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Welcome to the Trope Pantheons thread! Please read the rules:

    Rules 
Rules. The following are not suggestions or tips, but things that have to be followed:
  • When writing a profile, take note of the following:
    • The very first thing any contributor should do before working on an idea or a profile is to propose and nominate the idea on the Trope Pantheons discussion thread. In the forums, you must discuss with other users on adding ideas and seek their approval with sound reasoning, a paragraph of reasoning to justify taking a trope should be sufficient. This is done to see if your proposal is the best representative and so, in case your profile is turned down, you do not waste time writing something that others might not find suitable. You can also get some assistance in the forum thread by either asking for help and those interested asking if they can help. Attempting to work on ideas without a nomination and at least one net thumbs-up will not be accepted regardless of how much you have written already. Submissions that are added without discussion are likely to be deleted and those who violate those rules by adding Pantheon content without discussion will get reported to the mods.
    • If you feel the need to remove a character for some reason (poor quality, outdated titles, etcetera) and replace him/her with another or outright rework, please see what the other tropers think about this in the discussion thread before doing anything hasty. For reworks in particular, nominate the idea as you would with new characters or profiles. Use good reasoning to see if your idea can easily replace the character present without drawing out your statement or giving too ambiguous claims most do not understand.
      • In the same vein, if you adopt a profile from another troper, it is recommended that you make an announcement that you have done so on the discussion thread. More often than not, a trope that was reserved for something was given away to someone else. Check the Related tab on the top of a page to see if a trope or character has been reserved by a user, either in the Pantheon or the Sandbox sections.
    • If, for whatever reason, you are writing about a God who just happens to be a person in real life, just try to be very careful about what you decide to say. Do not try to make the editing seem too meta (self-referential) and use the creativity to create hypothetical scenarios towards fictional characters. Some real-life individuals, including content creators (fictional content created by them is still fair-game, but do not bring up the creators themselves in such cases), may be considered disqualified for profiles due to controversies that would make them concern the Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment. To determine where a current creator would be disqualified:
      • Wait for at least a month after the latest significant update for a creator's controversy before any decision can be made. If a confirmation from the questioned creator (or associates) themselves occurs, then wait for a week.
      • Immediate disqualification for either a guilty sentence in a significant court case against the creator, or evidence of consistently repeated, deliberate, and/or intentionally provocative hate speech and advocacy of dehumanizing perspectives, with lesser examples warranting caution instead.
      • For creators with a clear persona of their character disclosed before any scandal, the persona can have a profile with no mentioning of their real-life information. Ambiguous existence of a persona would have to be discussed further hand for anything more decisive.
    • For obvious reasons, gods cannot be followers, high priests, or heralds. The 'gods' have ascended meaning there is no need for said character to be a follower of another if they have ascended.
    • No hype profiles, please. 'Hype Profiles' are profiles that have been made out of ongoing events and have not been around for a long time. This creates 'hype' due to popularity and certain elements either through certain scenes, memes, dramatic acting or considered overly awesome. They are not bad tropes but building a portfolio solely for that is a bad idea, as they do not say a thing about representing the trope best (unless it's those trope concepts that they are trying to embody for a long time)
      • You can see one if the profile is only showing off how awesome they are or suddenly pushing how 'significant' they are thanks to the just very recent events rather than respecting the longstanding good representations of the trope. And usually having... minimum portfolio or flavor texts and being a bit too generalized or self-contained to events from within their home series instead of interacting with other Pantheon members.
  • When posting in the forum, take note of the following:
    • When you suggest a God, please explain why they fit the trope. Not everyone is going to understand just "X should be the God of Y because they exemplify the trope" off the bat, especially if they're unfamiliar with the work.
    • You must use the Trope Pantheons discussion thread in the forums if you wish to add a new deity, story, something else of importance to the Trope Pantheon canon, or reworking an existing deity (be it simply improving their existing profile or changing their title).
      • For new and reworked deities, 3 [tup] means the profile will have a one-week waiting period.
      • For new and reworked deities, 4 [tup] is a 3 day waiting period.
      • 5 [tup] is an automatic ascension for new and reworked deities.
      • Speaking of reworks, for anyone that wants to improve such profiles, they have to review the current trope the character(s) has and see if it still holds up or if there is a better rep for their trope.
    • For adding new Treasures to The Great Treasury or new Dominions to the Dominions Expansion, the following rules apply:
      • For new Treasures or Dominions, 3 [tup] is a 3 day waiting period.
      • 4 [tup] is an automatic addition to the Great Treasury or Dominions.
    • Do not repost a profile in the forums more than twice a day if noticeable changes have not been made in between. If a profile is posted a third time in a row without noticeable alterations, it will be downvoted. This is so spamming of no-effort profiles is less frequent and to prevent tropers from getting aggravated seeing the same profile over and over. The minimum acceptable change has to be one flavor text.
    • The Pantheon is not a mouthpiece for you to voice your opinions on certain characters. You may like certain characters more than others, but do not make the mistake of making profiles for characters you like to look like Character Shilling.
    • Every troper new to the Pantheon is barred from approving or downvoting profiles until they have ascended at least two profiles, this means avoiding the usage of "[tup]" or "[tdown]".
    • Do not include fan reception in any profiles. It has nothing to do with the character themselves and will create unnecessary conflict.
    • Write a detailed explanation on why the character is the best candidate for the deity of that trope. If people disagree with you, do not force it on the people.
    • Keep in mind that if you still want to try to find a trope for a particular character, you are only given three chances to find a particular trope for them. If a suggestion goes past three possible tropes, then it will come off as shoehorning a character into the Pantheon just for the sake of that character to be there.
      • On a related note, even if a character does have a free trope being suggested, there is still a limit of three attempts for suggesting that character for that trope. If no one responds to that certain proposal after being posted three times, then it will get to the point where the idea will be seen as being shoehorned into the Pantheon. In addition, the idea needs to be considered acceptable and approved because they are good, not for the sake of pitying others. After all, no one is responding to their idea.
    • You can also adopt a profile or idea to work on from another contributor by messaging a request to them (preferably through private messages). Even if you get their permission, you still have to announce your adoption to the forum. Note that if the idea wasn't nominated in the first place you still have to properly nominate it.
  • When posting Pantheon related stuff to the wiki, take note of the following:
    • Do not put a link to these Pantheon pages into the main wiki page. The moment you want to note in a trope example that the character is a God of this trope, do not do it. If you see leftovers of this practice, correct the situation by deleting the offending text. This goes for any non-Pantheon page. The only exception to this rule is if a page in the Pantheon could be confused for a page in Main, like Good Colors, Evil Colors and Pantheon.Good And Evil Colors.
    • Do not bring things that would incite fights; hot topics and 'urgent' news are not pertinent to the Pantheon's mission. For example, the political scene and some really bad politicians. We are not here to fight each other, so don't suggest things that go in that direction, this is a fictional Pantheon after all.
    • To add a Pantheon page for a certain work, 4 or more characters coming from the same series/franchise should be ascended before adding the page. For Creator specific pages, 4 deities coming from the same creator and 2 individual work pages coming from the same creator is the minimum to warrant a page.
    • Do not create a trope page for a story until the story is fully completed.
    Instructions and Tips 
Here are some tips one should keep in mind when editing:
  • When writing a profile for a character, here are a few things to note:
    • Please refer to Text Formatting Rules when writing a profile, since understanding how to make and edit site pages in general is a necessity for working on profiles or other Pantheon content. Additionally, if you are not experienced with English, refer to this forum page, as proper English spelling and grammar is expected.
    • All deities should be sorted by their divine ranking. Put Overdeities on the top of the page and Quasideities on the bottom. Also, be sure to add them in alphabetical order by their first/given name (can be reversed if it is Eastern ordered). For a group, if there is no official name for them all list down all their names by order of relevance or (if too long to list) title them as Insert Name Here Main Characters or some other identifiable title along the same lines.
    • The maximum number of tropes that a god can have is two, but do not try to abuse that fact. If you need to use a second trope to specify a certain thing about their position, that can be excused either because said character represents their trope choice very well alongside the first trope. It is still generally encouraged to only have one trope.
    • A trope can only belong to one profile at a time. The only time two profiles can share a trope is if there are explicit variations listed in the trope page proper (e.g. Muscle Angst is held by both Biscuit Krueger and Chihiro Fujisaki as the former represents "Too Much Muscle" and the latter represents "Not Enough Muscle")
    • If the character you are about to add to a House already exists in another, make sure to mention that this person has spots in another House as well. Up to 2 places can be made for a deity at most.
    • For a character's theme song, try to avoid calling it "Theme of God X" or "Theme of (Show where God X originates from)". If possible, try to find out if the song has an actual name through research. Most importantly, it has to be part of their series' official soundtracks from the media. Do not list songs that are made by fans or outside sources. If they were not specifically used as music for that specific character, then they do not count. Furthermore, it has to be a general theme specifically made for that characters' appearances, not some generic music that plays for many other instances not related to the character in question.
    • For images, when adding an image for your chosen character, it is highly recommended to use a stylized image that embodies the character or renders that also highlight a character's behavior (such as cool poses). Most images should be from the main adaptations of the character unless the images from the other media are of a higher quality than the adaptation. Unless it is needed, do not use fanart for images. If you are, please attribute it to the original artist. Due to the website's dark mode, removing white backgrounds from an image is paramount. This website is suggested to do the background removal. If an image you have takes up too many bytes, it is suggestible to use this site to reduce the byte size. If the byte is still too big, run the compressed image through other sites (or even the same one) to compress even further. Use wikis to look for better images, as even wikis for the series might not contain good official images.
    • Creativity is your friend. While it is not recommended to get too ditzy at your ideas, it is best that when writing a profile for a certain character, do you think of capable scenarios between X and Y. Tip: do not use shallow examples (X wields a sword and Y wields one too) and try to think of relationships that make sense (i.e those characters that are shout-outs for another).
  • Pantheon Content:
    • Some series or genres will eventually have greater representation in the Pantheon than others. This is unavoidable, but a little diversity helps to make you not look like a shill. Try to ensure that if you add a deity from a popular series, make sure that it is because they are a good representative for the trope in question, and not just because they are connected to another deity in their respective canon.
      • As far as deities from actual mythologies, there is generally an expectation to build the profiles off interactions from fictional portrays rather than basing it entirely from the actual myth. Therefore, a mythological deity should be more of a Composite Character whose main identity is from the actual myth.
    • Occasionally there will be Gods that carry a title without a trope. This is not forbidden, but it is well-advised not to abuse them. The only house where trope-less profiles are wholly allowed is the House of Food. Mainly due to most food items lacking tropes, and adding tropes about said foodstuffs is slightly unnecessary. However, the character being ascended for their choice of food, or food-related thing must be a decently good representative of said item. (i.e their Trademark Favorite Food, or something that they are closely associated with In-Universe, or both).
    • For Dominions and Treasures profiles, always consider what made those places/objects popular in the first place. Were they plot-important, identifiable imagery or have a unique aspect of it? Do not just bring regular objects under the basis of following a certain canon.
    • Do not write in self-promotion or blatant advertising. Minor references to something are fine but writing that clearly intends to advertise something will not be given toleration.
  • For Profile Standards:
    • Flavor text is used to describe certain things about a character, place, or object. To avoid short ones, it is recommended to write flavor text with 4-7 sentences that can fill around 2 lines each. Be warned that adding too many sentences does not equal good flavor text as it is not an essay of sorts (unless words are substantial and do add to the overall line).
    • Character Profiles of a certain person should have the following:
      • A portfolio that contains at least 7 (at the minimum) tropes describing their character.
      • Flavor text count for a deity profile should have by minimum, 10 (depending on if the character in question has enough relationships/characterization) to 15 with a maximum of 20-25 for an individual profile.
      • On the other hand, group profiles (profiles of a group that has 4 or more members) have their maximum flavor text count to 15 minimum, giving individual lines for the other members of the group (unless the members are not as characterized) up to 30 at max.
    • Dominion profiles of a certain place should have the following:
      • A portfolio that contains at least 5 (at the minimum) tropes describing the context of the place.
      • Flavor text count should range at least 10 to 15.
    • Treasure profiles (inanimate objects without a trope) should have the following:
      • A portfolio that contains at least 6 (at the minimum) tropes that describes the object itself.
      • Flavor text count should be at least 7 flavor text up to 12 to constitute a treasure profile.
    Divine Ranking System 
  • Overdeity: Omnipotent-level Reality Warper deities capable of manipulating the entire universe (or at least the world) at will. Within their own universe they are believed to be omnipotent, or at least impossible-to-completely-destroy embodiments or concepts.
  • Greater Gods: High-level Reality Warper deities that are extremely powerful (capable of destroying or changing anywhere from a large city to a planet at will) and very strong non-reality warpers capable of doing the same thing.
  • Intermediate Gods: Deities at this level are capable of strong but specialized powers such as hydrokinesis, pyrokinesis, etc. without major drawbacks and low-level Reality Warper beings capable of affecting their immediate area at will.
  • Lesser Gods: Capable of highly specific or little power on their own, or suffer from Power at a Price. However, they may be able to ruthlessly exploit their power or combine it with just being badass enough to make up for it.
  • Demigods: Badass Normal citizens of the pantheon, making up for their lower status with strength, strategy, and/or planning.
  • Quasideities: Any otherwise normal human, human equivalent, or below without any special powers or training will fall here.
    Templates 
Template for adding a new deity: God X, God/Goddess/Deity of (Insert Trope Here) (Alternate names/Nicknames, Fan Nickname)
  • An image, if possible. Please use official art or a screenshot for a picture.
  • Rank: This can range from Quasideity, Demigod, Lesser God, Intermediate God, Greater God, to Overdeity, based on the representation of power mentioned above.
  • Symbol: An image or icon used to represent the deity.
  • Theme Song: Official song (in other words, no fan music, regardless of quality) that usually is used in affiliation with the character. If the deity is a musician this will most likely be their Signature Song. If possible, give a link for reference, preferably on either a website like Soundcloud or YouTube.
  • Alignment: Good, evil, neutral, etc. Forget about The Great Character Alignment Debate here; the Pantheon is one of the few places where you can assign Dungeons & Dragons alignments to characters that don't have an alignment system. After all, the Pantheon is based on D&D and is made for fun.
  • For Pokémon deities only:
    • Gender: Defines the gender of the Pokémon; if genderless, it instead defines what gender they identify as.
    • Ability: Provides the Pokémon's ability. If they can Mega Evolve, the new ability is listed as well.
    • Moves: Defines the four moves used by a Pokémon. A Z-Move may also be listed.
  • Portfolio: Tropes associated with the character.
  • Domains: Things that the character has influence over.
  • Herald: Non-ascended loyal character that is from the same series as the ascended character.
  • High Priest: Non-ascended like heralds, but not from the same series, and can serve as a worthy replacement in case the deity would be unavailable, incapacitated, dead, or otherwise incapable of carrying out their duties. They can be served as part-time workers in case the originals are busy with some jobs. Co-Godhood is accepted depending on the approval of the originals, usually if the co-deity is from the same series.
  • Followers: Non-ascended characters that are not part of the Pantheon, but would probably worship this character by the fact that they share the ascended character's trope.
  • Relationships between ascended characters go here with your chosen character, it goes something like this:
    • Allies: Members of the Pantheon that are allies, those that share the same values as them and would theoretically be friends with them.

    • Rivals: Members of the Pantheon that are rivals, people who may look at your character with suspicion or a challenge.
    • Enemies: Members of the Pantheon that are foes, those who would see your chosen character as a threat, either from their perspective or yours.
    • Additional Character Relationships: Members of the Pantheon that do not fit in various relationships (examples include Enemy Mine, Vitriolic Best Buds, Teeth-Clenched Teamwork, Headbutting Heroes, Friendly Enemy, Friendly Rival, Just Friends, etc.), allies, rivals, or enemies.
    • Partner: Defines a partnership with an ascended deity and Mon-type. (if any)
    • Feared by/Fears: A deity whom the members of the Pantheon notably fear or are feared by.
    • Respected by/Respects: A deity whom the members of the Pantheon respect or are respected by.
    • Opposed by/Opposes: Not necessarily the same as "Enemies", but this is used for any deity whom the members of the Pantheon directly oppose or are opposed by (basically the opposite of "Respects", "On Good Terms With", and/or "Commonality Connection") in terms of certain viewpoints, regardless of alignment.
    • Pitied by/Pities: A deity whom the members of the Pantheon feel pity for or are found pitiable by.
    • Conflicting Opinion: Sometimes, the Deities argue over specific themes and philosophies.
      • OPTIONAL NOTE FOR CHARACTER RELATIONSHIPS: Should the list for Character relationships (IE. Allies, Enemies, etc.) become too big, categorize a certain number of characters to a specific group putting them on a sublist (One example: Luigi is from the same world as his brother Mario, hence Luigi should be fall under the Super Mario Bros sublist.)
  • Add the Intro. The intro is made up of two trivia, the Ascension Text (or just the Ascension) and The Bio. Both are necessary, but which order you use for them may vary depending on the profile in question. It may be better for one profile to have The Bio first and the Ascension second or vice-versa, although for the most part, the order is irrelevant:
    • The Ascension Text: This is the story of how the character got into the Pantheon and/or was ascended. There are many ways for this to happen. They may be tricked into it or have simply wandered into the Pantheon, they may have had an already ascended character bring them in, they may already be in the Pantheon (via being another deity's Herald or sharing a trope) and got "promoted", or some combination of the above. Anything is possible in the Pantheon, so use your imagination, but try to incorporate their trope into the story, if possible.
    • The Bio: A brief synopsis of the character's backstory. No need for the character's entire life/production history, but just give enough that those who don't know the character can get an idea of how the character works.
  • Now add some random trivia/facts about events/alignments/moments/fights/friendships/relations etc.
  • And some more trivia/facts.
  • And a couple more.
    • Note: Standard amount of flavor text for Deities/Characters is 10-15 (15-20 for group profiles) at minimum to 20-25 (30 for group profiles) at maximum.
Template for Dominions profiles: Place X, Place of (Insert Trope Here) (Alternate names/Nicknames, Fan Nickname)
  • An image, if possible. Please use official art or a screenshot for a picture.
  • Theme Song (Optional): Not important as compared to Deity and Dominion profiles but a notable mention if there is an accompanying song in use with the object.
  • Alignment: Refers to the dominion's role in their story, be it those used by villains or used by the Player Character.
  • Portfolio: Tropes associated with the dominion.
  • Domains: Things that the place has links to.
  • Relationships (Optional): Unless the location has a connection with a specific deity, relationships are optional and may not be required. However, if there are deities linked to the same series as to where the dominion is linked to, note them using the relationships, this includes deities that theoretically have interest with said dominion, good or evil otherwise.
  • Add the Intro. Here the introduction of the Dominion is added with some tidbits regarding the origins of its' creation and usage in the story. You can also add what made it popular/iconic/important here.
  • Now add some random trivia/facts about events/alignments/moments/fights/friendships/relations etc.
  • And some more trivia/facts.
  • And a couple more.
    • Note: Standard amount of flavor text for Dominions is 10 at minimum to 15 at maximum.
Template for Treasure profiles: The name of the item in here (Alternate names/Nicknames, Fan Nickname)
  • An image, if possible. Please use official art or a screenshot for a picture.
  • Appearance: A shortened description of the item's looks with some notable features also mentioned.
  • Class: Refer to the Treasure Classification System in the Great Treasury.
  • Alignment: Refers to the objects' role in their story, be it those used by villains or used by the Player Character.
  • Theme Song (Optional): Not important as compared to Deity and Dominion profiles but a notable mention if there is an accompanying song in use with the object.
  • Museum Check: A note that says whether the item is viewable by the public.
  • Portfolio: Tropes associated with the item.
  • Domains: Things that the item has links to.
  • Relationships (Optional): Unless the item has a connection with a specific deity, relationships are optional and may not be required. However, if there are deities linked to the same series as to where the item is linked to (especially the original owner of the item), note them using the relationships, this includes deities that theoretically have interest with said object, good or evil otherwise.
  • Add the Intro. Here the introduction of the Treasure is added with some tidbits regarding the origins of its' creation and usage in the story. You can also add what made it popular/iconic/important here.
  • Now add some random trivia/facts about events/alignments/moments/fights/friendships/relations etc.
  • And some more trivia/facts.
  • And a couple more.
    • Note: Standard amount of flavor text for Treasures is 7 at minimum to 12 at maximum.

Edited by Tabs on Jun 24th 2024 at 7:51:43 AM

SailorVenus372 Since: Nov, 2019 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#169251: Sep 9th 2020 at 6:37:02 PM

Grandfather has ascended.

Edited by SailorVenus372 on Sep 9th 2020 at 6:40:16 AM

Get Snuck-Up On.”
227someguy I hate spoilers Since: Apr, 2017
I hate spoilers
#169252: Sep 9th 2020 at 6:52:36 PM

Bold text is done with 3 apostrophes before and after the bolded text.

Everyone look at my sandbox
Excessive-Menace Time to SLEEP from the Velvet Cage (Fifth Year at Tropey's) Relationship Status: Dancing with myself
Time to SLEEP
#169253: Sep 9th 2020 at 6:52:46 PM

[up][up][up] I believe Text Formatting Rules has it somewhere on that page. I recommend you take your time understanding how this site works and not posting so much on this forum as certain users here get kinda cranky at times. Go ask at Ask the Tropers for questions like that.

Edited by Excessive-Menace on Sep 9th 2020 at 6:52:55 AM

SING TO ME, LEND ME THE SONG OF BLASPHEMY
AngelOfLight69 Since: Feb, 2019 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#169254: Sep 9th 2020 at 7:16:19 PM

[up] Ok, thank you again and have a good day smile

I don't know what to write here...
mariovsonic999 Since: Feb, 2012
#169255: Sep 9th 2020 at 7:19:25 PM

@Agro Maybe some connections with the equines of the Pantheon. I guess the ponies would do first.

SuperWIKI1 BourbonDiscordia from The Little Red Dot Since: Feb, 2019 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
BourbonDiscordia
#169256: Sep 9th 2020 at 7:34:21 PM

[tup] for Nimitz.

Retired effective March 1, 2022
227someguy I hate spoilers Since: Apr, 2017
I hate spoilers
#169257: Sep 9th 2020 at 7:40:11 PM

I added some more to Mirelia.

Mirelia Q Melromarc, Goddess of Graceful Purple Ladies (Mirellia Q Melromarc, MILF Queen, Queen of Melromarc)

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/mirellia_light_novel.png

Everyone look at my sandbox
RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#169258: Sep 9th 2020 at 8:05:45 PM

Is Joe good to go?

Joseph Simmons, God/s of Temporal Suicide (Joe)

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/looper.jpg
The two in a diner. Left: Old Joe, Right: Young Joe
  • Votes: 1(Sailor Venus 372)
  • Houses: Suicide and Sacrifice (House of Life and Death), Paradoxes And Time Loops (House of Time and Space)
  • Demigod
  • Symbol: A playing card with the young and old version backwards
  • Alignment: True Neutral (Young Joe), Neutral Evil (Old Joe)
  • Portfolio: Killed Their Future Selves In Different Ways, Hating Themselves, Stable Time Loop and Temporal Paradox
  • Domains: Time Travel, Hitmen, Self-Conflict (both), Development, Sacrifice (Young Joe), Loss, Revenge (Old Joe)
  • Varying relationship with: Simon Petrikov/the Ice King, The Doctor and the Master, both Shirou Emiya, Philip J Fry and Lars Fillmore
  • Allies:
  • Enemies: Each other, Eobard Thawne, Boris the Animal, Diavolo, Light Yagami
  • In the year 2044, assassins called Loopers get a high paying job, having targets sent back from 30 years in the future as it's extremely difficult to get rid of a body then without being discovered. As a way of covering up loose ends, 30 years later the said Looper is sent back to be iced by their past self, and they have bags over their head so you never know if it's you. But one Looper, Joseph Simmons, managed to get around that and sneak off. The younger Joe went up after him, and the two soon realized they have more to complain about than they thought.
  • Applies to both
    • The young Joe was a mostly self-centered hitman, addicted to eye drops. The old Joe hates him for being immature, however over time the younger Joe became a better person and protective of Cid, even killing himself so Old Joe wouldn't harm him. And Old Joe's desperate need to stop the Rainmaker made him into an extremist willing to kill children to undo the Rainmaker and prevent his wife's death. Old Joe closed his loop back when he was young, and Young Joe ultimately made a Heroic Suicide to close his.
    • Don't want to discuss the mechanics of time travel or they'd be there for hours. Both versions of Joseph Simmons can understand where Bob and George get their hatred of time travel from. Easiest way to understand it is when Young Joe does something different, Old Joe's memory shifts. And thanks to the Trope Pantheon's Death Is Cheap status, Old Joe is freed from the Ret-Gone status that his younger self's suicide caused. This has only further incensed one version against the other.
    • He is not the only time traveler in the pantheon to kill himself. Missy stabbed her Harold Saxon incarnation, before he used his laser screwdriver on his future self and claiming it would permanently kill them, all over the argument of siding with the Doctor. Saxon was wrong. While Missy is the future version, having become a better person in the end she relates to Young Joe improving himself over time. The Doctor, ever the one to fight with themselves and having faced a dark possible future relate to their dilemma. While ultimately opposing Old Joe and siding with Young Joe's issues, the Doctor sympathizes with how Old Joe was screwed by a Stable Time Loop.
    • Depending on his mood, Simon Petrikov's opinion on the two varies. When sane, Simon respects Young Joe's decision to choose the right path even over his own life, however he does feel bad for Old Joe as he knows what love did to him. However he doesn't think it justifies what Old Joe did. When insane, the Ice King is somewhat more supportive of Old Joe in his pursuit to bring his own "princess" back, but still Even Evil Has Standards and thinks killing kids is a bit too much. Old Joe agrees, but has an "ends justifies the means" view on what he did.
    • They've come to hate each other, which is something Boris the Animal relates to. And they both hate Boris. First off, because he's a psychopath. Second, the only reason the two Borises hate each other is how they ended up being captured. As far as Joseph Simmons is concerned, Boris is so Ax-Crazy he wants any excuse to try to rage at and/or murder anyone and everyone, even if it's literally just him from a different point in time. Third, their reasons for hating each other are a lot more valid; Young Joe has a more straighforward case of Future Me Scares Me, Old Joe is disgusted with the driftless and immature existence he used to have.
    • Sometimes they talk about their experiences with trying to commit literal murder-suicide(murdercide?) with Shirou Emiya and EMIYA. EMIYA shares a similar contempt Old Joe has for his more immature younger self, however they disagree on what is right and wrong on "how to Set Right What Once Went Wrong". Given his already present issues before his future self got in the picture, Young Joe and the young Emiya have a fraught relationship but they both value the idea of a better future.
    • Fry and Lars Fillmore are on much better terms with each other compared to the two Emiya or Joe, and their feud was more about jealousy, unrequited love and being a pig about pizza. Both can understand what it must be for Old Joe to lose their wife, and they admit they would abuse time travel to undo it. But they wouldn't trade an innocent life for their love, even if they become a bad person in the future. On Young Joe, Lars was impressed to see how he managed to mature and did a brave thing.
  • Applies to Young Joe
  • Applies to Old Joe
    • Because of what the Rainmaker did and his reign of terror in the future, he tends to go after dictators. His answer to the "would you kill baby Hitler?" is a definitive yes. He agrees with SCP-2578-D on taking out dictators with extreme prejudice, and will help it in Tyrannicide. Mainly, he wants to somehow install the SCP into the future as another way to prevent his wife's death. Old Joe is also a close ally to Nox, due to their ultimately benevolent intentions in trying to save their loved ones through time travel that ultimately ended in failure (though in a different way for Old Joe).
    • One might think, with his actions being akin to Precrime Arrest (well, execution) Old Joe would approve of Kira. He doesn't, as considering the sheer scope of what he does and the fact it's through supernatural means he reminds Old Joe of the Rainmaker. Mainly he critiques Light for targeting innocents if they get in the way, to which Light called him a hypocrite because he Would Hurt a Child. Old Joe countered this, saying he deeply regrets it and is only doing so to avert a future tyrant. He is not motivated by a god complex like Light is, but Light thinks otherwise.
    • Hiiro Kagami knows what it's like to lose one's love, but thinks what Old Joe did is going too far. Barry Allen agreed. Of course, Old Joe reminded him of the mess he caused with Flashpoint due to trying to stop the death of a loved one. Allen admits that was a mistake and while he understands Old Joe's tragedy, as does Hiiro, he doesn't approve of what he did. Old Joe does agree with Barry that Eobard Thawne is a depraved scumbag due to the absolute selfishness of his actions, and so does Young Joe, so at least that's something.
    • After some talk with EMIYA, Old Joe decided he would search for a way to kill Young Joe without doing himself in, as he's not a Death Seeker yet. Turns out, there is a way to ignore paradoxes. He's planning to hunt down Fry, his duplicate Lars, and Bender for the time codenote  so he can do whatever he wants to Young Joe without risking his own existence. Then whenever he fails to take down the younger Rainmaker, go back in time again to undo any "mistakes" until he gets what he wants. Probably create some more Old Joes to ensure the job is done. While he means well, Nibbler is doing whatever he can to prevent him from doing this as he dreads a second tear in space-time will finally bring the cosmos crashing down.

nightelf37 The Scrappy and Butt-Monkey of the Pantheon Thread from Hadithi (it's Swahili for 'story') Since: Jul, 2010 Relationship Status: They grew on me like a tumor...
The Scrappy and Butt-Monkey of the Pantheon Thread
#169259: Sep 9th 2020 at 8:30:34 PM

Since I'm working on the Etrian Odyssey guilds for Cartography Sidequest, I wish to nominate the Yggdrasil Labyrinths for the trope Mega Dungeon. Well, just the ones from the first, second, third, and fifth games, since the trope doesn't apply to the fourth or Nexus games.


I'm requesting for more feedback on the Pantheonic Soldiers Of Fortune, the Omniverse Museum, and the Treasury rework.

I got one [tup] for the Soldiers of Fortune, and I got one [tup] on the museum so far, but the latter two should go hand-in-hand since the museum coming up means removing much of the Treasury's contents. Or should I assume [tup]s for the Museum also means [tup]s for the Treasury rework?

Edited by nightelf37 on Sep 11th 2020 at 12:40:15 AM

TV Tropes Pantheon Group Members Database
Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#169260: Sep 9th 2020 at 9:45:50 PM

We will need to look into Bad Dreams (under the Dreams pantheon).

At one point, it was renamed to Past Experience Nightmare to combat misuse and to clarify that it's for nightmares caused by past traumas. The deity we have for Bad Dreams, Darkrai? Fits the common misuse definition.

How are we reclassifying Darkrai, or should it be removed?

Siegfried1337 Calabash. from The Eastern Luminant Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: Will you go out with me to the End?
Calabash.
#169261: Sep 10th 2020 at 12:35:29 AM

I just found out Souls-like RPG exist. What does this mean for the Chosen Undead, Bearer of the Curse, and the Ashen One?

Eh, good enough.
Muundeis Acheron is SUS from ANYWHEREEEEEEE!!!! AAAAAHHHHH!!! Since: Dec, 2017 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Acheron is SUS
#169262: Sep 10th 2020 at 12:55:43 AM

[up] Souls-like RPG should go to the protagonist(s) who aren't from the Dark Souls franchise IMO. I mean, it inspired the genre after all.

Hey you, what's up man? Give me money, please!
RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#169263: Sep 10th 2020 at 4:42:48 AM

@ Berrenta: Maybe if you combine it with Cresselia for a Dreams vs. Nightmares profile?

SailorVenus372 Since: Nov, 2019 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#169264: Sep 10th 2020 at 5:42:06 AM

[up] I feel like to make it stick you’d have to include their mystery dungeon incarnations too. Those versions definitely fit the trope more than the other incarnations of the two.

Edited by SailorVenus372 on Sep 10th 2020 at 6:09:04 AM

Get Snuck-Up On.”
Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#169265: Sep 10th 2020 at 6:36:55 AM

[up][up] That could be possible, but I'm not sure how the writeup's going to look...

I'll leave it to those that are more versed into the format than I am.

Edited by Berrenta on Sep 10th 2020 at 8:39:30 AM

fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#169266: Sep 10th 2020 at 6:39:04 AM

[up] If it's only concerning Bad Dreams, we can temporarily remove Darkrai so the wick gets removed and cut. Is that good?

Uni cat
Berrenta Bejeweled (she/her) (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Bejeweled (she/her)
#169267: Sep 10th 2020 at 6:39:47 AM

[up]That works.

Edit: Done. I'll take care of the Fear one too.

Edited by Berrenta on Sep 10th 2020 at 8:43:20 AM

DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
It's Him
#169268: Sep 10th 2020 at 6:50:00 AM

Hey, is there anyone who has the trope Pyrrhic Victory?

KomasanS Yo-kai Fan from Thailand Since: May, 2016
Yo-kai Fan
#169269: Sep 10th 2020 at 7:44:30 AM

Umm hey, can I suggest some Happy Tree Friends cast(s) into Pantheon? For example:

Lumpy, God of Idiotic Moose

Is anyone took Shell-Shocked Veteran or Trauma Button yet?

AjWargo Lord Barglebroth, Come For Your Souls! from Westfeild, New Jersey Since: Dec, 2014
Lord Barglebroth, Come For Your Souls!
#169270: Sep 10th 2020 at 8:16:45 AM

[up] Someone already has that planned for the two moose from Brother Bear. Plus, I have the entirety of the Happy Tree Friends planned for Bloody Hilarious. But you can help me make the profile, if that’s any consolation.

Edited by AjWargo on Sep 10th 2020 at 11:17:41 AM

Check out my fanfiction account here!
Rmpdc Ghoulish Brain Worm from Philippines Since: May, 2015 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Ghoulish Brain Worm
#169271: Sep 10th 2020 at 8:48:02 AM

2nd draft for the Special Naval Landing Forces. Currently expanding their lore.

The Imperial Japanese Special Naval Landing Forces, Divine Representatives of Spiteful A.I. (SNLF, Japanese Marines)

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/maxresdefault_12_9.jpg

"We are gonna sit here and take it! You hear me!? We're gonna take it!"
nightelf37 The Scrappy and Butt-Monkey of the Pantheon Thread from Hadithi (it's Swahili for 'story') Since: Jul, 2010 Relationship Status: They grew on me like a tumor...
The Scrappy and Butt-Monkey of the Pantheon Thread
#169272: Sep 10th 2020 at 10:08:51 AM

Say, Color-Coded Armies isn't taken yet. I'm considering characters from Nintendo Wars to take it, but I'm not certain how to handle it.

TV Tropes Pantheon Group Members Database
AzureLegacy Since: Sep, 2018
#169273: Sep 10th 2020 at 11:38:31 AM

I'm done with The Maker

Reed Nathaniel Richards, God of Evil Science (Ultimate Reed Richards, The Maker, Mister Fantastic of Earth Earth-1610, Mister Candyfloss, Mr. Mystery, Dr. Richards, Stretcho, The Ultimate Enemy)

https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/reed_richards_earth_1610_from_avengers_vol_6_0_0011.jpg
  • Potential House: Fields of Science
  • Intermediate God
  • Symbol: His Metallic Helmet
  • Alignment: Neutral Evil
  • Portfolio: THE Evil Alternate Universe Reed Richards, Evil Science, From simple scientist to Terror of the Multiverse, Everything Reed fears to become, Cool Helmet, Still has the burn scars from Johnny, Omnidisciplinary Scientist, Can no longer be considered human, Lived a hard life but it doesn't excuse his actions, Well-Intentioned Extremist except not really, Surveillance
  • Domains: Science, Evil, Alternate Self
  • Herald: W.H.I.S.P.E.R., City
  • Allies:
  • Rivals: The Batman Who Laughs, Johann Schmidt/Red Skull, HYDRA, Lord Recluse, SHOCKER
  • Teeth-Clenched Teamwork: The Venom Symbiote, Eddie Brock/Venom, High Councilor Kal-El/Regime Superman, Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader, Ben Solo/Kylo Ren, The 501st Legion, Count Dooku/Darth Tyranus, Galen Marek/Starkiller, The Combine
  • Enemies:
  • Interested In: Dr. Manhattan, Metron, G-Man, The God-Emperor of Mankind
  • On Speaking Terms With: Kang the Conqueror, Rick Sanchez
  • The Multiverse is a vast place with near limitless possibilities. In it there exists an Alternate Universe, an Alternate History and an Alternate Self. Such is the case with Reed Richards of Earth-1610. Unfrotunatly this Reed Richards is from an Ultimate Universe, but not just any Ultimate Universe, THE Ultimate Universe. The universe where unless your name is either Peter Parker or Miles Morales, your either a bigger jerk then usual and or even worse of a villain then usual, and this Reed was both.
  • This Reed Richards didn't start out as a villain, he was initially a simple man who wanted to help the world in the best way he knew how. Unfortunately tragedy after tragedy would eventually lead him down the path of villainy. Starting off with an abusive father who never cared for science and would openly speak of how much he preferred Ben Grim (his Only Friend) instead, and received almost zero respect from anyone. It wasn't until years later did his life turn for the better, when he joined a government think tank, found a father figure in Franklin Storm, a new love in Susan Storm and a family in the new Fantastic Four. Unfortunately absolutely none of this would have last. Having had his attempts to help improve humanity and the world repeatedly rejected. His wedding proposal to Sue was interrupted thanks to Ultimatum, with said proposal later being completely rejecting when Reed went to save the world instead of being by her side. This was immediately fallowed with Sue leaving him and having the team disbanded forcing him to go back to her family. The final nail in the coffin was when Kang the Conqueror a future Sue Storm warns him about the coming disaster, finally turning him into the terror he is today.
  • Nobody knows how The Maker managed to access Pantheon. Nobody had sought to give him a position, be it Herald, High Priest, or Follower. Nobody even made a proposal to bring him in. Somehow beyond all understanding he entered Pantheon by himself, gave the Court of the Gods his resume and was then made the God of Evil Science. What's even more concerning is how he's already aware of events that have taken place in Pantheon, knows about Gods that no longer reside, and has made claims to know of Gods and events that will appear in the future. Many are concerned, but at the same time, many are interested in what he knows and what he's willing to offer.
  • It has to be said, even though Reed Richards of Earth-1610 had lived a hard and difficult life, especially one in a hard and cruel world, it doesn't remotely excuse him for the crimes he's committed. He had a loving and caring mother and sister who supported him, a loyal friend who defended him since childhood, and a father figure who encouraged his love of science. These people no longer mean anything to him.
  • Naturally the Richards Family weren't exactly thrilled to see him, Reed especially. When Reed first met his alternate self, he was initially taken back by how amoral and ruthless he was. He sees his other self as everything that he feared he would become, and still may be. The Maker in turn wasn't very thrilled to see them either. But this was mostly towards Johnny and Ben Grim. He still has the scars that Johnny scorched onto his face, and he's seemly still sore about the Ben Grim of his earth hooking up with Susan Storm. Despite his relationship with his counterpart family, The Maker actually has some respect for his prime counterpart, both for his intelligence and idealism.
  • Besides the Fantastic Four, Doom was absolutely furious to see The Make enter Pantheon. Mostly because he didn't like seeing another Reed Richards running around. That and he understood that this Reed Richards was far too dangerous to move freely. In a rare moment of non self-service, Doom warned the residents of Pantheon of the danger that is The Maker. While this made The Maker's existence and crimes known to the public, it also gave The Maker an easier time to find new allies and form new partnerships with others. Although he probably already had an idea who he wanted to meet up with anyways.
    • Unlike other gods from his home reality, The Maker is on good terms with the Time Traveling Conqueror, Kang. The one he personally knows has no relation with the version most others are familiar with, but he doesn't really mind that. The Maker sees Kang as someone who understands what needs to be done. That the world is a mess and that someone needs to fix it.
    • The only person who wasn't unhappy about The Makers arrival was Thanos. The two having met at the eve of the Incursions. In the brief time they've met, Thanos developed a begrudging sense of respect for the alternate Reed Richards.
    • Eddie Brock wasn't happy to see The Maker again, but at the same time he's glad he doesn't have to worry about looking where to find him. Eddie knows that The Maker has answers, about his son Dylan, Knull and other questions he doesn't know need answering. Both Eddie and Venom plan on getting their answers, one way or the other.
  • The thing that makes The Maker so dangerous and effective is also what makes the main Reed Richards such a great hero, he's super smart. Invent a devise to De-power other superheroes and give others similar, but superior versions of said power? Tell him what said power is and he'll have done in a couple minutes. Ask his to build a weapon capable of destroying a planet? He probably already has one laying around. Build an impenetrable fortress capable of withstanding attacks from weapons and beings of mass destruction, nearly impossible to sneak, or hack into, can hack other machines, defend itself from attacks, has time and space work differently from the inside, and work as a personal lab? He calls that City and he built a new one into his temple and turned it into a herald. Create an entire race of hyper evolved humans with the power and capabilities to take down Physical Gods? He did that already, called them the "The Children of Tomorrow", they destroyed Asgard and everyone in it. What's more is that this is simply what he can do with his brain, his actual powers?
    • After the accident that transformed his body gave him his powers and tuned him into Mister Fantastic, Reed has since no longer needed to eat, sleep, or breath. He doesn’t bleed, excretes, or age. He no longer has any internal organs, or posses an actual skeletal structure. The moment he stopped being Mister Fantastic and became The Maker, Reed effectively stopped being human. In almost every way conceivable. Without the concepts of humanity and morality, Reed used his powers and abilities to its most logical and horrific conclusion. He can, and actively does, stretch out his brain for more brain power. He can heal From a Single Cell and creat an expendable clone from said ability with single strand of hair. He can stretch out his body in a way to become multiple people, while still sharing a single body. And while he was efficiently immoral with having an near indestructible, nobody has ever seen him in the House of Life And Death when successful at actually killing him. This is because Owen Reece, The Molecule Man, after seemly killing him, placed a piece of him in every universe that was made after the third Secret Wars. All of them share a single mind within multiple bodies across the entire multiverse.
  • With his world having crossed over with the world of the DC Gods, The Maker has made himself known to a number of it's residents. Lex Luthor approached and offered him the chance to join his Legion of Doom. Saying that he could give The Maker all the money, equipment info and resources he would ever need, but to his surprise The Maker claimed that he had all of those and more. Teleporting Luthor and himself to his temple Luthor saw that he was telling him the complete truth. What's more alarming was how The Maker somehow had recordings of him slaughtering his alternate counterparts. The Maker made it clear that he knows and has anything and everything he would ever need, but he still decides to join him and his Legion of Doom. Saying that they are better together, than against each other.
    • Much to Luthor's (and everyone else's} shock, he learned that along with already knowing what's going on in his own reality, The Maker is also well acquainted with The Batman Who Laughs. He thankfully explained just how the two knew each other. But to everyone's concern, there's no hostility between them, in fact the two are mostly friendly with each other. There's a sense of rivalry between the two, despite or maybe because of the two having different plans and end goals. There's also been rumors of the two having made some trade with Iso-8 (more info bellow) for Nth Metal. The two have been disturbingly silent on the mater.
    • With DC being filled with Alternate Universes and Alternate selves, The Maker was made aware of the existence of the Regime Superman. While the rogue Superman had zero interest in the mad Reed with how he was allied with Luthor, Brainiac, Joker and was vaguely associated with the Evil Batman, The Maker had made multiple attempt to speak with him. Eventually the Regime Superman decided to hear him out, The Maker claimed that he merely wanted to help solve all the problems in the world including Superman's. He told him about a Lois Lane in the Dark Multiverse that not only mourns his death, and has decided to take a similar stance has him. He says that with how all Universes in the Dark Multiverse are doomed to fail she doesn't have much time to live. With The Maker's extensive knowledge of multiversal travel and exploration and the Regime's kryptonian technology, they could access the Dark Multiverse and save Lois. The idea of a Lois Lane in danger, one that also shared his world view, was all he needed to hear to agree to whatever The Maker wanted. And it was all what The Maker needed to do to acquire both new advance technology and a pawn to keep it safe.
  • The Maker considers the existence of Pantheon to be an intriguing anomaly. He notices that it seemly acts as a nexus point for the omniverse, yet at the same time it's separate from any reality it connects to. Individuals who shouldn't exist, or no longer exist walk freely without consequence. Death is meaningless even though there is still a reaper and an afterlife, several even. Beings of higher power can walk among mortals, the laws reality are even more flexible than any universe he's ever seen. One of The Maker plans is to find out what exactly makes Pantheon work this way and how he can us it to his advantage. He's glad to know that he wasn't the only one to take special notice to this, as the New God Metron thought the exact same.
  • One of the first things the Maker did upon ascending, was to bring in W.H.I.S.P.E.R. (World Headquarters for International Scientific/Philosophical Experimentation and Research) as his herald in Pantheon. W.H.I.S.P.E.R. is a scientific organization similar to the Nebulous Evil Organisation A.I.M (Advanced Idea Mechanics). His goal was to bring into Pantheon not only to counter Nick Fury and S.H.I.E.L.D, but to also bring in some like-minded individuals. Luring in other scientists to push science to its limits, to reshape the world and everything in it. To insure further success in recruitment, he offered a free supply of Isotope-8. A strange ore that can be found across the Multiverse (potentially native to earth) and can improve everything and anything be it physical, magical, technological, cosmic, demonic or divine.
    • Being the leader of his own organization, The Maker is considered to be competition towards others others like HYDRA, The Arachnos Organization and SHOCKER. Although it's more friendly competition between him and Lord Recluse. Needless to say The Maker is now seen as an enemy to the likes of Stateman and every Toku Hero in Pantheon.
    • Thanks to the help of W.H.I.S.P.E.R., The Maker was successful into forming a number of partnerships in the mad scientist community. Some of the most notable ones are the Evilutionists of Mad Science, they don't let, or care for things like "morality" and "ethics" to get in the way of their experiments and goals. Albert Wesker and William Birkin were considerably beneficial allies, having generously donated samples of both the T and G-Virus for experimentation. Relius Clover is someone who he's come to respect, reasons being for both his accomplishments, scientific brain and for being the first to notice his Multiversal Omnipresence. Seemly with but a single glance.
    • Promestein came in contact with The Maker when looking further into how the world worked. Having heard that one of The Maker's goals is to learn how Pantheon truly functions, as well as already having an extensive knowledge of The Multiverse of his world, and potentially other worlds too. He was surprisingly generous and shared all the information he had. He says that he's more than willing to share any and all scientific information need to help further someones research and work. Being more than grateful, Promestein took to learning everything she could, even taking some notes in his genetics lab to help perfect her White Rabbit drug.
    • Of Course with being a popular figure in the mad scientist community, he's largely hated by other more benevolent scientists. Those who believe that science should be a force for good, like the Philanthropists of Benevolent Science, Senku Ishigami, Dr. Light and the The Elric Family see The Maker as everything science should't be. Those who use science as a source of heroism, like Qubit, Jimmy Neutron and of course Mister Fantastic, see him as a near personal enemy. Prime Reed Richards being the most obvious reason.
  • Rick Sanchez heard about how The Maker was trying to find a way to enter and restore his home universe, a universe he claims to still be destroyed, despite certain events proving otherwise. Thinking it would be fun to humiliate The Maker, Rick went to see the universe for himself and maybe take a few pictures to show off. It was admittedly a little harder then he'd like to admit to access and then enter. He eventually made an operating portal and went in to see it for himself. Turns out it was destroyed, but in a Class 2 fashion instead of Class X-4 like he initially thought. When came back he showed The Maker pictures of the still burning buildings from his universe.
  • If it wasn't clear already, The Makers ultimate goal is to turn the world into a utopia, using any means necessary. To reach said goal, The Maker formed a partnership with those that not only share the same goal, but are also willing to get their hands dirty. With a few choice of words, he was able to recruit Clu, Yamato Hotsuin, Light Yagami and Ozymandias. This is notable because Yamato opposes YHVH, Clu's and Light's leader. In truth, The Maker doen't care for the good of the world and is only in it to prove he's better than everyone else, but his allies actually do believe him. Partially because he's that good at using people, but also because he has the brains, tech and power to do it. It doesn't hurt that he actually did manage to make his world a better place, even if it was only for a short time before the heroes stopped him. What's more is that he has valid reasons for his extreme actions. He tried to help, but others wouldn't let him. He tried to be "good", but nothing helped. He had the answers, but no one listened. It was almost like they wanted to live in a broken world. While this is a massive load of hypocrisy, The Maker has little care or interest for those who wish for despotism and/or dystopia.
    • His partnership with Ozymandias has lead to him learning of the existence of Dr. Manhattan. He's genuinely amazed at both his power and the mental fortitude he needed to pull himself back together after losing his body.
    • While this should come to no surprise, Zamasu has a special sense of distaste for the alternate Reed Richards. While he can understand the frustration of having superiors that not only refuse act, but actively hinder progress, and the desire to create a perfect world. He's disgusted with The Makers lack of humanity and for his unnatural form of immortality. The irony is not lost on him.
  • In search to lean more of the world and beyond. The Maker eventually came across Lord Drakkon, the most dangerous and feared Power Ranger to ever exist. The two work almost perfectly together. The Maker would not only help Drakkon in increasing his power in exchange of learning more about the Morphin' Grid but The Maker would also strengthen Drakkon‘s belief that he isn’t the flawed Tommy Oliver . The Maker seemly genuinely believes that Drakkon is the ultimate version of himself, having acquired power like no other. having dealt with every threat to earth by himself. Having created a utopia where everyone was safe and happy until a "flawed" version Oliver came up and ruined everything. Drakkon genuinely appreciates The Maker’s friendship and support.
  • Space isn't an area that The Maker regularly deals in, preferring to focus more on earth, or other earths first. But it doesn't mean he's unfamiliar with what's out there. He himself had personally put an end to his world's version of Thanos, was there to stop Gah Lak Tus and later Galactus himself. He's been more active in the field and has proceeded to make even more enemies and allies.
    • The Doctor complexity and absolutely despises The Maker. Being a member of the Overseers of Time and Space and a partner of The Living Tribunal, The Doctor is given special insight of others do in greater omniverse and is completely disgusted with The Makers actions. Besides faking his own redemption, having destroyed sixty-seven different earths during the Incursions all while keeping the event a secret from everyone, he tricked Nick Fury into having the heroes of Earth-1610 to attack Earth-616. And these are only some of the crimes he's aware of. While The Maker normally wouldn't care, he did feel the need to point out that not only was what he did needed, the other heroes set out to do the exact same thing. Only he didn't back out at the last minute, cause the superhero community to split and have them ignore the end of everything in the process.
    • Without having to anything towards them, The Maker has earned the ire of both the entire Jedi Order and the Rebel Alliance. Besides already having a infamous reputation, he began supplying The Empire with advance weapons and battle ships. What's even worse is that they know these weapons from the Legends Univers and they know just how dangerous they can be. They initially hoped that they were well made replicas, but that was until The Maker approached Vader with a magma kyber crystal, a kyber crystal that could only be found on magma planets like Mustafar specifically in the Legends Universe. When The Maker approached Vader, he offered a deal between him the Jedi and Rebel Alliance. Namely that he would supply them with improved weaponry, vehicles, equipment and of course kyber crystals, as long as they turn a blind eye and leave him alone. Obviously they refused, but those who were closer to The Dark Side agreed to his offer. Concluding that the equipment was too valuable and useful to deny, all the while fully aware that they're playing right into The Maker's plan.
    • Among the many entities that either hate, tolerate or somehow enjoy the presence of The Maker, The Emperor of Mankind instead someone who pities him. The Emperor knows that he's tried to do good, tried to be good, but they wouldn't let him help. As someone who knows the potential in humanity and despises the ineptitude of those in charge, he knows his frustration and pain. He's upset with how The Maker, someone who he believes should have been the Ultimate Hero is instead The Ultimate Enemy.
    • In an effort to to find acquire more manpower and to insure that his business runs smoothly, The Maker sought out for a mercenary or freelancer. He decided to hire two known solders, Felix and The Meta. He managed to hire them both by paying them only with money, but with further upgraded versions of their equipment and the opportunity for revenge. The Maker even gave The Meta a special AI, a Smart AI made from The Maker's own brain. Fully capable operating anything and everything The Meta's previous AI's did and more. He gave Felix a personal Energy Sword, made specifically to work only for him.
    • Shepard really hates The Maker. Like The Doctor he hates him for how he destroyed sixty-seven different earths and all of it's inhabitants without remorse and almost getting away with it. He sees the alternate Richards as an affront to the heroic prime version, and swears to make him pay for all of his crimes. His partnership with The The Illusive Man did little to improve things, especially with how much more effective and dangerous Cerberus became from their new partnership.
    • The Maker came in contact with The Combine through Dr. Wallace Breen. Despite having incredibly advance alien technology, they're severely lacking in teleportation technology. They sent Wallace to recruit him, knowing full well that the Ultimate Reed Richards can fix their problem easily. Having made a number of deals ans alliances with aliens in the past, he accepted without much problem. But has yet to deliver, claiming that with each universe having different set of rules and laws with in how they function, teleportation included. A single mistake could lead to massive consequences, not to mention a loss of valuable resources. This is all a complete lie though, he the tech ready before they even heard of him. He's just biding his time, studying their technology and working alongside Wallace to overthrow The Combine.
      • What's actually concerning is that there was a report of the G-Man being spotted speaking with The Maker. Members of the House of Science, Technology, Time And Space built a device to try to spy and monitor the G-Man. The devise was a complete success, and they were able to briefly spy on the G-Man talking to The Maker in an unknown area. Unfortunately the devise wasn't perfect and both individuals saw that they were being spied on. The devise immediately malfunctioned and all attempts to replicate it have been met with failure.
  • The Maker isn’t really interested in the Grand United Alliances or their Forever War. Half of them don’t even want him involved. The only one that he actually pays attention to is the Grand United Alliance of Destruction. Because he can’t fix the world if their is no world in it. It’s also why he’s against the Anti-Monitor.
I'm Reed Richards. The ultimate Reed Richards. The one who's finally going to solve everything.

Edited by AzureLegacy on Sep 10th 2020 at 3:23:55 PM

CrimsonShark Punk Rocker from The Internet of Loneliness and Beyond Since: Nov, 2018 Relationship Status: One Is The Loneliest Number
#169274: Sep 10th 2020 at 11:40:34 AM

[up] Finally [tup].

WHERE IS KRYPTO, I mean, WHERE IS THE DOG!!!
SailorVenus372 Since: Nov, 2019 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form

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