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Aku no Hana (may contain manga spoilers under tags)

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Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#1: Apr 6th 2013 at 11:12:48 AM

Okay, I'd advise people to keep manga spoilers under cuts, but other than that, feel free to discuss.

My first impression of the show was rather mixed, yeah, I can see the complaints, but OTOH the more naturalistic uncanny-valley ish rotoscoping actually works surprisingly well for the kind of story it is. (and the backgrounds of the kind of small-town wasteland are great)

Still, this series obviously isn't for everyone. (although I'd actually take issue with the people describing the series as "angsty").

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Ruthek from Someplace Rainy Since: Dec, 2009
#2: Apr 6th 2013 at 11:30:52 AM

I wouldn't mind the rotoscoping so much if it was actually executed competently.

Anywho, I plan on sticking with the show for at least a couple episodes, if only for Bile Fascination purposes. I think this is a story that is meant more to be experienced than enjoyed.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#3: Apr 6th 2013 at 12:47:11 PM

[up] Definitely.

I wonder how long they're going to take it? There's a pretty obvious place to end it on if you're doing an adaptation (and arguably another one before that) but given the pacing of the first episode I have no idea if they'll reach it.

EDIT: I'm also fairly certain some things (like the disappearing/faceless crowds at times) are deliberate stylistic choice rather than bad rotoscoping. (also, one thing you notice is how much people *move* that isn't usual animated)

edited 6th Apr '13 12:48:13 PM by Arilou

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#4: Apr 6th 2013 at 12:56:55 PM

Mawaru Penguindrum did faceless crowds better. Paranoia Agent did realistic character designs better. RDG is doing beautiful scenery better. School Days did poisonous, manipulative relationships better. Another did slow-paced and creepy buildup better. This list could go on for much longer.

Zecxs' art director must have found some very special mushrooms to share with everyone early in the development cycle.

edited 6th Apr '13 12:57:22 PM by Savoie

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#5: Apr 6th 2013 at 12:57:36 PM

[up] Uh, no, Paranoia Agent did not do realistic character designs since well... Their character designs are anything but realistic.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#6: Apr 6th 2013 at 12:59:51 PM

Did you watch Paranoia Agent, or does your definition of realistic not go beyond rotoscoping and ink suit actors?

edited 6th Apr '13 1:00:29 PM by Savoie

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#7: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:03:41 PM

[up] I did watch Paranoia Agent. The style isn't realistic in the least, or at least, no more than say Witch Hunter Robin. Even something like Monster is more realistic in style. (disregarding obviously grotesque characters like the Baby)

It's not a bad style, I rather like it, but it's obviously not meant to be realistic. (rather going for a kind of psychedelic vibe)

edited 6th Apr '13 1:04:01 PM by Arilou

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
Ruthek from Someplace Rainy Since: Dec, 2009
#8: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:05:54 PM

I suppose it depends on your definition of realistic. I would say on average that Satoshi Kon's character designs are farther on the realism scale than most anime, but they do have a tendency to be highly exaggerated, especially when trying to be ugly.

Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#9: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:06:07 PM

If the art style cares enough to actually make Japanese people look Japanese, it's realistic. Monster is on the extreme (and awesome) end of that spectrum.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#10: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:11:22 PM

[up][up] Oh, he's definitely so. (although I don't think Paranoia Agent is anywhere near his most realistic stuff)

But anime is a highly stylized artform, and in most cases it's not trying to be realistic in the slightest. (there are a few, very few exceptions that are consistently so, and some that are so to some extent)

I'd say a basic requirement for a "realistic" artstyle is getting the proportions right: Most anime and a lot of other types of drawn art exaggerates proportions in various ways. (legs too long, eyes too large, sometimes mouths too wide (Kon tends to do that with "ugly" characters in particular))

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
probablyinsane Since: Oct, 2011 Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
#11: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:14:55 PM

Have to agree about the characters looking like Japanese.

Plants are aliens, and fungi are nanomachines.
Ruthek from Someplace Rainy Since: Dec, 2009
#12: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:16:28 PM

[up][up][up]Using that as a standard, then I would say that the character designs of Aku no Hana are incredibly realistic. They're still stylized because of the rotoscoping, but as far as facial features and proportions go... /shrugs. I don't think it could be more realistic unless it was actual live-action.

probablyinsane Since: Oct, 2011 Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
#13: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:19:13 PM

The director did say that he preferred live-action.

http://ternalnodorei.tumblr.com/post/47253390024/at-first-nagahama-the-director-refused-the

>> - At first Nagahama (the director) refused the offer to direct the adaptation, because he thought that simply turning this manga into a pretty, clean-looking anime would be pointless. He says that he believes that when the mangaka draws this story he’s seeing something “else” which he expresses as a manga. So there would be no point in simply presenting it in animated form, at that rate you might as well just read the manga and be done with it.

- He thought if it was to be adapted at all, it should be done as a live drama.

Plants are aliens, and fungi are nanomachines.
Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#14: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:25:45 PM

[up][up] I never claimed they weren't realistic, only that they're terrible and ill-conceived.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#15: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:31:38 PM

They're still stylized because of the rotoscoping, but as far as facial features and proportions go...

I think the thing I noticed the most (and where you can really see the difference between real human movement and animated movement) is the small stuff. Even when still humans usually aren't still, there's breathing, shifting position, etc. That doesen't happen in animated material unless it's deliberate.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
AnotherDuck No, the other one. from Stockholm Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Mu
No, the other one.
#16: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:42:46 PM

I didn't really mind the animation, but so far it feels more Slice of Life than, say, Honey and Clover, which I gave up because nothing had made me attached to the characters even a few episodes in. The characters do feel a lot more real than in basically any other anime, though.

Check out my fanfiction!
Ruthek from Someplace Rainy Since: Dec, 2009
#17: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:52:30 PM

[up][up][up]I was responding to your claim that Paranoia Agent had better realistic character designs. Whether they are attractive or not is a different argument. I would agree that Aku no Hana's designs are really ugly, but I haven't decided whether or not it was a bad choice yet.

[up][up]Yeah, I definitely noticed that, especially when the kids were walking. They had that sort-of bobbing gait that people actually have when walking.

Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#18: Apr 6th 2013 at 1:58:32 PM

I think that we've seen enough to understand that Aku No Potato was a bad stylistic choice, unless the end goal was "I don't want people to watch my show or spend any of their money on it."

Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#19: Apr 6th 2013 at 2:28:16 PM

From my point of view, the series is supposed to be unsettling and weird. It succeeded too much and went into actively offputting, at least for me.

Savoie Since: Mar, 2010
#20: Apr 6th 2013 at 2:37:46 PM

It was unsettling enough in the original form.

Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#21: Apr 6th 2013 at 5:19:33 PM

I didn't really mind the animation, but so far it feels more Slice of Life than, say, Honey And Clover, which I gave up because nothing had made me attached to the characters even a few episodes in. The characters do feel a lot more real than in basically any other anime, though.

I wouldn't call it Slice of Life, really, there's just too much... Well, plot. For that. (although it's rather character focused, it's still building towards something in a way SOL shows usually don't). I doubt the rest of the series is going to be quite as sedate as the first ep.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
AnotherDuck No, the other one. from Stockholm Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Mu
No, the other one.
#22: Apr 7th 2013 at 7:09:23 AM

Well, that plot certainly didn't start in the first episode. I take it it picks up?

By the way, I just liked the line, "If the thighs aren't at least a little thick, they're not really thighs." There's so much Truth in that.

Check out my fanfiction!
Arilou Taller than Zim from Quasispace Since: Jan, 2001
Taller than Zim
#23: Apr 7th 2013 at 9:27:53 AM

[up] Kind of. The initial plot should start pretty much immediately, but that one in turn kinda segues into the rest of it.

"No, the Singularity will not happen. Computation is hard." -Happy Ent
kyun Since: Dec, 2010
#24: Apr 8th 2013 at 10:12:24 AM

-sees the first episode-

.....

.....

.....

dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#25: Apr 8th 2013 at 4:48:26 PM

Aku no Potato, that is what I am calling the animation.

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.

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