same person.

She could be portrayed as someone the White Witch is manipulating. It'd allow both to maintain existence and character while connecting the threats.

A reincarnation, perhaps. Not a resurrection, mind you.

"She could be portrayed as someone the White Witch is manipulating. It'd allow both to maintain existence and character while connecting the threats."

So, instead of a beautiful woman who is evil and has agency, we'd have a beautiful woman who is somewhat evil? (you can't make her not evil without lots of changes) and doesn't even have agency?

That'd be even worse.

It's repetitive no matter what, but making the White Witch and the Green Lady identical would at least give a plausible explanation for the resemblance. (One that isn't "Beautiful women who don't submit to men are eeeevuhl")

A reincarnation would work ... actually, that would be pretty nice, there's some tradition in having reincarnated individuals change colour.

edited 4th Mar '16 6:02:09 AM by Gowan

Come to think of it, Lewis's villains do tend to be either strong women or not-Arabs, don't they? That's a bit uncomfortable. As is the fact that Caspian's wife/Ramandu's daughter didn't even have a name until the movie...

edited 7th Mar '16 4:38:20 PM by HamburgerTime

Here's the full list.

Lion, Witch and the Wardrobe: The White Witch.

Prince Caspian: Miraz and the Telemarines.

Dawn Treader: No overarching villain.

Silver Chair: Lady of the Green Kirtle.

Horse and His Boy: Prince Ramandu (of the Calormenes.)

Magician's Nephew: Uncle Andrew (at first), then Jadis aka the White Witch.

The Last Battle: Shift the ape and the Calormenes.

I'm just kind of surprised they haven't tried to connect Jadis with Tash, as it looks like she's being the recurring evil of the series. If they ever do get around to making Silver Chair, my hopes are that the big battle at the end (you know there'll be one) will have Salamanders come flaming out of nowhere. Those things were awesome in the books. I hope they show some of the 'living' gems that the Earth-guys mention too. Maybe in the Lady's palace?

edited 8th Mar '16 11:16:06 AM by TrixiePixie

The whole ethnic evil people thing in the books was why I was totally OK with how the Talmarines were depicted in the Prince Caspian film. It was less evil brown people and more of a comparison with real-world conquerors. It felt like most of the focus was on them being Conquistador expies (the armour they wore and the Spanish accents kinda made that obvious) than any kind of racial thing.

Weren't the Telmarines white in the book?

I don't recall their race being specified.

I remember them being coded Arab/Middle Eastern (of the curly toe shoe variety), though I could be confusing them with the Calormenes.

Whether their race was specified or not, I still remember getting distinct "other" vibes.

edited 16th Mar '16 9:05:42 AM by Sisi

I guess? Though they were Spanish in the movie (which is technically white but eh). To be honest the Telmarines were my favorite bad guys because they were the most realistic and were the greatest threat. Plus the movie made them look cool.

Oh they looked AWESOME in the movie. It's just that some people cried racism because they were dark-skinned and coded ethnic to a degree.

As I said, I disagree because the coding wasn't really about race to me, it was more about the Conquistador thing.

I thought they were supposed to be descended European pirates who stumbled to Narnia via a cave portal? Or, I suppose, mixed-race descendants of those pirates and their native islander concubines. Anyway, Caspian's Telmarine, and he looks pretty white on the cover of the edition I had.

I think you're right about the pirate thing. Either way, I do really like the look of the Talmerines in the movie.

Indeed. Since I'm an aspiring writer whenever I make up a culture that's pretty militarized, I normally go via the movie Telmarines as to their looks.

Yeah, it's the Calormenes who are the pseudo-Arabs who worship Satan.

edited 16th Mar '16 9:54:56 AM by HamburgerTime

And for some reason think 200 people is enough to conquer a country.

I'm not going to defend the Calormene concept as a whole, but I will point out that both The Horse and his Boy and The Last Battle had good Calormenes amidst the evil ones. One of them was even a Tash worshiper and he still got let into heaven by Aslan.

Also, The Magician's Nephew shows that the first humans to settle in the world of Narnia—thus, the ancestors of all that world's native humans—were a working-class English couple. So unless we assume the existence of another, off-screen portal between worlds, the Calormenes are technically English.

edited 17th Mar '16 6:29:25 AM by MetaFour

I think one of the books establishes that the Calormenes are a separate group from the Narnians and Archenlanders.

The Calormenes and Telmarines both were descended from other groups of humans.