Miraculous Ladybug

We do have that: Creator's Pest. However, Chloe was removed from the trope because Astruc has never outright confirmed he hates her.

Edited by badtothebaritone on May 27th 2023 at 5:26:32 AM

I mean I think Chloe being based off a former bully he dealt with or a girl who when he was in high school who rejected him.

That and if not for him giving Adrian and even Marinette favorable treatment, I'd figure it's him being one of those "Damn kids on my lawn" types of adults. The types who see their peers and elders as the superior folks.

I'm reminded of Pansy Parkinson from HP who the author said was based on girls who bullied her back in school.

But Pansy never really was relevant enough to get the same hate Chloe does.

She mainly reminds me of how Butch Hartman writes rich characters.

let me guess, vapid, unsympathetic, and somehow the target of the main charaterers crushes despite all that? While still having some potential if they were written differently?

I mean having a character going down the path of redemption only to forsake it doesn't have to be a bad thing.

Just that: A. Well as said before, iffy to suggest that a kid/teen is irredeemable over any adult with moral problems. And if not for Astruc's conduct on social media it would be easy to see it as unintended implications. Even better writers do have such in their work.

B. You could argue that yeah the amount of time that could be used for other characters or moments is wasted on something that doesn't pay off.

Yeah I think there would 100% be less of a problem if they portrayed some of their adult villains with the same level of sympathy like in the case of Gabriel(Aka none) that having a teen who really is that bad can work.

Edited by OmegaRadiance on May 27th 2023 at 6:35:34 AM

I will say this, Chloe is actually written better than most of Hartman's rich characters. She has a reason for why she's nasty besides being rich, and Adrian is aware of how bad she is and mostly views her as a friend with a nasty side.

Well Gabriel and Chloe had similar beats of almost finding redemption but screwing it up because of their own flaws.

Edited by RedHunter543 on May 27th 2023 at 9:38:00 PM

Yeah, we're not quite at Butch-tier writing yet.

With Chloe though she’s manipulated by Gabriel and Marinette was being a Hypocrite in how she refused to let her help.

So her flaws got worse as she was being gaslight by an adult and Marinette just straight up lying to her as Ladybug.

Edit: As for Bitch Hartman, I think singling out his rich characters is unfair. As Oddparents shows he can make everyone extremely unlikeable as the show goes on!

Edited by OmegaRadiance on May 27th 2023 at 6:44:21 AM

Yeah, I don't think Marinette handled Chloe in the best possible way she could, and I think there's something human about that could be compelling character stuff.

EDIT: Ouch. Just ouch.

And as someone who enjoys Danny Phantom and FOP, yeah, I agree 100%.

Edited by RedHunter543 on May 27th 2023 at 9:47:22 PM

We should be grateful Danny Phantom ended on a somewhat high note.

So Chloe isn't thrown to her mother anymore, but I assume her father is still forced to resign, she's still forced to leave Paris, and the heroes are even bigger hypocrites for allowing (and helping) an Akuma to get revenge on her but not Bob Roth?

Well, we'll have to wait for revolution to see how 1:1 the leaks are and how much changed.

I'm still mostly invested in the Felix, Kagami, and Adrien subplot. I want to know if they'll stick with having Adrien as a senti-being.

Since it's gone I might as well post what was supposed to happen.

https://imgur.com/a/7YPNbgK

Also an apology scene from Alya about Lila was cut in Confrontation. Damn you Monkey's Paw!

EDIT: is it possible to make the Collusion entry in Triva mention something about it most likely being cut because it made Andre look incredibly Unintentionally Unsympathetic? Or is that against the rules?

Edited by anoni on May 27th 2023 at 11:26:56 AM

"... and I like her the best" - holy sh*t, that's straight up evil thing to say about your step-daughter you know for a couple of months over your biological daughter you've known for her entire life and they wanted to use this scene to redeem the man, the writers really got no shame anymore.

Edited by True20 on May 28th 2023 at 3:28:57 AM

At least one of them might have had some common sense, since its not in the episode. anymore. Safe to say its not Astruc

Edited by anoni on May 28th 2023 at 3:47:23 AM

@badtothebaritone From the scene's context, it's really obvious that they're not forcing Adre to resign. They convince the villain to use her words and they walk into the office with weapons, clearly aimed at the villain to keep her in check. Admittedly that still feels a bit like intimidation and the only reason why it goes smoothly is because Andre jumps at the opportunity to resign but definitely no one forced him to leave Paris. Also, this is nowhere near comparable to the villain straight-up threatening to ruin Bob's life if he doesn't comply.

Reflekta again in Confrontation.

Pretty sure she's the most often used villain at this point.

I fucking haaaaaaaate her, she is ugly and her power is pretty much useless in general.

who are the best villians for you?

I didn't say anything about Andre leaving Paris. I was talking about Chloe leaving because that's what I heard from the leaks.

Edited by badtothebaritone on May 28th 2023 at 2:40:30 PM

How is she ugly?

Now that's a tricky one, since there's a lot I like.

I guess Timebreaker.

EDIT: OH, there's Star Train.

Edited by RedHunter543 on May 28th 2023 at 4:47:32 PM

And people used to complain about Lila's plan to get Marinette expelled in Ladybug ep being full of plotholes, but at least the writers put some thought into that one. This season, Lila and Chloe are getting Marinette expelled whenever they feel like lmao.

Anyway, I think the best way to finish my two cents on the matter is this. If we had another bratty teen villain like Chloe who was being set up for change, then I think Chloe remaining as she is could work.

But the unchanging ones being in the same age range as the intended viewing audience while adults with decades to have changed sooner are allowed late growth, yikes!😱

Edited by Antiyonder on May 28th 2023 at 7:06:13 AM