It's a concept problem that is so ingrained into storytelling that the vast majority of storytellers themselves grow up on stories using this 'tried and true' method of storytelling. My point is that most storytellers don't even think about it to start the process of thinking along the kind of lines that lead to the realisation there are unfortunate implications.
It's uncommon - still - for storytellers to consciously think about this and even rarer for storytellers to address it in their works. Unfortunately, and this is why I used Joss Whedon as an example, it's poorly handled when it is addressed.
The RWBY creators are an example of a systemic problem. All of the stalking tools they used in RWBY (and they've used several) are examples of a much wider, and long-term, issue. They are examples of the systemic problem that storytellers - which include the RWBY creators - themselves grow up with and therefore view as a 'norm'.
Even so, I'm not going to go so far as to say it should never be used in storytelling, and I'm not going to go so far as to say it should never be used in storytelling between friends, because Tropes Are Not Bad. I think it's often used as a cop-out - easy writing, if you like - but I believe that because it's so ubiquitous, and deconstructing the unfortunate implications is very new compared to the history of storytelling, it's not going to tell us if a storyteller is a good or bad storyteller.
It's like looking at whether or not a mediaeval person is a good or bad person solely by looking at how they treat left-handedness. If it's an indoctrinated way of looking at things that doesn't even occur to most people to question, the issue isn't with the individual. It's with the system. If you want to find out whether an individual is good or bad (or a good or bad storyteller), you're going to have to look at specific things, not systemic ones - because that's a different problem.
Well, as I've said before. I've been stalked in real life a couple of times. One downright awful experience note and a second occasion when I was stalked by the police in a situation a little bit reminiscent of the Sun/Blake situation in Volume 4 note .
On the subject of the rarity factor of good reasons in real life, that first stalking experience with the nutjob did lead to one. My male friends set up an agreement with me. For a while, they escorted me too and from my home. Then we went through a transition period - they 'stalked' me (ie, they followed at a distance) so I looked like I was travelling alone, but there was a friend nearby should the nutjob appear. I didn't always know when a friend was following me because it depended on our schedules, but it only happened within the pre-arranged period. Once we were confident that the issue was permanently resolved, there was no more need for the tactic, so we stopped it.
My first year in university was a pretty surreal experience. The second one was a doozy, too (remind me to tell you sometime about the riot that occurred in my house).
Because she's failing to learn the point that the academies were trying to teach the kids by forcing them into teams: work together, never work alone. Strength in numbers, not in being alone. A problem shared is a problem halved, and all that jazz. That's a lesson that fits in perfectly with Sun's 'do everything with your friends' mentality, but which is currently very much at odds with Blake's personality.
Now, as to whether or not the point is handled well...
I separate out whether or not 'stalking as a plot device' is good or bad and whether or not 'stalking as a plot device was handled well within Story X' The first is a systemic problem within storytelling, which I've mentioned before, and which RWBY should not be singled out for (one example among many, but that's a specific kind of discussion). The second is where we discuss whether or not RWBY has handled the subject well or badly (and this one is something I have never discussed on this particular forum).
The other issue is whether or not the point about team-work has been rammed home. It's a constant in the storyline. It's always there. It's embedded in the entire way the story is unfolding, how the protagonists work, how the villains work. It's one of the biggest points about the entire show, and bleeds into everything, but it's not always spoken about.
As an aside, on the subject of the show's use of stalking-based storylines, RWBY has had several. (Edited for typo because apparently I can't tell the difference between Ruby and RWBY.)
- Old man uses technology to spy on school girl's activities, even her extra-curricular ones. (Ozpin spying on Ruby). This one has been played for mystery and drama.
- Yang's method of getting alone time with Blake to discuss Blake's obsession (hover in the shadows, manipulate Blake's Faunus instincts to into getting her out of a crowded, lighted area into a quiet, dark area, physically drag her out of the place to a location of her own choosing, and then have the discussion). This one was played for comedy to set up a drama scene.
- Penny stalked Team RWBY at times. That's played for comedy and plot convenience.
- Qrow stalked Team RWBY. Played for drama.
- Sun stalked Blake. Played for comedy and drama.
- Implied with Mercury and Emerald when they're first introduced to the show. Played for comedy.
Out of all of the scenarios, I personally think the Qrow scene has been the better handled one in terms of how it was set up and how the consequences were handled. The Ozpin one has been set-up fine, it's just that there's been no acknowledgement of just how creepy his activities are. Unfortunate implications all over the place with that one. The Yang one could be quite a character exploration in observing just how much talent for manipulating people Yang actually has (which is fascinating given her parentage) but a potential minefield in terms of unfortunate implications, given that her target is an abuse victim. Better written than the Sun/Blake one (seriously, why bother with the cloaked figure when the opening credits reveals Sun is travelling with Blake? My problems go from there), but still with a host of unfortunate implications.
I've seen people explore unfortunate implications with Penny's behaviour but I'm not so inclined to go there because the scenes were too light-hearted and more about being a plot device than having any dramatic significance to them. In that, her scenes differ from all of the others because all of the others are linked to serious, dramatic storytelling issues.
I'm expecting more uses of stalking and spying in this show. None of the uses are unusual or even rare for storytelling, and are therefore very ubiquitous. It's another example of how this show uses cliches in the storytelling, and how the creators actually handle them is a bit of a mixed bag.
edited 27th Feb '17 2:12:38 PM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Yeah. The biggest issue with the whole Blake/Sun stalking thing is that it's treated as neither are in the right.... But apparently most people feel that Sun is the only one in the wrong when Blake's also being hilariously negligent. Not even a "Hey there's a psychotic terrorist who threatened to kill everyone I love. And he's not bluffing -motions to Yang- so... Yeah, I'm gonna cut and run to keep you all safe. Bye bye". Personally, I find her not telling her team about the situation with Adam worse than Sun's stalking of Blake. Because while Sun's being a concerned friend inserting himself into her problems, Blake potentially let her problems into her friend's lives without them knowing.
edited 27th Feb '17 11:45:11 AM by BlackSunNocturne
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I do think both characters are in the wrong. I don't think the storyline has necessarily concluded yet on that point (I hope it hasn't, as I feel it shouldn't have).
And, no, that wasn't a typo. It did indeed occur inside my house.
Hazel has back story with silver-eyed warriors, as implied in the very first episode covering Salem and her gang. My guess is that Ozpin's comment is linked to that given that at least two members of Team STRQ are linked to Ozpin's secret conspiracy (Raven and Qrow). Summer's fate is almost certainly going to be linked to both Ozpin and Hazel. That'll be what Ozpin's reference is to, I think.
edited 27th Feb '17 11:59:08 AM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.It effectively goes both ways. While Blake can choose to run away from everyone else and that's her choice, she also can't force them to stop caring about her and forget about her nor can she just remove her problems from everyone else by leaving and expecting them all to follow her.
Sun is portrayed as in the right because his point is apparantly one Blake never considered. She just figured she'd leave and everyone would be happy without her and things would continue as they were just without her, not knowing the emotional damage she caused Yang by running out on her or that just because she left didn't mean everyone else would stick together by default and circumstances forced Weiss and Ruby away from her too.
You can blame that one on Adam, when she fight it said "im not running" and Adam said "you will" and....well, that is exactly what she did, he pretty muck kick around her devolpment back into square one by validating her biggest fear: she IS guilty, her friend SUFFER for her and only running can work that, Sun just point out that Yang didnt lose her arm for Blake, she lose her arm because her on decision to engage Adam just as it was Sun decision to engage chameleon girl and be hurt for it.
In sort, Blake have to learn she is not draging her on team into her issue but they are coming on their on because they are their friend, now the show route to get into that point is...questionable, a lot but that is what Sun said.
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"Incoming Youtube bomb
- When did this song play in Volume 4?
- The Bumblebee is real.
- The hero appears.
- This song f'cking rules.
- When did this play?
First played during the finale credits, second played during Qrow VS Tyrian, third was what Weiss "sang" at that party thing.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!We talked about how it could be taken either way, what with the next verse talking about Yang's encounter with Adam. The lyrics are vague and work either way and Jeff Williams knows it.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!I think the reason Nucklevee was able to rampage for so long was less about either the head of Haven or Salem and more because of Mistral's rather toxic culture (based on the Wo R) where the elite in the cities look down on the village peasants and the village peasants hate the elite in the cities and nobody wants anything to do with each other as a result. The villages would rather risk Grimm attacks than deal with Mistral proper (the blacksmith says as much in Vol 4 1) so they won't ask for huntsmen and the city folk aren't going to go out of their way to help them, so nothing was done.
There doesn't have to be some deep reason it was able to last for as long as it does. Most settlements in this world fall to Grimm, usually not even lasting more than a year.
And as they get older and stronger, they grow more cautious. Salem, or Lionheart, or whoever doesn't have to do anything to keep this one alive and there's nothing saying they particularly cared.
It wasn't the blacksmith, it was the mayor(?) and he didn't say anything about hating Mistral, he just said they prefer their own way of life. For whatever reason, there are still a lot of people who'd rather take their chances than live in any of the Kingdoms.
edited 28th Feb '17 12:45:00 PM by LSBK

Think is, what Sun said is that other are also going to take decision for Blake like Yang did TWICE(one when she tackle her to rest and the other when she face adam) and whatever happen to them IS THEIR fault and consequence, not Blake.
Because a element people miss here is that she have a issue of always blaming herself(not doubt that part was feel by Adam years before) as she told Sun when she wake up, he resot to tell her that it was his fault for that because HE follow Blake and chameleon girl.
Clear now? good, now with Hazel...yeah, I dont think is much of "just a Salem guy" but it seen he know before that, maybe a deflector?
"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"