Where's the "Faunus and Dogs are forbidden here" sign when you need it?
It seems that of the four kingdoms: Atlas don't think it's discriminating, Vale's relatively nice, and the Vacuo doesn't allow for descrimination in the desert. Which leaves Mistral...
edited 1st Jun '17 6:01:50 PM by WillDeRegio
There is so much wrong with your post I want to vomit, the writing especially.
Yes, Ozpin might be based off Dumbledore, but he is a deconstruction of that character. It isn't a late 2000's anime either, it is early 2010s. And it stopped being Western school based in Volume 4, pretty much.
How was Weiss's storyline a foregone conclusion? And what black sun comedy writing? Some of their interactions were kinda sweet, while others showed that Blake is still recovering from her relationship with Adam.
edited 2nd Jun '17 5:55:30 AM by Vampireandthen
Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
Could you chill out with that kind of talk? People are entitled to their opinions. You don't have to agree with them, but telling people "you're so wrong it makes me physically ill" is not conducive to a productive conversation.
As far as whether RWBY is more "anime" or more "western", it feels like an arbitrary distinction to me, honestly. Both categories are so broad that you can find examples of basically any trope you like in either. RWBY clearly has influences from both camps, trying to decisively declare it mostly one or the other seems kinda pointless.
Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.As an anime fan, I fully recognize that anime can and has covered basically everything in existence and try to pin it down solely to art styles or tropes does not work (although some tropes are far more common in eastern works than western works due to ideological differences and cultural influences and vice versa). To me, when it comes down to it, whether or not I say something's anime-esque depends on what it feels like to me. RWBY, to me, does not feel like an anime. If I was in the mode to watch some random anime, I would not consider watching RWBY because it doesn't scratch that itch. I'd consider Teen Titans, Avatar: The Last Airbender, or Code Lyoko but not RWBY.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!@Jovian: I think Vampireandthen was referring to the fact that the way Unknowing types is very difficult to understand properly. While he is correct about Unknowing's typing style, I do agree that his comment was a bit far.
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Agreed. I mean, the weird thing is though RWBY's listed in the anime section of a lot of other sites, but none of those are.
edited 2nd Jun '17 10:04:18 AM by BlackSunNocturne
"There is so much wrong with your post I want to vomit, the writing especially"
Yeah,.....I dont care really.
" Ozpin might be based off Dumbledore"
Never said he was based on him, I said he was "the dumbledore", the head master with a strange and mysterious past nobody else know, he is one, so is Ozpin and depend on how you see it other authority figures like Rose Quarz from SU can count too, also the fact is not a school setting series anymore means little: it WAS for three volumes after all.
"How was Weiss's storyline a foregone conclusion?"
because is father was abusive and controlling which mean the narrative have two choices: ether make him change(or kill him) or having Weiss run away....which eventually it happen, it play exactly like one would expect it.
"And what black sun comedy writing? "
Well....is just too damn cringe worthy, between Sun lack of tack and Blake slapping him to almost everything it wasnt really funny, specially when Sun interrupt Blake reunion with is father and them she slap him twice without letting him explain is action.
And there is the issue of whatever sun does can be consider harassment or not, which it was a flame bait topic for a while.
When I said anime here I refer to works that used animed tropes, not all work have it but so many that it can be consider a typical reference.
Blake slapping Sun wasn't supposed to be funny. Okay? It may have been a bit cringe worthy here and there, but the second time Sun gets slapped was never supposed to be funny.
And I am not being metaphorical. I literally mean that trying to read your comments makes me ill. I get headaches trying to understand what you're saying sometimes.
Okay, I see you're point about Weiss. Don't complain about it, though, geez mate. It doesn't matter if a story has a foregone conclusion, it matters how it plays out.
Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.The easiest way to fit in Faunus discrimination and make it clear it's a normal part of the world is to show it periodically as background events.
Now that we don't have shadow people, the background characters can be used to add flavour to the scenery. If we see background shots every so often of bullying behaviour, humans picking on faunus, or refusing to serve them, or calling names as they pass them in the street, or just ignoring them as if they don't exist — and everyone else just carries on with their day like it didn't even happen — we have evidence of the discrimination occurring without the structuring of the plot or even dialogue of the main characters being affected.
In fact, having the protagonists focussing on their problems and solving the plot while that's going on in the background would help bed in the idea that it's a normal event — good people, who normally do care about the discrimination but who just happen to be too busy today with 'very important' stuff to intervene or even notice it's happening, helps create an atmosphere where even the best people might struggle to understand that perhaps they have more lingering prejudices than they may think... and perhaps, somewhere down the road, Blake can turn this into an aesop for the audience, the Remnant equivalent of 'the only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing' speech. Here she can point out that her friends do care, but not in the same way the faunus have to care, or need humans to care — good humans care about faunus rights when they have the luxury to do so, and that needs to change; it helps make the point she made to Ozpin when he pulled her aside for a chat (when he mentioned that humans have improved, but she shot back that they haven't improved enough).
Here's an example of a possible background event off the top of my head:
Let's take a scenario similar to the Volume 2 investigation plot the girls came up with in their room (the one Sun and Neptune were spying on outside the window). Let's say that happened outside, in town somewhere. Blake and Sun head off quickly in the planning process to start the trip to the White Fang meeting. This gets the faunus protagonists out of the way before the background event kicks off. Now the rest of the kids are deciding what they're doing, complete with the pairing joke of Weiss wanting to team up with Neptune.
In the background, a little faunus girl wanders into frame, she's sobbing, clearly lost, looking for her mother. People keep walking on by as if they haven't noticed her, some people even walk around her without slowing down. Perhaps the odd human child around the same age as her notices and tug at their own mothers; the mothers look, grab their child's hand and firmly walk them out of the area.
Meanwhile, a little human boy of around the same age is trying to balance on a curb, or the edge of a statue's plinth, or street bench, falls off and hurts himself. Several people in the street come over to see if the little boy is hurt or needs any help, but it turns out his parent/guardian is close by and quickly attends, so people go about their business, satisfied the little boy is fine.
Cue last sight of the sobbing little faunus girl, still all alone as she wanders out of the camera view, not once having been approached or helped.
And the protagonist finish their Very Important Plot Planning and exit the scene.... not once ever having noticed what was going on in the background. They're not bad people, and they're investigating A World Endangering Evil Scheme.... but they've also been raised in this world, and sometimes good people prioritise in a way that lets discrimination continue because they're good people, but they aren't faunus, so they might care about faunus discrimination but they don't live it — as a result, they care when they have time to care.
edited 2nd Jun '17 1:07:31 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.To be fair, if that happened, I'd probably be pissed at Blake since the stuff RWBY is focusing on usually relates to saving loads of lives and/or it's time sensitive. Given the two options, I'd be highly concerned if they didn't prioritize saving the lives of loads of people.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!I'm deliberately choosing an example that doesn't demonise the protagonists and creates the question of 'yeah, but they don't have time to care' — because that's one of the worst things about discrimination in the real world, too.
Fighting for people's rights is a luxury for many people. That's how it's approached. It starts with the people who have to fight for their own rights, it begins to expand when people who have the luxury to get involved do so. It takes time for it to become a way of life for everyone, whether or not they're likely to be personally affected.... and even then, not everyone will ever get on board.
I'm not looking for something that demonises the protagonists. I'm looking for something that screams pathos. This is the way the world is. It shouldn't be. But it is. And even the people who care just don't have the time to care every single moment it occurs.
Perhaps it's my age then. Dumbledore's too recent for me. Yes, I've read the Harry Potter books, so I know all about Dumbledore. No, I don't think Rowling was particularly inspired, especially since the books were a modern version of a similar concept I was reading as a child. So, I wouldn't view Ozpin as a 'Dumbledore' figure because Dumbledore himself is X iteration of Y concept.
Not that I think Ozpin has much in common with Dumbledore beyond the superficial, but that's a different subject.
edited 2nd Jun '17 1:39:15 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading."Blake slapping Sun wasn't supposed to be funny. Okay? It may have been a bit cringe worthy here and there, but the second time Sun gets slapped was never supposed to be funny. "
it was supposed to be funny: Sun does something awkward or inappropriate, blake get annoyed and she slap him for is trouble, is very notable when Blake father is involved since Sun is a moment killer.
"I get headaches trying to understand what you're saying sometimes."
And Im being literal here, I dont care about that, specially considering the confrontational tone you use about it.
"It doesn't matter if a story has a foregone conclusion, it matters how it plays out."
but it play EXACTLY as it everyone expect them to happen: she try to act nice, he act like a dick to her, she get fed up, she escape....that it, is very by-the-book and very cliche, like other tropers said before: with RWBY what you see is exactly what you get.
"Not that I think Ozpin has much in common with Dumbledore beyond the superficial, but that's a different subject."
what I said is that it fit the typical tropes: a benevolent headmaster with a mysterious past that nobody really know about it, combine with a grey morality to contrast the usually white one of the protagonist and the darkest one of the villain, I used harry potter because its what many people picture when they think on fantasy school setting.
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"![]()
Though HP isn't super original or anything, it was super popular, so I wouldn't have much trouble believing it is a large influence on more recent works like RWBY. It can popularize the character types it it uses for a short time, even if it didn't do anything original that would continue to have an impact.
x3 I don't understand your point. While racism sucks, saving lives is unarguably more important than making sure a select group of people live more comfortably (although, in RWBY's case, they're also doing that by killing Grimm). Even if they did have the time to do something about it, what could they do about? They're no in positions of authority or fame right now and while they could walk up to a guy being racist and say "Hey, stop being racist," that wouldn't really accomplish anything.
Don't get me wrong, I fully agree that the racism should have been a background detail that we continually saw crop up but I don't agree in the slightest about Blake complaining about Team RWBY not doing anything about it when they lack both the time and the ability.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!Well, considering that the White Fang plot is going to be stepping up in Mistral, and that Mistral also apparently used to be big on slavery, it's probably the best place to have incidental microaggressions like that crop up.
Deep seated racism in the United States still heavily correlates to areas that had the highest concentration of slaves, for example.
Well, I explicitly talked about examples where Blake was removed from the scene. The Blake reference I made was to an overall story development, the paths characters take over time. It was not related to examples I was using to illustrate what I meant when I talked about the sort of scenes that could be 'background events' that don't impact on what the characters are doing in the foreground. That was two different things.
I also explicitly used a lost little girl as example (complete with the background event showing the difference between humans intervening for a little boy who didn't need intervention but continuing to ignore the little faunus girl who clearly does need help). This is partly because it's a scene that can happen without impacting on the foreground plot and because it's not just an example about making someone 'live more comfortably'. it's generally accepted in society that a young child separated from their parents or guardians and wandering alone is potentially in a lot of danger, which is why we periodically get news stories about how people walk by young, distressed, abandoned looking children without helping them, and how that's a huge scandal — with the 'tragic explanation' that's tacked on as being that years of media frenzy about male paedophiles has left men - and even many women - feeling like they cannot approach a lost, distressed child to help and protect them until their parents or guardians are found for fear of being accused of paedophilia or kidnapping.
This then creates debate in society as people respond to news stories with variations ranging from 'how could anyone let that child be alone and in danger!' and 'I'd stop and help no matter what people think of me!' to 'that's exactly why I turn a blind eye and walk on by no matter what may happen to that distressed child'.
And this is why I used the specific foreground plot example for the main characters that I did — precisely because fandom response would be similar. Some fans might criticise the main characters for not intervening (you know, heroes have to be heroes), and other fans would react exactly how you've reacted here - well, they've got too much on their plate right now to help that little girl, so they're off the hook. Meanwhile, yet other fans could come back with 'yeah, but it doesn't take much time to find an authority figure, to palm the little girl off onto, then they could go back to the plot'... it doesn't automatically demonise the main characters (because they are on the plot-clock) while leaving open the observation that, at the time of the very specific example I used, the kids knew barely anything and certainly did not know how time-sensitive their investigation was going to be and therefore easily could have made time, if they wanted to, to help a distressed little girl find a policeman without it changing when the train attack was going to happen — especially since any delay in the kids finding the train would have delayed the attack from going off early, anyway. But perhaps they did see, but decide their mission was Too Important to intervene and help the girl. And, perhaps, Blake's presence might have changed everyone's priorities and decisions, which is why I had her removed from the scene in the first place.
And so on and so forth.... the discussion can continue for as little or long as the fandom wants. My point is that the fandom can reach whatever conclusions they want about the protagonists' lack of intervention in the background event, the background event itself will still show faunus racism in the form of the little boy being helped and the little girl being left to fend for herself.
Meanwhile, while people debate the pros and cons for adults.... very few people are willing to fight society's perceptions by helping the distressed, lost children. Society's conventions and norms mean that people are willing to turn a blind eye to suffering just in case intervening reflects poorly on them.
People walking by the distressed child to protect themselves happens in town centres every day and is therefore very easy to slot into the background of any scenes when the main characters are wandering through town or busy public areas. What the main characters are doing in the foreground could be anything. The point is that some suffering gets normalised enough by society that people are willing to ignore it happening right in front of them because it reflects badly on them to intervene - and, even worse, sometimes people are so absorbed in their own business that they don't even notice people in distress around them because it's become so normal to see stress of that kind.... there's plenty of examples of news reports showing that people can walk right by homeless people without even having spotted they're there - even when they're not particularly busy or distracted at the time. And so on.
That scene where she slapped him just before Ilia was revealed was not a funny scene nor was it supposed to be. There was nothing joke-worthy about Blake's frustration and aggression in that scene, and there was nothing joke-worthy about Sun's shock or frustration in response to the slap.
That scene had a very different mood to the joke-slap scenes we've seen. It was darker, like the physical violence we saw in Weiss's storyline.
And what I am saying is that two different characters can fit the same trope without being similar to each other beyond the most superficial comparison. I can easily trope Ozpin and Dumbledore under some of the same tropes and still argue that they're not good examples of two characters that are very similar to each other once you've moved beyond superficial similarities.
edited 3rd Jun '17 2:38:39 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.In brighter news: The RWBY Volume 4 Blu-ray/DVD combo pack is now available for purchase
...if anyone was curious.

Animals is offensive to everyone though...
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