Follow TV Tropes
I've been told through private messages that the new management is working on tightening what a trope is, and whatever the new guidelines will be, it looks like Garnishing the Story isn't going to make the cut.
And thinking about it... I agree. If this is about creators throwing stuff in works because they think the audience might find it neat, that's at most trivia. And this applies to many of the sub tropes listed.
So before a bunch of tropes get slashed, let's figure out if, and how, we can fix any of them, by making sure they fit In-Universe parameters. Some may eventually get their own Trope Repair Shop threads (even if just for renames), but this thread is for ideas to salvage as many of them as possible.
So let's see what can be done.
Rename Garnishing the Story and redefine it to In-Universe instances where characters think an element helps something just by its inclusion. Either characters directly state they think it does, or the context makes it clear the character is doing it just because. Such examples include (and the first two are from the trope page):
If the above suggestion works, then Watch It Stoned could stay as a Sub-Trope, since it already is about characters stating in-universe that getting stoned makes something better.
Some of these tropes already fit under some of the Rule of Index tropes, so we just leave them on those indexes (although we would have to trim the examples that don't fit under those).
Some of these are usually signs of wealth, so although the inclusions are technically gratuitous, these do show characterization (particularly of the Conspicuous Conspumtion kind). Therefore I propose these tropes be reworked so that they are In-Universe about showing off wealth and other characters desiring the items because of that, and then all examples be rewritten to reflect the new definitions (and trimming examples that don't fit anymore).
On the above note, Just for the Heli of It could be reworked to be about someone having a personal helicopter since, like a private plane, it's a way to show off money.
Couldn't many of those "showing off X" tropes be combined into a single concept: Showing Off The Money, or Conspicuous Consumption? After all, the trope isn't the thing being shown off, it's the act of showing off. That's 90% of the problem with them in the first place, much like with the Personal Appearance Tropes and Weapon of Choice. People confuse "thing in work" with "meaning of thing in work".
edited 28th Mar '15 1:02:28 PM by Fighteer
"I've been told through private messages that the new management is working on tightening what a trope is..."
There has been moderator discussion about how to handle the fact that all these tropes tend to attract boring examples that are nothing more than "Object appears in the story".
I think some can, although I would add that some forms of showing off wealth have separate functions (mink coat keeps you warm, private planes take you somewhere), just that they do those functions more luxuriously than a less expensive thing. Others perhaps can just be merged. I have a ykttw covering some of these as well.
edited 28th Mar '15 1:22:03 PM by DragonQuestZ
"Stuff does thing more luxuriously than baseline in order to show off wealth" is a trope. "Stuff appears" is not a trope. That's the key distinction here.
And part of the problem is that we have a dozen tropes that are functionally identical with only the object changed, so as the object is the only unique thing in the trope, people mistake it for the whole trope.
I agree. That was why I suggested that some be re-written — in description, examples, and wicks — to reflect that.
Yeah, quite a few I don't think can be salvaged, saved for the In-Universe mentions of preference (and those would be examples, not tropes).
Oh, forgot to mention that Everything's Better with Plushies is more a trope of The Merch than garnishing. So that wouldn't need to much of a fix (perhaps a rename).
edited 28th Mar '15 1:40:14 PM by DragonQuestZ
For the "instant awesome just add X" tropes:
The fix could be that, assuming we go with my general suggestion for Garnishing the Story, we look through the examples and wicks of these tropes for any In-Universe gratuitous use, and if there are enough of those, they can stay a sub trope as Watch It Stoned would be. Otherwise just cut the tropes and merge the few proper examples with Garnishing the Story.
Also, assuming Recycled In Space and Like That Show, But with Mecha are still valid tropes, then perhaps we can see if any of the tropes listed above have enough such examples to make Sister Tropes (Like That Show But With Zombiesnote Marvel Zombies wouldn't count, as it's an original story but Pride & Prejudice & Zombies might, Like That Show But With Ninja, etc.).
As for some of the luxury tropes listed...
I think we can merge Gem-Encrusted and Everything's Sparkly with Jewelry. Unless it's a diamond ring cutting things (which we don't seem to have as a trope yet) or the jewels include a Power Crystal, jewelry in this context are already baubles. So is there really that much of a difference between a lady putting emeralds on her earrings or on the hem of her Pimped-Out Dress?
For Gold Makes Everything Shiny... that's also largely just a bauble. Perhaps one of you can make a case for it being separate, or we could just merge it with the jewelry tropes as well, or something else.
Now I would argue that Pretty in Mink is its own trope because fur still is typically used for warmth. So like a Big Fancy House, it's a luxury but a functional one (in real life and media). Plus it's also typically thought of as a winter luxury (so has a bit of symbolism there)*. Not that it's only worn in cold weather, but characters sometimes makes comments when it's worn at other times (like in All About Eve or Troop Beverly Hills). When it is for winter, it's one of the luxuries the rich might show first. That's why you would typically see a Russian noble wearing a fur coat before wearing jewelrynote although in real life the jewels were just as common as other European nobility. And of course because of the way real fur is made, there are implications that you don't typically get with jewels (save for blood diamonds... another trope we don't seem to have).
[ *On that note, perhaps that "Fashionably Floral" ykttw I made could work on the grounds that flowers and clothes are typically a spring accessory, so they would signify that even if worn at other times. That should help weed out bad examples and add proper context to the good ones. ]
I would say hat Fluffy Fashion Feathers is also distinct; I just can't state why very well. Then again, the description seems to state multiple uses, from being used similar to fur (although this seems to be typically for spring and summer uses while fur is for fall and winter), to being an accessory on fanservice clothing. Perhaps there could be a split, or one definition could be removed.
Honestly even without the misuse, Goggles Do Nothing isn't really a trope on its own. There could be a broader trope for accessories worn but never used though. That would also nicely merge with Too Many Belts and Zipperiffic.
Not sure about most of the animal tropes listed. Again even if the inclusion is out of nowhere, that would be done for meta reasons. We would need in-universe reasons for why someone thinks a certain animal is better than not having it.
EDIT: Man, it would be nice if the forums had a preview button.
edited 31st Mar '15 11:49:36 AM by DragonQuestZ
Okay, sorry for the triple post (thought it hyas been a few days, and of course other things have been keeping the mods busy), but I figure I should back up my suggestions by checking all of these tropes to see which can be viable as their own tropes. My humble recommendationsnote and I honestly mean "humble", since I know most of these likely will go to crowners or their own threads are in bold below each trope.
Bob Thinks X Makes Everything Betternote yeah, that's not a good title; told you I didn't have any suggestions for a better name
When a characters thinks an element improves things just by the inclusion of that element.
It could be someone thinks a kind of music can be played in any situation. Or someone thinks a certain seasoning goes with any food. Or it could be a writer always wanting to add a panda in the stories. The point is that a character thinks that having X is so much better than leaving X out. Some characters might even rejects things without X.
Sometimes characters will state directly that they feel the element improves things. Other times the context can make it clear, such as characters repeatedly trying to include the element somewhere.
While often this can be a funny quirk, this can sometimes be about an obsession (which can still be Played for Laughs though). Why Don't You Marry It? comments might come up from other characters.
How often this is brought up will also vary. In some cases this can just be a one time joke (or Compressed Vice if it's an obsession). Other times this can be one of a character's primary traits.
A Super-Trope to:
Compare Fanboy, Author Appeal (where the creators like to put in elements), Fanservice (hoping the audience finds X makes the work better).
See also the Rule of Index tropes (elements are accepted because they add comedy, romance, awesome, etc. to the story)
In Universe Examples Only
Live Action TV
So do these look like good fixes? Do we have more ways to fix these?
edited 5th Apr '15 4:46:31 AM by DragonQuestZ
Garnishing the Story seems like a case for IUEO to me; it's a valid concept but "regular" examples are bad. Not a case for a rename, though.
The rest is a wee bit long for me.
What does IEUO stand for?
And for what Garnishing is right now, yes it is a valid concept. It's just an out of universe one.
As for the rest being long, that's why I put some of the lines in bold, to get to the point with each trope.
edited 5th Apr '15 3:48:29 AM by DragonQuestZ
IUEO is In-Universe Examples Only.
Oh, got the letters mixed up. Well that's what the writeup I put in the end of post #10 supposed to be.
As for the case for a rename, the in-universe examples aren't limited to garnishing a story they are telling.
EDIT: The wicks are a better case for a rename. They seem to be used as "I thought it was neat this was put in the show".
edited 5th Apr '15 5:04:10 AM by DragonQuestZ
Amendment to post #10. I just played Undead Knights, and it's basically Dynasty Warriors with zombies (and Pikmin) elements. Plus Resident Evil is Alone in the Dark with zombies. So with Pride and Prejudice and Zombies we might have enough to split off "Like That Show But With Zombies".
edited 6th Apr '15 10:23:34 PM by DragonQuestZ
I would support splitting Everything's Squishier with Cephalopods, similar to what we did with Everything's Worse with Wolves into Noble Wolf and Savage Wolves. It would not only get rid of the snowclone, there's already a YKTTW for "Tentacled Terror" that could cover evil octopoids if fully developed. Funny Octopus seems like it could be a seperate trope.
edited 29th Mar '16 6:13:38 AM by Morgenthaler
A previous Repair Shop thread on Everything's Squishier with Cephalopods stalled one and a half years ago. As mentioned in that thread, Giant Squid, Cthulhumanoid and Kraken and Leviathan would probably cover many of the examples; a few other YKTTWs would also be relevant.
Those YKTTWs have been Up For Grabs for some time now, so I'll assume sponsorship. I'll start a sandbox to sort ouf some of the examples as well.
Alien Octopus seems like a valid subtrope of Starfish Aliens. I'll rework Tentacled Terror as the "evil squid" trope. Does someone else want to sponsor the Funny Octopus trope?
Additionally, I think we should add a crowner to this thread before we split anything from Everything's Squishier with Cephalopods.
edited 13th May '16 6:15:32 AM by Morgenthaler
Made a crowner for Everything's Squishier with Cephalopods to build some consensus.
edited 18th May '16 2:00:50 AM by Morgenthaler
You know, a quick way to fix these would be to just cut anything that has more than 50% ZCE and misuse in it's wicks. That way we wouldn't be trying to salvage things that are too far decayed. If there is really a need for them they can be taken to YKTTW once their misuse is no longer a bad habit.
Bump for votes.
Calling for the split.
I'll start a sandbox to sort examples for Everything's Squishier with Cephalopods.
I've also submitted Everythings Better With Motorcycles to TRS with a motion to cut, as I really don't think there's anything worth salvaging there.
Community Showcase More
How well does it match the trope?