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Doug Walker (TGWTG, Nostalgia Critic, Bum Reviews, and other projects)

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Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#12151: Apr 6th 2018 at 5:51:39 AM

To be fair, Doug felt a lot closer than rather distant tv producers or older shows. When it was 2007-2008 he just seemed like an average 20 something who made good jokes about older media. When it blew up as Channel Awesome it felt like who we thought was an average 20 something had become funnier and had so many more people who wanted to follow his example and were achieving it with money and success. Sure, maybe some people did it better but he was great in uniting people and making funny stuff.

The brawl was a funny convention movie, Kickassia showed he could do plots and didn't take himself to seriously. So those of us around at the time really loved his work and couldn't wait to see what he did next. It seemed like the next two years that Doug was starting to buy into his hype and had more serious ambitions of filmmaking leak over into the casual review show and it didn't fit as well but we all wanted to see it get better.

I guess part of the gushing is just that he seemed like such a nice, average funny guy who achieved what so many of us wanted. He brought on so many who achieved things like him. Suddenly, though people he inspired were evolving and his attempt to evolve fell apart rather quickly. But we were already gushing and admiring him for so long it is hard to let that go and see him as an enabler.

Rotide She-Who-Hunts-Unseen (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
She-Who-Hunts-Unseen
#12152: Apr 6th 2018 at 5:55:59 AM

Yeah...I'm starting to remember now why I was so fond of that dumb show. Feeling kind of, well, nostalgic.

At least until I remember that even back then, I was uncomfortable with a lot of his jokes (Didn't know I was trans and a lesbian yet, but even then his creepily masturbatory comments about women even holding hands and the still-repeated gag about The Crying Game whenever he mentions Stargate...yeah.)

edited 6th Apr '18 5:56:12 AM by Rotide

"TV Tropes looks like if Tumblr got a little crazy at a party last night and brought someone home"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12153: Apr 6th 2018 at 5:57:39 AM

Now that I think about it, I think what I liked best about Kickassia was the way it portrayed most of the rest of the producers as having barely concealed contempt for the NC and how the NC was portrayed as an asshole and a terrible leader.

Heck, my favorite bit of Suburban Knights was the very beginning when Angry Joe and Spoony went into hysterics at the realization that they were conned into joining one of the NC's schemes again. The beginning gave the impression that all of the other producers were sick and tired of working with the NC.

In hindsight, maybe it was because those scenes felt more...real. As if the way they really felt about Doug was influencing their acting.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Rotide She-Who-Hunts-Unseen (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
She-Who-Hunts-Unseen
#12154: Apr 6th 2018 at 5:59:17 AM

Not to mention that including that stuff about how the other critics hate him actually shows a nice degree of self-awareness. Makes the whole thing feel less self-indulgent and more comically self-effacing.

"TV Tropes looks like if Tumblr got a little crazy at a party last night and brought someone home"
Motyka5 Since: Aug, 2011
#12155: Apr 6th 2018 at 5:59:46 AM

Personally, while I enjoyed the anniversary movies, I'd say that adding drama to them wasn't the best idea. The Reviewverse was always so cartoony and zany that attempts at pulling off pathos just resulted in tonal whiplash. (Like trying to do the Chick/Todd/Lupa thing as a romance played straight? What for?) Also, um... not everyone in the cast was really up to the task of pulling off dramatic moments.

For me, the anniversary movies should have gone in one of the following ways:

  • Let them remain mostly comedies. Maybe take Brad or someone to punch up the script and remove the scenes and sections that are too long.
  • If you want to go with drama, make an original story, without any connection to Reviewverse. Give more prominent roles to the better actors among the producers, cameos to the others.

This year, we're apparently getting a murder mystery. We'll see how that turns out.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:00:27 AM by Motyka5

Just a person. He/him.
thatindiantroper Since: Feb, 2015
#12156: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:04:30 AM

“To be fair, Doug felt a lot closer than rather distant tv producers or older shows.“

That was the major selling point of the internet entertainer. Someone who was closer to the audience than even the most fan friendly mainstream entertainer. Über relatatable as it were. They were supposed to be real people who understood what movies/games/ whatever was reaaallly about man, not stuffed suits calculating each move, treating people like crap for their own profit and ego. Heck it’s been theorised that more than their actual content this para-social camaraderie was what they were really selling.

And maybe there was a point when that was true but eventually their ambitions outstripped their capabilities and ...well here we are.

For a similar situation see Cracked.

thatindiantroper Since: Feb, 2015
#12157: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:05:27 AM

“The Reviewverse was always so cartoony and zany that attempts at pulling off pathos just resulted in tonal whiplash. (Like trying to do the Chick/Todd/Lupa thing as a romance played straight? What for?) Also, um... not everyone in the cast was really up to the task of pulling off dramatic moments.“

Ding ding ding.

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#12158: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:06:20 AM

[up][up]If there are even enough people left to even do the anniversary.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:07:15 AM by Nightwire

Ultimatum Disasturbator from The Wiggle Room (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#12159: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:08:11 AM

the anniversary.will be the critic sitting in a room with birthday balloons and cake and finding no one wants to come

then the violins start playing

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Motyka5 Since: Aug, 2011
#12160: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:09:06 AM

[up][up] Well, apparently the cast has been already determined, so.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:09:19 AM by Motyka5

Just a person. He/him.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12161: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:10:16 AM

[up][up][up][up][up]

That was the major selling point of the internet entertainer. Someone who was closer to the audience than even the most fan friendly mainstream entertainer. Über relatatable as it were. They were supposed to be real people who understood what movies/games/ whatever was reaaallly about man, not stuffed suits calculating each move, treating people like crap for their own profit and ego. Heck it’s been theorised that more than their actual content this para-social camaraderie was what they were really selling.

The problem with that was that after ten years, a lot of us came to the realization that maybe reviewing movies and such is done by professionals for a reason. That maybe the "average" reviewer doesn't actually know what the fuck they are talking about and are just pulling things out of their ass. It was like the American Idol of reviewers.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:11:05 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#12162: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:11:21 AM

I feel like Cracked is better at it, but mostly cause of it's ability to get new writers work. It's bosses are the ones who are distant and the actual writers are apparently easier to talk to.

[up]See I didn't feel that way. Still don't. Just felt like a lot of people plucked out and inspired by Doug overtook him in critique and laughs. Like Lindsey Ellis.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:13:26 AM by Wildcard

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12163: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:13:25 AM

[up] Oh I could go on and on about the problems with Cracked...

Anyway, I think what I mentioned [up][up] here is actually a manifestation of the growing strain of anti-intellectualism in the world. The kind that convinces parents that blog reading means they know more about autism than doctors.

Disgusted, but not surprised
SpookyMask Since: Jan, 2011
#12164: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:14:59 AM

I do think in general crowning moments pages should probably be get rid of. I mean, if work is too popular, then those pages include literally everything that is somewhat awesome/funny instead of just the awesomest/funniest moments.

Anyhoo, I wonder if I've been overly defensive about creators on Internet as well. I mean, I still don't think it is possible to watch works only by "good" people(and not just because people have different ethics, opinions and subjective experiences. More you learn about people, more you are likely to learn you disagree with them fundamentally somehow) and that is why I've always felt its unreasonable to get angry at creator when your idolized image of them breaks. But on otherhand, audience can enable creator's bad behavior for too long time, so that is probably the more awful option?... Yeah, I'm conflicted about that

Rotide She-Who-Hunts-Unseen (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
She-Who-Hunts-Unseen
#12165: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:15:00 AM

That fits with a lot of Lindsay Ellis's comments about the Walkers and Michaud- a general trend of anti-intellectualism in their videos and in their attitudes towards film-making and such.

"TV Tropes looks like if Tumblr got a little crazy at a party last night and brought someone home"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12166: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:15:55 AM

I mean, doesn't Lindsay Ellis actually have an education in film-making?

edited 6th Apr '18 6:16:09 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Ultimatum Disasturbator from The Wiggle Room (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#12167: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:18:28 AM

Yep,she went to film school

Related tweet

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#12168: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:19:13 AM

I don't know M84, I feel like a lot of it wasn't anti-intellectualism, or at least didn't start out that way. Just that you wanted to hear jokes about an old movie and heard it from someone who would make a similar joke as your friends, (similar to appeal as something like MSTK 3). There is a lot of overlap even today for Lindsey Ellis, Sf Debris and Nostalgia Critic for example. It just got to the point where you saw he wasn't evolving and wasn't what we wanted him to become.

He is a lot like how Kevin Smith never became a huge genre filmmaker, Doug seemed to lose that comedic voice he had when he was doing Ask That Guy, Bum Reviews, and a million other skits on top of the Nostalgia Critic and never became a great comedian.I mean do you feel like you'll see him randomly release "Holiday Clusterfuck" or any other funny music video this year? Part of that might be age, and part of it might just be feeling like an average job to him now.

edited 6th Apr '18 6:22:10 AM by Wildcard

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12169: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:21:42 AM

[up][up] Yeah, wasn't one of the things she complained about in the Google Doc precisely that they didn't bother to take her advice or let her handle the filming of TBF even though she was the most qualified person to do it?

Disgusted, but not surprised
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#12170: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:22:38 AM

They didn't take Holly's advice either. Despite her stage training.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12171: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:23:40 AM

So they pretty much dismissed both of the people who actually knew a thing or two about this stuff. Both of whom happened to be women. Okay, maybe that's unrelated and just a coincidence, but still.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Rotide She-Who-Hunts-Unseen (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
She-Who-Hunts-Unseen
#12172: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:24:48 AM

There was an incident involving craft services Lindsay mentioned, where when she pointed out something was wrong, Doug ignored her- but then when Noah Antwilier backed her up on it, he caved almost immediately. Not sure if that's his reaction to being "ganged up on" or a sexism thing, but either way it's really suspicious.

"TV Tropes looks like if Tumblr got a little crazy at a party last night and brought someone home"
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#12173: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:26:18 AM

If it was happening in a corporate setting — a woman offers advice and is ignored by her boss who immediately takes the advice only after a male colleague backs her up — I'd definitely think it's a case of sexism.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Motyka5 Since: Aug, 2011
#12174: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:28:15 AM

...Man, am I the only one here who's perfectly fine with Doug's work and still finds him funny and talented? (I'm talking about his work here, not business/filmmaking practices.)

Just a person. He/him.
SpookyMask Since: Jan, 2011
#12175: Apr 6th 2018 at 6:29:30 AM

Eh, wouldn't be surprised really. Doug doesn't seem very introspective or self aware, so assuming he hasn't grown up much from old times when he got idea of having Nostalgia Chick to do girly nostalgia stuff... Yep tongue

edited 6th Apr '18 6:30:21 AM by SpookyMask


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