BoJack Horseman

Huh. Should've seen the writing on the wall with the episode where Bojack tells people to not choke women. It seems so obvious in hindsight.

This season is really intent on showing Mr. Peanutbutter and Bojack at their lowest. On one hand, what Bojack did is a lot worse — nearly killing someone vs. cheating on someone. On the other hand, Bojack is willing to own up to it and takes steps to address his problem (finally). Mr. Peanutbutter goes right back to form, since you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

"Teach and old dog new tricks"

Boooo!

Sometimes feels like the characters are on seesaws

When someone is up someone else is down

Although this season feels like more are down than up.

Best line of the season: "Hello drug merchant, is it lit under here?"

Someone on Reddit pointed out a massive Stealth Pun involving PC's upbringing. She and her mother weren't just maids - they were housecats.

Edited by ironballs16 on Sep 16th 2018 at 2:15:08 AM

PC at least seems to be doing better. But then, after what she went through in the previous season, she really needed this.

Diane on the other hand...she's constantly being put through the wringer. Particularly since two of the most important people in her life have proven to be kind of shit. Seriously, something is very wrong with your life if someone like Bojack Horseman is your best friend.

Edited by M84 on Sep 16th 2018 at 10:07:36 PM

Princess Carolyn attempting to sweep the strangling under the rug really made me uncomfortable. She didn't even know he was having a drug induced breakdown at that point and she was willing to just enable Bojack. I also think that having a baby in her life is gonna make her life a lost more difficult rather than fulfilling. In the short term at least. We'll maybe, she could actually afford a nanny so I'm not sure how burdened she will actually be. It is weird to me that she didn't think to adopt an older child, especially as she was the one who organised the funding of the Herb Orphanage.

But yeah, where the cast go from here will be interesting. I really feel like the first half of the season is actually probably Bojack at his most healthy; he's limiting his drinking (ish) he's got a steady routine with the job, and Gina seemed to be genuinely good for him boy did that not last. Rehab might actually get him into a better place where he can get a steady job and social circle and stay healthy, but he's proved himself dangerous now and I'm not sure if Bojack deserves the support of any of the rest of the cast. If he never touches recreational drugs again then sure, but it's hard to judge if he's sober.

Edited by Whowho on Sep 16th 2018 at 4:57:50 PM

It's pretty clear that Bojack does not deserve the support and friendship of the rest of the cast. He's overall kind of a shit person. And if he really wants to improve himself, he needs to acknowledge that he was fucking blessed that these people haven't entirely kicked him to the literal curb for all of the shitty things he's done.

As a personal note, they missed the mark with the southern accent in Eden. While the area does have a drawl, that was an accent from further south.

I think part of the difference with this season, though, is that BoJack was clearly not in his right mind in the penultimate episode, which will make it easier for people (myself included, I'll admit) to rationalize it. I'm pretty sure that "Head in the Clouds" was about as close to shattering the fourth wall as this will get, with Diane hating how Philbert was seen as sympathetic because he had so much baggage, which ran completely counter to her intentions.

And with how this season ended, I could see Season 6 (if it's renewed and the showrunners still have interest in doing it) taking one of two paths.

1) Focus on BoJack's experience in the rehab clinic, along with the pitfalls, talking to a therapist while admitting they're a therapist, and possibly how some rehab clinics over-inflate their success rate. Or...

2) Do what Season 4 teased doing and completely omit BoJack for the entire season, focusing instead on what the other characters are doing, with perhaps an episode or two focusing on the characters that BoJack's done the most harm to (e.g. Wanda, Penny, and Gina). It would fit in with what Gina said to him in the season finale - that she doesn't want her life defined by what he'd done to her, but by what she's accomplished.

I'd be in favor of the second, at least partially to help rebuild audience expectations for BoJack himself given the events of this season, and help avert Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy.

Edited by ironballs16 on Sep 17th 2018 at 12:36:31 PM

How long do people normally spend in rehab? Every series takes place about a year after the last began. I wouldn't be surprised if series 6 starts with things resuming the status quo.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if season 6 ends with Bojack getting arrested. Whether it be for his past misdeeds catching up to him, or him doing something new to screw up his life. I know the show's trying to say how sometimes awful people can avoid seeing the consequences of their actions, but it'd be interesting Bojack's reputation hit absolute rock-bottom. They could maybe even do something where Bojack actually wants to see himself get some form of comeuppance, only for a legal loophole to see him get off scot-free.

Honestly, Bojack should've gone to rehab long ago. It would've saved him so much trouble down the line, and probably avoid some of the awful things he has done to others. Of course, the big question is whether Bojack will accept the help and advice of professionals or just make the same mistakes all over again.

I mean, he went there and knows he needs help. It's a first step.

He still fucked up spectacularly this season though.

Edited by Cortez on Sep 17th 2018 at 7:57:35 AM

Bojack is pretty good at keeping himself on the right side of the law. The only thing you could easily hit him with is drunk driving or possession, and if he can get himself sober that wont be an issue.

I don't know, I think it would be more interesting to see what Bojack is like when he's functional. Because the end of the day; he's probably still going to be an asshole when he's sober and has a routine. Even when he's eventually healthy, he may still a difficult presence in his friends life.

Moreover, I'd be curious what would happen if Bojack finds himself in a place where he's healthier than his friends and he has to support them. Is he capable of that? Or is he ego going to mean he's just going to be rubbing his own recovery into their faces.

@chasemaddigan: Yeah, I'm surprised that, despite Bojack continually ruining relationships with loved ones and making his life worse, his fame and reputation has somehow survived through all of this shit so far. You'd think sooner or later, information regarding what happened between him, Penny, Gina, or others would leak out and turn him into a truly infamous social pariah. Who knows, maybe the writers have already planned that for Season 6 or 7.

Edited by AHI-3000 on Sep 17th 2018 at 5:32:10 AM

His big comeback was a book about what a damaged poisonous fuckup he is

And the not Mel Gibson this season shows how much Hollywoo is willing to forgive

Dunno how I feel about the second option, though it is an interesting option. I can't really see the show having an entire season without Bojack. But I definitely like the idea of having an episode or two focusing on the lives of the people Bojack has harmed the most. Plus it'd be a great way to see characters like Penny or Gina again without having to subject them to even being near Bojack again.

I am almost positive what happened with Penny will spill next season. I mean, aside from the fact that it was brought up many times this season, Philbert did have an episode on national television with a plot very reminiscent of what happened with Bojack and Penny. So while what happened with Gina might stay under wraps, I'm inclined to think what happened with Penny won't be able to.

Edited by DeathsApprentice on Sep 17th 2018 at 8:52:49 AM

×3

We did see Vance get away with everything he did too.

Edited by Cortez on Sep 17th 2018 at 8:54:22 AM

Penny and Gina are both terrible victims of Bojack's disregard for conduct, but both cases would take a lot of effort to dig up and have people believe. I don't think there's any justice to be had in both those situations, as bringing it to the public eye would actually make the lives of the two women worse. The only thing to be done is for Bojack to respect them, stay out of their lives, and get himself sober and stable.

Bojack should really get a job where his work routine is regular. The night shoots of this season obviously weren't good for him, and neither was the press tour from season 3. Guy should just host a game or panel show and enjoy having something consistent in his life he has to get up and dressed for at regular reasonable times.

He could also probably do with a room mate. In a fix-it fic I started Bojack gets involved with the Jerb Kazzaz Orphanage he funded.

He probably wouldn't do a game show — that's a bit too close to reality TV, and he hated that one episode of a reality TV show he did.

At the moment, but much like in real life, there might come a point where they might want to come forward.

With both, there are mitigating factors. Penny has the rationale of as BoJack put it to Diane, nothing actually happened (though it was a very near-miss), and she came on to him in a State where she met the age of consent, so even the analogue of the recent Asia Argento news wouldn't apply, as the minor didn't meet AoC in the State they were in. With Gina, she pressured him to lie about the circumstances of what he'd done to her, while he wanted to come clean about it then and there.

Adding to this post to avoid doubling up, but I had a crazy thought regarding the penultimate episode this season. Throughout it, we're seeing things from BoJack's perspective as reality and Philbert blend together... except for the final scene where he actually strangles Gina. This leaves it ambiguous as to which he's doing: is he strangling Gina for taking his pills and leaving him, or is Philbert strangling Sassy because she'd discovered the truth? I thought of a third option, though: what if he was seeing himself? It fits in with Todd's statement in Season 3 of "You are everything that's wrong with you!", it fits in with BoJack's general self-loathing, and his specific comments in "Head in the Clouds" that he's suffered the most at his own hands. It would also explain why he was so eerily calm the next day - because he'd strangled himself, thus "killing" the person he hated most. And layered on this is that is exactly what happened with Philbert - he'd "killed" Fritz for strangling his wife, while completely blacking out that he'd been the one to do it. Yes, I know the entire theory is Epileptic Trees levels of theorycrafting, but it would make sense in a bizarre way.

Edited by ironballs16 on Sep 17th 2018 at 11:19:36 AM

Finished the season.

I have to admit this is not exactly what I was hoping would happen (which was for Bojack to be an upwards spiral overall, which didn't turn out to be the case), but this was still a great season of TV overall. Princess Carolyn and Diane both had great storylines and provided some of the best episodes, and episode 6 with Bojack's monologue was also brilliant.

Yeah, altogether this is probably the worst thing that Bojack's done so far. I thought the stuff with Penny was the worst so far even if he didn't actually do anything, but this is something that actually happened and was pretty damn horrible so, yeah.

Regarding season 6 and beyond: part of the reason why I wanted Bojack's upswing from season 4 to continue is because I think it would not be that interesting, as well as narratively unsatisfying, for Bojack to not eventually improve. If it was supposed to end as a tragedy, I really feel like the show could have ended multiple seasons ago. I expected Bojack to relapse and get worse, but I didn't expect that he would do something this awful and that it would be more like season 4 where he fucked up but it was more out of negligence than his other deep-rooted character flaws. This kind of puts us in dangerous territory going forward IMO. We'll have to see where the show goes (honestly, I felt season 4 would have been a great ending to the show as it stood).

The thing is they aren't really sticking around him for his benefit. Princess Carolyn might actually be his friend and genuinely care about him, but it's pretty clear that keeping him afloat is also borne of her own self-interest and wanting to benefit from his career, and that in order to do that she's more than willing to look the other way with a lot of shitty stuff he does. In fact PC does this a lot - remember that she was the one who suggested that one asshole to be Bojack's co-star. In a lot of ways she's very amoral.

It already stood to happen multiple times. The Manatee Fair reporter was presumably going to divulge what Bojack said, but Ana stopped her. And Diane knows, but she doesn't want to write take-downs for celebrities anymore, and doesn't want to give Bojack what he wants anyway.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Sep 18th 2018 at 3:35:27 PM

I agree with Draghinazzo. I think the show has brought "Bojack fucks up and/or gets comeuppance for his previous fuckups" as far as it could bring it. I loved this season, but I think another season of things following the usual pattern would bring me dangerously close to the Eight Deadly Words.

That said, BH writers are in my personal "writers I trust most" top five, so I'll wait and see how things develop without worrying too much.