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My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic (Live Reactions & Discussion)

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A thread to discuss My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic and the tie-in media.

All of the usual forum rules apply. In addition, please remember that the thread is discussing a kids' show, and it's primarily focused on the work itself, not the fanfic — in particular, we don't want to see lewdness creeping in.

     Original OP text 
I don't know WHAT the Hell happened (I blame shenanigans) but we're going to start from scratch. Post your feels for this awesome show again! Naow!

Edited by Mrph1 on Aug 26th 2024 at 10:24:26 AM

GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#198251: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:31:30 PM

[up][up] Oh I wasn't replying to the idea that she can move the sun through sheer force. I just disagree that she's a pushover.

[up] Well, it's called the Frozen North. It could be that every single thing north of Equestria is frozen by this magic.

Edited by GNinja on Apr 27th 2020 at 7:34:12 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#198252: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:35:01 PM

[up]Or it could not be that literal and all-encompassing.

Edited by fredhot16 on Apr 27th 2020 at 12:39:47 PM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
VengefulBale Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight from Nowhere Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight
#198253: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:36:24 PM

[up] Yeah, that's applying massive NLF (No Limits Fallacy) alright.

Prettiest Meta Knight Gijinka, ngl
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#198254: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:40:59 PM

[up] I did say "could be" because the story doesn't tell us either way, not that I actually think it. But given how The Crystalling frames it, I see no reason to think the Frozen North isn't an impressive, dangerous thing. Maybe not all-encompassing, but vast enough to where I don't think Celestia is a loser for not being able to stop it.

Edited by GNinja on Apr 27th 2020 at 7:43:56 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
VengefulBale Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight from Nowhere Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight
#198255: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:46:37 PM

[up] "Celestia not being able to beat theat" is hardly a high bar. It may have been if she did anything but lose to every single major threat and getting reduced to a Damsel in Distress who at most can hand out advice every single time and that bar falls deep and low.

Prettiest Meta Knight Gijinka, ngl
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#198256: Apr 27th 2020 at 12:52:35 PM

[up] Everyone lost to the Frozen North. It couldn't even be beaten without fixing the Crystal Heart. And Celestia helped with that in the end.

The cast aren't really much more competent than Celestia is. They just have the benefit of narrative convenience and wielding the power of Harmonious WM Ds.

Few of the things Celestia ever lost to are things that other characters could simply beat in straight combat.

Edited by GNinja on Apr 27th 2020 at 9:11:07 AM

Kaze ni Nare!
Sereg Since: Jun, 2010
#198257: Apr 27th 2020 at 1:17:58 PM

Celestia moving the Sun IS what is happening in the show. No writer perception necessary. Celestia being worfed is litterally incapable of being evidence. A > B does not tell you the absolute value of B. It does not provide any evidence at all that B < C. If you can destroy galactic superclusters with your mind, you are still useless in a fight against Azathoth, so Azathoth beating you doesn't provide any evidence that you can't destroy galactic superclusters.

Ajimu from Medaka Box is a great example of this. The series is full of characters that are ridiculously HAX. Ajimu has almost 14 quadrillion powers, including universe creation, omnipresence, universal reality warping, time travel, etc. (We know 800 of them). There are also multiple characters arguably more powerful than she is. One of them sliced her in half with a rubber band. This is a huge joke on the part of people who dislike her and want to pretend she's weaker than she is, but it doesn't make her any weaker, because attacks by that character are ridiculously broken and among other things, completely ignore durability. In addition, he happens to exploit her biggest weakness.

When using a worfing to claim a character is less powerful than previously demonstrated, you are making the logical fallacy equivalent to saying "He can't lift a car, so those times he lifted a pencil are a lie and he can't actually do that."

Basically:

Celestia cannot defeat X.

Therefore Celestia cannot lift the Sun

Is not a logical conclusion. It would only be one of lifting the Sun is harder to do than to defeat X. And there is zero evidence of that.

Also, again, the bias against magic is ridiculous. If someone uses magic to accomplish something and someone else uses another method, in both cases, it remains equally accomplished.

Claiming "Doctor Strange cannot beat Y because he uses spells" is ridiculous.

As for the specificity, again, AKR calls it telekinetic brute force. There is even evidence of this. Others can do it too, even though Twilight claims in Season one that unicorns can only cast spells related to their special talent. And it is not just any unicorns, but the most powerful ones. Pretty big coincidence if they all have special talents that allow this. What's more, Celestia and Luna can lift each others' celestial bodies. In addition, the comics show that Luna really struggles to lift the Sun while Celestia does not struggle to lift the moon. (Incidentally, the comics confirm it is a round planet and that the distance to the moon is large relative to the size of the planet, as you would expect from the real moon. What's more, the comics confirm that Celestia and Luna don't even NEED to use magic to move the moon. They can drag it out of orbit with their physical muscles! It also shows them flying at low relativistic speeds.)

VengefulBale Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight from Nowhere Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight
#198258: Apr 27th 2020 at 1:27:09 PM

[up] Comics aren't 100% reliable tho. They're not really canon to the show for the most part except for a few overlaps

Prettiest Meta Knight Gijinka, ngl
Sereg Since: Jun, 2010
#198259: Apr 27th 2020 at 1:31:16 PM

The comics are not 100% canon, that is true. However, it means that kind of power is canon for the comic version Celestia. What's more, the comic writers did communicate with the show writers a lot at the start and that was an early arc. That indicates that that kind of view of Celestia was at least not abnormal among the higher ups.

In addition, that only addresses a small part of my argument. Most of it still holds.

EDIT: And G Ninja has a point. How many of the things that have beaten Celestia are things that a member of the Mane Six could have beaten without help?

Edited by Sereg on Apr 27th 2020 at 6:48:10 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#198260: Apr 27th 2020 at 4:04:33 PM

Magic. Spells. Do. Not. Obey. Physics.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#198261: Apr 27th 2020 at 9:05:34 PM

Looks, we've had this debate more times than I can count. Sereg has a weird headcanon, but there's no point in trying to convince him to change it.

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
VengefulBale Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight from Nowhere Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight
#198262: Apr 27th 2020 at 9:06:46 PM

Moving on. That's a good point on the cast being incompetent in general.

Hell even out of the villains Tirek is the only one of them with any remote common sense.

Prettiest Meta Knight Gijinka, ngl
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#198263: Apr 27th 2020 at 9:29:23 PM

~G Ninja, what do you think about the villains of this series? Do they fit your standards?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#198264: Apr 27th 2020 at 10:06:52 PM

I think his position is that MLP is a genre where his usual criteria don't apply.

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#198265: Apr 27th 2020 at 10:09:04 PM

Well, I recognized one of the POT Ds where he called Chrysalis "the dumbest true villain" since Discord isn't a villain and Sombra's dead. So I was curious.

Edited by fredhot16 on Apr 27th 2020 at 10:10:44 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#198266: Apr 28th 2020 at 3:14:43 AM

I think Sereg’s position is more that all of the planet Equestria is roughly in the ball park of moving a star about.

Likely, if a human appeared on the planet, they’d be immediately squashed by its immense gravity. If the Cutie Mark Crusaders appeared in MCU, they’d be accidental Avenger level threats as their immense KryptonianEquestrian Power Incontinence causes possibly world shaking issues and tree sap. The Imperium Of Man steps lightly around this strange and terrifying xeno homeworld, glad that the dominant species there is simply ‘’uninterested’’ in space travel.

I disagree on the premise that I find that silly.

GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#198267: Apr 28th 2020 at 3:54:02 AM

[up][up] MLP isn't really about fighting villains, so any villains that do exist are more like a nice bonus.

By this point, I love basically all of them. If I disliked any in the past my feelings have definitely softened by now.

Kaze ni Nare!
Sereg Since: Jun, 2010
#198268: Apr 28th 2020 at 4:48:43 AM

@God of Awesome: I wouldn't quite go that far, but that's the general idea.

The thing is, I don't see it as headcanon, but what is litterally on screen.

Besides, I don't see how it is "weird headcanon" when there are actual writers of the show and comics who agree. What's more, again, there are sites who are usually very conservative with power estimates who still acknowledge Celestia as galaxy tier.

Again, comic!Celestia is moon level just with her muscles, nevermind her magic.

We also not only have Word of God but data from the show itself confirming that lifting the Sun is telekinetic strength, not a specific spell. Twilight confirms that specific spells can only be cast by special unicorns while we see that lifting the Sun can be done by anyone strong enough. This is told to us in the show.

Spells not obeying the laws of physics is irrelevant. Only the effect is relevant. We know Celestia can create effects of that magnitude. Assuming she can only do that is arbitrary and illogical. We are well aware that she knows multiple spells. And again, muscles obey the laws of physics and she is already moon level with those.

Even if we assume it is a specific spell, the spell Hasbro owns that create the most similar effect is Nailed To The Sky from Dn D. Not only is it way less powerful (it teleports someone into low Earth orbit, which is far too close), it is an epic spell from 3rd edition. If you can cast epic spells in 3rd edition Dn D, you can basically create any effect you want in about 12 seconds. You have practical omnipotence even if you don't have true omnipotence. So yeah. If she's casting Nailed To The Sky, she is actually way more powerful than I claim.

As for how silly it is, well that's subjective, but there are plenty of things I find silly, even in this cartoon. I still acknowledge that they are the truth. For example, I consider it silly that the Elements can be used by a single pony and despise that fact, but that is the way they canonically work. (They don't work that way in my fanverse, but that's because I had planned that before the reveal)

EDIT: https://outskirtsbattledomewiki.com/index.php/8-character-profiles/5586-princess-celestia

Edited by Sereg on Apr 28th 2020 at 10:01:45 AM

storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#198269: Apr 28th 2020 at 5:01:08 AM

Post of the Day #2863

@apple: I haven't updated it in ages, I'm sorry to say. I have a page ready to go that I've been sitting on because I wanted to wait until I was producing regularly again, but then dad died when I was halfway through the next page and by the time I got the motivation back, my tablet was dead. I'm starting to get back to work with my new one, but haven't gotten back to the comic yet. I still really want to finish it, though. I think I'm going to try going back to black and white as a time saver once I do. I just don't have the time to do as much work on each page as I did when I started. Also, work is so dead today that I actually have time to sit on my ass and painstakingly type ouf posts on my phone today. :P

Posted by Wryte on 26th Dec 2016 11:11:49 AM - Post #166937 in the new thread

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#198271: Apr 28th 2020 at 5:40:43 AM

[up]Vs Battles”.

Oh, fuck that nonsense. A site that claims that Link’s a planet-buster, Sepiroth can annihilate a galaxy, and Adachi has Universal-level power is worse then nothing.

Let’s bury this subject, shall we?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Sereg Since: Jun, 2010
#198272: Apr 28th 2020 at 6:12:06 AM

I disagree with them in general. I was just saying that even those I disagree with agree with me on this.

Also, I don't know enough about those characters, but looking up Sephiroth and Adachi there has them listed as much weaker than that.

It's just that I find it ridiculous to believe someone cannot do something we have litterally watched them do. That is how I feel about this debate.

Still. I can drop it if people want.

VengefulBale Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight from Nowhere Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Bishie Gijinka Meta Knight
#198273: Apr 28th 2020 at 6:15:08 AM

Vs Battle wiki also puts Grand King Ghidorah and Mothra Leo below Heisei King Ghidorah.

Some of it's calculations are good, but others do feel more based on hype than feats

Prettiest Meta Knight Gijinka, ngl
Ultimatum Disasturbator from The Wiggle Room (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#198274: Apr 28th 2020 at 6:20:55 AM

I just want Raven vs Starlight Glimmer plz

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Sereg Since: Jun, 2010
#198275: Apr 28th 2020 at 6:30:24 AM

Raven is a high tier DC character. DC is one of the most powerful fictional verses. She stomps.


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