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x6 I've wondered why a lot of the TRS issues are with widely-used tropes. You may want to check which ones will need TRS, if. But that is outside the scope of this thread.
And could you clarify what "Acceptable given the age ratings" means?
I'm going to restrict myself to English-language ratings, because I don't know if other-language dubs may have bowdlerised Case Closed in some way.
In Japan it was rated G, but we know Japanese censors tend to be more lenient about sex jokes.
By "Acceptable given the age ratings", I mean that the content cited in the example is permitted under the criteria for the age rating assigned. For example, the American TV-PG rating allows the show to make the kind of mild sexual references of which the examples primarily consist, and so those examples did not get past the American TV radar.
Just a question: what should we do if a show is listed as having multiple different content ratings in the same region, with no context given for this?
I’m planning on going through Radar.Western Animation, as for it has the most Radar/ subpages out of any medium. The first page listed on there is Radar.Two Stupid Dogs, and I decided to check IMDb to see what it was rated. While the show’s main IMDb page says that it’s rated TV-Y, the certifications page lists it as TV-Y, TV-G, and TV-Y7 in the US for some reason. While I’m leaning towards TV-Y or TV-G being the general US rating (since Argentina, Canada, and the UK all gave it their own lowest content ratings), how can I check to make sure?
Edited by jandn2014 on Jan 8th 2021 at 10:23:48 AM
Doing a check on Radar/Splatoon. This also covers Splatoon 2.
Singapore's rating system: 6
Germany rating system: PG
Is everyone agreeing to cut this page? Seems like there's only three examples at best.
Edited by ReynTime250 on Jan 8th 2021 at 4:25:58 PM
My rule of thumb is to act as if every episode has the highest rating listed so as to err on the side of caution. If you have some source of which exact rating each episode got, use that.
This is just Think of the Censors!. They don't actually say any bad words, and as the note says, booty refers to pirate loot. Even so, the ESRB rating is E10+, which does allow for mild innuendo.
You're right, it's DIH.
Symbol Swearing is acceptable, since no cursing is actually in the game.
Edited by VampireBuddha on Jan 8th 2021 at 10:54:18 AM
So I guess there isn't any examples on that page then. Thanks for correcting me.
Doing Pokémon right now. This is going to be a big one, because there's so much misuse here.
PEGI: 3 for the 2D Games, 7 for the 3D Games.
Edited by ReynTime250 on Jan 8th 2021 at 1:29:36 PM
[Ignore, I mixed up entires]
Edited by Karxrida on Jan 8th 2021 at 5:08:24 AM
Well...depends. Was anything in the game changed, translation-wise? Or was it essentially just a copy-pasted rom? The game being preserved as it was when originally launched doesn't necessarily mean the radar was cool with it- they might've just wanted to keep the games as unaltered as possible.
Edited by WarJay77 on Jan 8th 2021 at 8:09:26 AM
I wouldn't say the Beauty entry is transphobic. GCPTR doesn't mean "this is inappropriate" it means "the censors usually don't allow this" and a lot of video games don't allow explicit transgender characters - I can think of two trans Nintendo characters (Birdo, and Vivian from Paper Mario) who were bowdlerized to remove references to that in the English dub. Not sure if it's still an example, though.
Also, why is the "rubbing a Pokemon's crotch in Pokemon Amie" thing valid? It's more Video Game Perversity Potential or Accidental Innuendo.
BTW, I added the Tuber entry a while back not to be creepy, because it creeped me out. It's not an example, I'll admit, but what the hell was that NPC trying to say?
Edited by mightymewtron on Jan 8th 2021 at 8:26:01 AM
I've said before (many, many times before) that we'd probably eliminate 90 percent of this trope's misuse if we could hammer it into people's heads that this trope is not a good thing. It's part of a whole bundle of Bad Troper Beliefs, really.
Edited by nrjxll on Jan 8th 2021 at 8:43:43 AM
It's like Nightmare Fuel but worse. And that mindset gets especially weird when it comes to stuff like talking about the oversexualization of children being considered part of a "cool subversive adult trope."
What would the valid example list for Pokemon look like after stripping out the bad examples? The thing's a text wall.
Excuse me, but... what does DIH mean? Dirty In Head?
It wouldn't need a page.
Edited by ReynTime250 on Jan 9th 2021 at 7:25:09 PM
Thanks, I remembered that trope only by its original TLP name as Age Inappropriate Humour.
x2 I figured. I just want to see a visual representation of what's left.
I agree. That's a big part of why I sorted the example section by radar system, to put the focus on the censors, not the works. For what it's worth, the first examples in the PEGI and ESRB sections are about Crash Team Racing sneaking in microtransactions, which people hate. The first examples in the CBFC section is about bribing the ratings board for lower ratings.
I've started going through the Film/ namespace, and I find that tropers are much better about writing examples for movies that came out before most of us were born. There are still a lot of bad examples, but the good ones make up a higher proportion. This doesn't just appear to be because standards really were that strict before the mid-70s; part of it too is that the people who watch those movies are more likely to have an interest in the history of cinema, and they're better about explaining the context of things. Fewer tropers watching also means there's less opportunity for "Oh my gosh they said 'Hell'!" or shoehorning.
I still had to cut a bunch of pre-Hays Code examples, though.
Reyn is pleasantly enthusiastic about cleanup. I'm going to have a look at the Pokémon examples they say are valid or unclear.
Caveat: I have not played a Pokémon game since Silver, so I'm judging these examples at face value.
Not valid. A man finding women attractive is acceptable.
Not sure about this one, but I'm leaning towards not valid. The way it's written, it sounds like the guy is just supposed to come off as a cloudcuckoolander, not a paedophile. Can reasonably be AI.
Hmm. I checked the wiki; Here's what it says:
The Ultra Sun example doesn't seem objectionable - it actually sounds like using pheromones to mind control Salandit into doing chores rather than anything sexual.
The Sun example is questionable. Harem is a zoological term, and the 'dex entry seems to be talking about reproduction rather than fornicating. Simply saying that reproduction occurs doesn't violate any radar systems, and I don't believe anything is actually shown.
Anything written on the official website is irrelevant, because the ratings agencies only rate the game itself, not supplementary material.
Bloody Hell that's not an example. It's just a reference to people sometimes having unpleasant thoughts, which distresses Lucario. People can have negative thoughts about things other than shagging.
Big nuggets appear to be lumps of gold; they're just vendor trash, and with that in mind, the example doesn't sound remotely like a drug deal. Drugs aren't the only illegal substance people try and fence.
ESRB rates it E10+ and PEGI gives it 7, both of which come with a Violence content warning. The radars picked this one up.
This is just a parody of attention-grabbing tabloid headlines.
Moreover, manga does not have any sort of age rating system in Japan, and Adventures debuted before American manga publishers started applying voluntary ratings. The only radar system involved would be Viz' internal policies, so we'll need a source before we can consider this valid.
From what the wiki says, this example is poorly written.
Toshihiro Ono is the writer and lead artist, and his team make a manga with a fair amount of nudity and stuff designed to appeal to teenage boys. Ono later edits the artwork for publication in CoroCoro, but the tankobons use the original art. There's no reason Shogakukan can't have different policies for their magazines and trades.
As to the hot springs scene, it's in the original Japanese. It was removed from the English translation, but maintained in the Chinese translation. This means it didn't get past Viz' radar. It might have gotten past Chuang Yi's radar, but without a source, we have no idea what Chuang Yi's internal policies might be, so I would say this one should be excluded.
Manga in Japan does not have any specific regulatory body or industry rating system. Some American publishers voluntarily use an internal rating system; Viz is one of those, though they do advise that the ratings are ultimately based on their subjective opinions.
Looking around the Internet, I wasn't able to find if PDPA has a specific age rating; the closest I could find is that Book Depository says it's suitable for 9-12 year olds. Viz' own All Ages rating is relatively permissive, so I'm going to say this example is probably not valid.
Probably not valid, since I don't believe theatre is subject to any sort of age rating system (after all, children regularly see Avenue Q). This sounds more like a PB.
Frankly, the main thing this thread is convincing me is that ratings boards make no sense.
A lot of the stuff on the Pokemon page can go to DIH. I think the "weird man" one sounds like it could be an intentional innuendo, which would belong there. Same with the "Shocking Case of Poke-Love" example. The manga sounds like it could be something like What Do You Mean, It's for Kids?.
I'd let the theatre example slide because it's an official franchise product made in America, referencing something that was banned and not referenced in any American work due to Values Dissonance regarding sexual content. I don't think it would fit Parental Bonus, at least not as written, because it seems to be a Continuity Nod to something banned from American TV. (Worth noting it's one of those "live on stage" productions that are undoubtedly geared towards young children.)
Edited by mightymewtron on Jan 9th 2021 at 7:49:37 AM
The Big Nugget is definitely not drugs; in Japan Nuggets are named after a poop pun. It's Toilet Humor.
So there's no page for this one, but I'm not sure on any of these examples. From Kid Icarus Uprising: The Novelization
Here's the thing, the fanfic is rated for Teens so I highly doubt any of these are legit examples. That said, I don't know how ratings on Fan Fiction.net works. Are they submitted by the staff or by the users? Because if they're done by the users then there flat out isn't a radar at all.
Edited by ReynTime250 on Jan 10th 2021 at 3:47:43 PM
That's something I'm curious about as well. The guidelines page just says they use the FictionRatings.com categories, but that's just something somebody made for other people to voluntarily apply to their work.
As far as I can tell, FF.net ratings are assigned by the uploader and are based on the uploader's own opinion about what's suitable for each age group. Given that, it is impossible for something to get past the radar; or, as Reyn says, the radar doesn't exist.
Now I've completely cut all of that.
Jumping in for a second. For any Radar subpages that end up being kept, if they don't have an image on them, please add the tag below, minus the extra spaces and with two or three %%s above and below:
%% Due to the nature of this trope, finding a proper image will be very difficult.
%% DO NOT add an image to this page without discussion in Image Pickin'
%% IP thread for reference: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1607366306026777500
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