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(NOTE: Keep it civil, try not to get into any Flame Bait-y territory.)

One thing I've noticed is that for all how the page for They Might Be Giants claims them to be the unofficial official band of this wiki, there's relatively few people on this site who seem to ever reference them.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Oct 13th 2024 at 12:59:03 PM

GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13501: Dec 3rd 2022 at 10:35:17 AM

I've read Permanent Red Link Club and noticed that I Am Not Making This Up used to be on 2,500 pages at its peak. Sounds terrifying years ago... Nowadays, while that's still a lot, it would likely be less noticeable. Probably wouldn't feel like a catchphrase.

I'm pretty sure Fast Eddie actually used an automated tool to remove all of the wicks at once to save people the time of going through them all manually (and I think it just left blank spaces where the wicks used to be, sort of like what text with the disabled strikethrough markup looks like nowadays in articles that didn't have it removed, but with the text not being in the source code either). I think that tool still exists, but since the current admins take a hands-off approach (unlike Eddie), I don't think it's been used since the Eddie days.

But yeah, the fact that 2,500 wouldn't be considered as intimidating these days (since Hair Decorations and Nice Hat had so many more than that that bulletins were posted asking for help with dewicking them, and both jobs succeeded, more so with the latter since TRS is more active than the old appearance trope thread) means the admin-only automated dewicker probably wouldn't be whipped out these days even if that were possible, so I'm guessing it was more intimidating earlier in the site's life.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 12:40:15 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13502: Dec 3rd 2022 at 10:46:37 AM

It wouldn't be that helpful anyway. I'm wary of people using scripts and the like to help them dewick stuff faster, as sometimes time and human observation is needed to know if a wick can be moved or not. A tool like this would technically get the job done, but at the cost of a much bigger mess that still needs to be clean, especially since we rarely have big jobs that requires cutting every example indiscriminately.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 3rd 2022 at 1:46:51 PM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
themayorofsimpleton Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him from the Island of Koridai (Captain) Relationship Status: I won't say I'm in love
Short-Term Projects Herald | he/him
#13503: Dec 3rd 2022 at 10:59:44 AM

[up] I agree. I remember the Reality Ensues nightmare where people just moved wicks to Surprisingly Realistic Outcome without checking to see if they were used right — this led to another TRS eventually.

Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13504: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:17:00 AM

I'm pretty sure this tool is just for cuts and not renames, such as with I Am Not Making This Up being PRLC'd. The main issue with using automated wick removal for cuts is that it may result in the text that's left having odd grammar or syntax if the wick appeared mid-sentence.

For example, compare "Alice and Bob assure everyone that they're not lying in Episode 2" with "Alice and Bob assure everyone that they're in Episode 2". I suppose this hypothetical example isn't grammatically incorrect, but it completely changes the meaning from the characters saying they're being honest to saying they're Breaking the Fourth Wall even though the fourth wall wasn't actually broken.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 1:19:57 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13505: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:19:39 AM

I mean, again in that one the "trope" was being cut wholesale. But even in modern trope cuts we have things to move to other pages and stuff, which a tool like that wouldn't account for. I wasn't talking about renames at all personally since those definitely require patience and reading.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13506: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:22:09 AM

I never said otherwise, and if I came across as saying I supported reviving usage of the automated dewicker, I wasn't. I was just discussing what happened when it was used on I Am Not Making This Up, since that's something that actually happened and not a hypothetical scenario involving if it were used for a future TRS job.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 1:22:42 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13507: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:27:49 AM

Yeah, I got that part. I just wanted to make it clear that both of us were referring to trope cuts and not renames, because modern trope cuts couldn't use that tool even if we wanted to use that tool — it's simply too sloppy and lacks the ability to tell if a wick can be salvaged (which is also why I think wick cleaning scripts aren't useful either).

Tools like that seem to only have been useful back when, when there were tropes like that that lacked any merit and had so little purpose that cutting them wholesale was considered fine even if they left messes behind.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the "Retromancer"
#13508: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:29:09 AM

As someone who knows scripting, you really have to watch them at all times. You think you've got it, but somewhere on 165th page someone uses curly brackets with space, script dismiss it and does all further loops with 1 instruction offset.

Meaning I wouldn't trust these unless I know for sure all text look the same or until 2.0.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13509: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:32:11 AM

[up][up]OK, I think we're on the same page now. I got kind of mixed up because themayorofsimpleton brought up what happened with Reality Ensues/Surprisingly Realistic Outcome after your post, so I had a brain fart regarding what type of dewicking was being referred to.

I'm kind of tired right now, so that's probably why the brain fart happened combined with why I'm rambling.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 1:33:57 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13510: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:44:18 AM

It's cool lol I'm tired too

I honestly can't think of any major modern dewicking projects that required getting rid of every example like in that case. Any dewicking projects that do fully eradicate a trope are typically for not thriving ones... I feel like we just reached the point where every bigger trope we talk about is, in some shape or form, tropeworthy or at the very least similar enough to other tropes to move examples into those other tropes.

Which... it's probably for the best because people can't accuse the TRS of being cut-happy anymore when we actually go out of our way to find solid concepts in the rubble.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:45:19 PM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the "Retromancer"
#13511: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:50:38 AM

I think we barely cut things nowdays, always something else fits or "but inbounds".

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
(she/her)
#13512: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:55:34 AM

I learned (or remembered—not sure) that there was a tentative idea to have certain editors to have a "curator" status back in 2010 (thread)

Edited by MacronNotes on Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:55:45 PM

Macron's notes
Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the "Retromancer"
#13513: Dec 3rd 2022 at 11:57:24 AM

We have self-proclaimed curators that only ever edit one genre.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13514: Dec 3rd 2022 at 12:09:20 PM

[up][up][up][up]The funny thing is that I Am Not Making This Up kind of wasn't completely cut despite how it was dewicked, since "Not Making This Up" Disclaimer was taken to TLP (or YKTTW as it was known at the time) because in-universe examples were determined to be worth keeping. Though I don't know whether that was started from scratch or if someone had some examples archived; I joined before I Am Not Making This Up was cut, but I didn't follow any parts of the site other than the wiki at the time.

[up][up]I noticed there's a curator badge (like the mod, herald, and 5P badges, but with a C on it, and I think it's orange). It must have come from that.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:12:15 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13515: Dec 3rd 2022 at 12:12:29 PM

I consider disambigs and retools/renames "cuts", fwiw. I don't care if the page still exists in some form or not if the actual trope is gone.

So yes, we've been cutting a lot of tropes lately but we've been doing a much less destructive job of it.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 3rd 2022 at 3:12:58 PM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#13516: Dec 3rd 2022 at 12:13:37 PM

I dug through the vestiges of the badge shop mods have access to and found the curator badge: https://static.tvtropes.org/swag/c_badge.png

The default text is "A badge like this is for the medium hearted."

I feel like I've seen people actually have it under their avatars, but I don't remember who.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:14:34 PM

I got a rock for Halloween.
MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
(she/her)
#13517: Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:24:55 PM

I think I have seen at least one person with the badge.


When I saw the Sense-Impaired Monster on the home page I knew Cardboard Bot drew it. Always nice to see troper made art on the wiki.

Macron's notes
Demetrios Lucky Seven from Des Plaines, Illinois (unfortunately) Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
CompletelyNormalGuy Am I a weirdo? from a place where folks put cream cheese on hot dogs (Oldest One in the Book)
Am I a weirdo?
#13519: Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:28:02 PM

We used to have a wikibot that helped with dewicking projects back in the day. I don't believe it was official, but it was tolerated by the staff for a time. It was eventually banned though. I believe there was a glitch of some sort and it ended up making just as much of a mess as it was supposed to clean up.

Bigotry will NEVER be welcome on TV Tropes.
MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
(she/her)
#13520: Dec 3rd 2022 at 2:30:38 PM

I remember that too. FELH 2 was the user behind the bot believe. They used it for things like namespace cleaning.

Macron's notes
techno156 from Lost in the wrong part of the internet (Private) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#13521: Dec 4th 2022 at 7:46:57 AM

Keep forgetting that TV Tropes doesn't have keyboard shortcuts, and end up trying to submit forum replies with CTRL-Enter, like I might on a lot of the other social media sites.

Luckily it doesn't do anything, rather than do something unexpected, but it also seems like it would be something that the site would benefit from having. Admittedly, not very useful for the wiki part of the site.

Edited by techno156 on Dec 5th 2022 at 2:48:10 AM

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13522: Dec 4th 2022 at 11:06:19 AM

Right, there are a lot of little forum-side QOL improvements that could be made, but most of them would either be useless on a wiki (which is the point of this website), or would actively harm people's attempts to do wiki work (the proposed block/ignore function). That's probably why the only real forum posting change that was pushed out recently is the ability to upload images through the forums, which is useful mostly for Image Pickin'.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 4th 2022 at 2:06:47 PM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#13523: Dec 4th 2022 at 1:19:53 PM

[up] Or they wouldn't do either of those things but Eddie vetoed them in the beforetimes and we're too scared to disagree.

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
Amonimus the "Retromancer" from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#13525: Dec 4th 2022 at 1:52:22 PM

[up][up] Well, that's mostly for the quote stuff... which I agree is a major mis-step. But other things, like using posting shortcuts and the like, doesn't actually benefit wiki discussions at all.

I just feel like sometimes people forget that these forums are a small subsection of the wider wiki and aren't designed to function like other forums on other websites, because on those websites, the chat feature is the entire point whereas people can go years as an editor and never stumble upon the forums. And sometimes people who mostly or exclusively go on the forums tend to have tunnel vision about these things.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 4th 2022 at 4:54:08 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall

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