Because the trope itself isn't. It's been used across all media, as seen in the non-gaming examples section. Yet the current description makes it seem as if it's exclusive to boss battles in video games.
That's what created the confusion in the YKTTW discussion that I mentioned. Which is why I'm suggesting a revision for the sake of clarity.
That's what ~shimaspawn is agreeing with.... No need to phrase it like you disagree.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.Well there are a lot of video game specific mechanics to this though that are probably best left to a trope of its own and the fights have a hell of a lot more than what a tv show would do. looking at it from strictly a gameplay perspective, these are usually extremely different from a normal boss especially in an RPG and they have their own cliches.
Stuff that comes to mind are
- Unwinnable Boss Fight,
- Boss Battle Music changes to match the character's theme of a whole new theme
- The character you are fighting suddenly has stats 100x what they had when controlling them, possibly with lots of new abilities.
- the character you are controlling does not obey input orders,
- gameplay switch up,
- 1v1 Duel Fight,
- Survival Fight just don't die till the story takes over,
- Massive scripting in the fight,
- branching paths,
- The fight ends when someone reaches a set percentage of HP instead of taking it to zero.
- win or lose the story continues with maybe an optional item being lost,
- hidden objectives in the battle for a secret ending, IE Digital Devil Saga and Suikoden 2.
- No victory pose after winning.
Renaming the trope to some like Friendly Boss Fight and/or Ex Friend Boss Fight to cover the mechanics of these types of Boss Fight and launch that more general fighting a friend story YKTTW would be the best IMO.
edited 26th Jun '15 9:03:23 AM by Memers
![]()
My mistake. I misread what you wrote.
I guess that works too, since in other media, a fight between friends can have just as many narrative purposes:
- The may be on opposing sides due to differing ideologies. In which case, one of them is likely to be either a Well-Intentioned Extremist, or simply misguided.
- It could be a result of mind control, or demonic possession; making it the "I Know You're in There Somewhere" variant. But, depending on the work, it may not always be possible to save them.
- A crueler version may have it being their inevitable fate to fight each other - possibly to the death.
- The other friend may have been deceived into believing they've been betrayed, or that they were going to be betrayed (ex. Anakin to Obi-Wan, in the Revenge of the Sith).
- As with video game versions, the fight may be set to the accompaniment of Sad Battle Music for drama and to convey the reluctance of either side.
I still think both can be covered by a single trope. But if we go with the split, I'd suggest moving the non-gaming examples to the "Reluctant Fight" YKTTW.
edited 26th Jun '15 10:24:51 AM by MiinU
The various gameplay mechanics (such as a Player-Controlled character becoming a Nonplayer-Controlled character) should be separate tropes. In many tabletop games, doing the wrong action may surrender your sheet to the GM that might or might not become a new villain.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.I completely agree that there should be a general trope, just the boss fight version is something is a type of boss fight that uses various styles to portray it. It is a subtrope of the general trope and on the Boss Battle index.
None of those I listed are limited to a Friend Boss Fight and yeah they should each have a trope of their own, Just this type of personal Boss fight likes to use those other tropes.
edited 27th Jun '15 4:42:42 AM by Memers
Well yeah it's 'common elements' for the vs a friend boss fight.
Also I would view the general trope as something strictly serious while the video game boss fight trope as every type of tone from friendly sparring match to an arena battle to a full fight to the death, they all like to use those same common elements.
![]()
![]()
So are you suggesting we use FYF for general (non-gaming) examples and create a separate trope for boss battles between friends?
If so, I can go along with that. But there'd be a crapload of examples to port over to the new page, in order to clear this one up.
The general trope covers those too, though. For example: Goku and Krillin once fought each other during the 'World Martial Arts' tournament - which was a friendly arena match, until Krillin started losing.
edited 27th Jun '15 1:34:41 PM by MiinU
I've long wondered what the difference is between Fighting Your Friend and Dueling Player Characters, aside from the latter being named as an exclusively video game-related trope.
Okay, so aside from a brief misunderstanding, I believe we're all in agreement to turn this into a non-media-specific supertrope to all situations where friends fight.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.

I'm bringing this up due to confusion caused by a recently created YKTTW called "Reluctant Fight".
The current description for FYF is entirely game specific, despite encompassing non-video game examples. So I'm thinking of revising the description in order to clarify that it covers both. But I'd prefer a consensus before making the revision.