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God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#45026: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:47:25 PM

I agree with this thing I heard: Having Oscar as just this stinger right at the end woulda been cool.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#45027: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:51:03 PM

[up]god no, that would be raven dream levels of bad, Im thanks they didnt that

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#45028: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:54:55 PM

Dunno, woulda given me some early Marvel stinger vibes if they did that.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45029: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:57:38 PM

IMHO Oscar needed MORE screentime and WB needed less; they simply took on to many plot threads at once, and everything got spread really thin. RNJR had a suitable amount of time but a good chunk of the first half was squandered.

edited 5th Feb '17 1:58:20 PM by CaptainCapsase

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#45030: Feb 5th 2017 at 2:16:05 PM

Oscar needed less screen time because it's obvious he wasn't going to do anything significant this season.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#45031: Feb 5th 2017 at 2:42:05 PM

Yea, Oscar probably has the least relevant screentime as everything revolving around him didn't have anything to do with the plot.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
TPPR10 Craving for fish from up north Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Craving for fish
#45032: Feb 5th 2017 at 2:43:25 PM

[up] What plot? Sorry, had to say it.

edited 5th Feb '17 2:43:35 PM by TPPR10

Only sometimes posts
Karxrida from Eureka, the Forbidden Land Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
#45033: Feb 5th 2017 at 2:52:16 PM

So I just realized that Yang took the same boat that Blake was on and Blake has only been home for a week at most.

What the hell was Blake doing during the Time Skip that made her take so long to get home?

DeanCole Since: Jun, 2015
#45034: Feb 5th 2017 at 2:57:47 PM

Could be a distance issue.The Fanus island is all the way across the map if I recall correctly so it takes longer to get there by boat.Mistral is closer to Vale so it takes less time

edited 5th Feb '17 3:01:26 PM by DeanCole

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45035: Feb 5th 2017 at 3:01:45 PM

I also doubt she decided to go home right away, either.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45036: Feb 5th 2017 at 4:01:36 PM

And apparently we have Salem's henchmen's full names: Arthur Watts, Tyrian Callows, and Hazel Rainart.

BlackSunNocturne Since: Aug, 2013
#45037: Feb 5th 2017 at 4:11:33 PM

[up]Someone already mentioned this. They also asked about any meanings and I found as such:

Aside from the color parts of their names, we have: Arthur, Rainart and Callows

  • Harold is a name with many potential origins, some include: Old English from here "army" and weald "rule", meaning "heroic leader", same as the title herald; the Celtic elements artos "bear" combined with viros "man" or rigos "king", meaning "bear man" or "bear king"; Alternatively it could be related to an obscure Roman family name Artorius. More examples are here.
  • Rainart is German name, meaning "Strong judgment".
  • Callows, specifically "Callow" is an English surname meaning "dweller at a bare hill" or "dweller near a bare hill".

on the last page, shinigamiPeter mentioned this:

On the names discussion- if the theory of (Doctor) Watts being a reference to Doctor Watson is true, then Arthur could come from Arthur Conan Doyle.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#45038: Feb 5th 2017 at 4:42:47 PM

Decided to do what other people do and bullet point as I watch the episode.

     No spoilers 
  • Nice bone-cracking sounds from the Nuckelavee.
  • Like the fact that Jaune's the first person to react to the idea of protecting Qrow. Not Ruby. Jaune.
  • Ren's Semblance works through anything he touches, even stone. Cool. And while people are in motion, too. That's pretty sick.
  • When Qrow grabs Jaune's hand, his eyes have lost nearly all their red so they look almost silver. His eyes looks silver-red at the best of times.
  • Jaune's resolve is fed by the suffering of innocents, it seems!
  • Jaune's sword and shield have a supermode! So does the Nuckelavee!
  • Nora goes for the sacrificial save. Sacrificing... modesty! Anti-upskirt technology is only a Fourth Wall power.
  • And Nora's Semblance is down.
  • And Ren does not like seeing Nora injured.
  • Jaune's supermode is actually effective. In a death-by-a-thousand-cuts sort of way.
  • Ren goes into Unstoppable Rage. So, really doesn't like seeing Nora injured by the beastie that killed his parents. Got it.
  • Ren and Nora have the same coloured Aura. Cute.
  • And we're back underneath the building. Guess everyone's wondering if it's the same building they were under years ago. Just me?
  • Yep, Jaune doing his save the people who can't protect themselves bit again. I think we all know how his Semblance will eventually manifest in an unambiguous way.
  • Nora can benchpress a thousand tonnes and take a direct hit from lightning... but it's her Get a Hold of Yourself, Man! that's really scary.
  • Oh, and confirmation: it is the same building they're under! Guess it's not just me.
  • When Nora's telling people to hold back, you know the shit's hit the fan. Yep, Dad's knife. Fan. Shit. Everywhere.
  • Team RNJR comes up with a plan. Angelic suicide fall... Nora's back to full crazy. Ren pulls the casual walk scene.... yep, it's the vengeance death strike.
  • Uh... Nora, get a room!
  • This time it's Ruby who goes racing to see if Qrow's okay. Nope, he's not dead yet. And his eyes are still that really pale silvery pink shade.
  • Mistral ships. Cavalry arrives late. Love the ships. Mistral looks awesome.
  • Music stops in shock when Ren takes Nora's hand!
  • Haven dorms! Haven's definitely got the rustic look going. I love it.
  • Ruby watching over Qrow is one of the most mature scenes we've ever seen from her. I really like that. I know people think of Yang as the 'team mum' but I think Ruby's going to get the slot.
  • Ruby's been writing letters... nice shout out to her first night at Beacon when she wrote letters to her friends in Signal.
  • In Episode 4, Tai says they haven't heard anything from Ruby. Did Ruby's letter writing create a trail that Salem's gang could follow? Or will her letters arrive home some time in the distant future about a week after the show has ended and everyone's made it back home? Coz that's what post cards do!
  • So... Ruby did tell Yang she was thinking of going to Haven but didn't confirm anything until she was gone leaving only a letter behind?
  • Weiss bribes a pilot to get her out of Atlas. She complained about Sun being a stowaway! Sun would have a field day with this!
  • Zwei holding the fort and keeping Tai going. Zwei rocks.
  • Jaune... yep, they've reached Pyrrha's home and the only thing of her they brought with them is what's on Jaune's weapons and inside Ruby's lungs. Nice to see Dad's knife with them. Feels.
  • Nora cuddles up to Jaune, and Ren's right there. Threesome alert! Seriously, though. Team JNR look emotionally exhausted. It's a great scene.
  • Weiss ends the volume travelling again, but looking much happier than she has for a while.
  • And Sailor Joe gave both Blake and Yang a lift. So... the shopkeeper's hogging all the land jobs and the captain is hogging all the ships. Got it.
  • Given the way they wave Yang off, guess they became friends — that's a story hook for the captain giving Blake some info the next time she's on the ship.
  • Haven Academy's motto is 'be a hero'. Yeah, that's a little different to Ozpin's lesson 'huntsmen protect people'.
  • Oscar still doesn't look certain about all this.
  • And Ilia goes to the Albain brothers to no-one's surprise.
  • Still convinced the intel on the phone is a trap. It doesn't matter whether or not an attack on Haven is due or not, what matters is who the Belladonna family believe are their friends and enemies, and this is designed to set up the Belladonna family trusting Sienna Khan.
  • Emerald's creating illusions of Ruby for Cinder to kill. That's not healthy. At all. Apparently, Salem thinks it's improving Cinder's progress judging by that smile.
  • At least Ruby has the sense to keep certain things out of a letter, but what a way to warn the enemy that Qrow's been talking about something significant.
  • And someone's written BANDITS over the Kuroyuri sign, which Yang has already reached. And she chose Ruby over Raven.
  • Let's see, assuming travel time of 8 hours a day, a leisurely walking pace of 3mph, and a conservative motorcycle speed of 50mph, what would take Ruby's group six months to walk would only take Yang just over 3.5 days to ride, so I don't think there's much problem with Yang getting to the Mistral sign post so fast. If we up her speed to 80mph (which is probably also conservative given that this is Yang we're talking about and there's probably not much by way of speed limits outside the kingdoms), she'd do the same trip in around 2 days. Ignoring pit stops for everyone, of course.
  • Originally I couldn't make up my mind whether the Haven headmaster or the ex-White Fang leader would be the Cowardly Lion. I settled on the ex-White Fang leader, which is why I guessed it might be Ghira. Should have stuck with my first choice.
  • Anyway, called it on the Haven headmaster being the informant; there had to be a mole inside Ozpin's Benevolent Conspiracy, and Haven was the one the villains were pointing the protagonists towards. So, no surprises there. Makes sense for the Cowardly Lion, too. He'll find his courage and help the protagonists eventually.
  • Way to focus on Ozpin's friendship tea set while revealing the betrayal. Looks like Ironwood might be right about Lionheart, but for the wrong reasons.
  • Shade's head will be Dorothy.
  • I knew Qrow wasn't telling Ruby's group everything. He did know about Ozpin's Body Surf, after all. He just needed to wait for the new face to reveal themselves.
  • And I knew that cane had to shrink, given the way it kept appearing and disappearing in Ozpin's scenes. Nice to see it confirmed though.
  • Oscar's now comfortable enough with Ozpin to sass him.
  • Oscar gets a 'holy crap, what do I do with this thing' expression when the cane extends, followed quickly by a 'wait a sec, did this guy just believe me' expression. Yes, Oscar, you are indeed sane, after all. Of course, you are talking to a drunk who's getting over near-death by poisoning, so perhaps the jury's still out.
  • But... my God, I know Ozpin was one of the taller characters in the show, but Oscar looks really small when holding that cane. It's almost as tall as he is. Probably deliberate - Oscar's got to grow into his role.
  • Closing music is called "Armed and Ready" and is clearly Yang's song about coming back fighting fit. We'll see. I'm still not convinced she's shaken off the PTSD.
  • Names!
    • Arthur Watts: origin isn't completely certain, it's either celtic (a legacy title sort of meaning 'bear king' or a Latin name meaning 'noble/courageous'. I'm going with the creators think of the Latin meaning to create counterpoint to Leo Lionheart being the Cowardly Lion.
    • Tyrian Callows: A callow is a wetland area, it's also an inexperienced or immature person. If Tyrian is inexperienced, that means Ruby's dealt with the two least experienced members of Salem's team (Cinder and Tyrian).
    • Hazel Rainart: Rainart is a German name meaning 'strong judgement'. It's also slang for a laid back, caring and helpful person.
    • Oscar Pine: Well, Oscar has "Oz Pin" right there in his name. Plus, Pine gives him the obligatory green theme. But the tree is also considered a very powerful tree in lots of symbolism around the world, including Asian countries (given that Oscar was living on Anima).

Edited to add: And that'll be the last time I do it this way given how many bullet points I came up with.

edited 5th Feb '17 4:58:19 PM by Wyldchyld

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
BlackSunNocturne Since: Aug, 2013
#45039: Feb 5th 2017 at 4:49:24 PM

[up]

It's also slang for a laid back, caring and helpful person.
... That combined with Hazel's actions give me a VERY strong Anti-Villain vibe from him. I get the feeling there's something as to why he's working with Salem, and that he's probably the most likely for a Heel–Face Turn from his (arguably little) characterization seen thus far.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#45040: Feb 5th 2017 at 4:49:56 PM

[up] Yeah, I had the same thought.

On the other hand, he could turn out to be the most dangerous villain of all the subordinates.

He's definitely one of the 'could go either way' candidates.

edited 5th Feb '17 4:50:45 PM by Wyldchyld

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45041: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:06:34 PM

Wyld: Really at this point all of the villains are kind of up in the air as for where they'll end up landing on the scale from Anti-Villain to Complete Monster, up to and including Salem herself*. RWBY really isn't a very forthcoming series when it comes to the villains (among other things); it was 4 seasons in before we learned what the villains are after, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's another 4 before we finally learn the why of team evil.

* I was taken by surprised by her demeanor; less Evil Overlord, more "strict teacher lady."

edited 5th Feb '17 5:08:37 PM by CaptainCapsase

BlackSunNocturne Since: Aug, 2013
#45042: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:10:02 PM

[up]Or, you know. Salem read the Evil Overlord List and actually followed it's guidelines and recommendations? [lol]

edited 5th Feb '17 5:10:37 PM by BlackSunNocturne

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45043: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:11:27 PM

[up] Well yeah, but it's a pleasant surprise for a villain that looks so Obviously Evil to be relatively Affably Evil.

edited 5th Feb '17 5:16:50 PM by CaptainCapsase

BlackSunNocturne Since: Aug, 2013
#45044: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:16:24 PM

Yeah. I mean, I've always enjoyed those. Like, Asmodeus in Pathfinder is my favorite of the Evil gods because, despite being a Big Red Devil, is pretty Affably Evil and is even willing to work with the good guys if it furthers his own ends.

edited 5th Feb '17 5:16:48 PM by BlackSunNocturne

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45045: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:16:43 PM

No finale yet.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45046: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:17:00 PM

[up][up] As for the rest of Salem's gang, we know pretty much nothing about Hazel and Watts, and there's always the off chance Tyrian turns out to have been driven to Ax-Crazy madness by learning Things Man Was Not Meant to Know or something and was relatively benign before then. Meanwhile Cinder may turn out to be gender flipped Zuko in the same way Jaune is basically faux French Sokka.

edited 5th Feb '17 5:18:47 PM by CaptainCapsase

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45047: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:33:04 PM

Oh, yeah, I'm actually glad that this didn't end because of silver eyes or Jaune's Semblance. Teamwork is best work, at least in a situation like this.

Watts isn't the headmaster at Haven, but I still wouldn't be surprised if he was a professor of sorts somewhere. Maybe not at any of the four main academies, though.

Prime_of_Perfection Where force fails, cunning prevails Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Where force fails, cunning prevails
#45048: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:44:43 PM

Real quick, with serial work, you shouldn't divided the acts into entire seasons alone. Think of it like a story arc. It's a part of the bigger puzzle, but it has to stand on its own narrative wise.

Also, volume 3 as Act 3 doesn't work as well since it's not the ending. If anything, it's either them reaching the first act break that finally transitions into the second act or the midpoint. I can't say for sure because I can't see their full puzzle, but I can talk about each volume as story arcs in and of themselves. Within their own structure, RWBY consistently has good ideas that are either poorly built up to or paid off on.

Anyway, Nucks and Qrow right now is the hardest balance. I'm right now wondering if a way to blend with Tyrian with it exists. Or, well, I know there is a way, just thinking how best to avoid resolving too much. I do like the idea of colliding elements going on and I admitted favor Combat Breakdown as a trope for defeating stuff I treat as a juggernaut. That and alternate objectives, like we can't fight to our fullest right now, we need to escape. Or them unable to defeat him the first time and Rin uses shielding long enough to hide them when it becomes clear can't win or something.

I'm still freethinking above, so I'm certain issues in some of that, but still.

I said earlier that Oscar fine with just the stinger and I stand by that. Less is more. In that one scene they convey pretty much everything they did throughout the season. Plus it creates a far bigger "Oh shit!" moment and greater interest in Oscar, his situation, and so on. I feel surprise works better there with the audience, especially if you actually show Ozpin dying in volume 3.

As a protagonist, Oscar sucks. As someone introduced in The Stinger who we know is connected to Oz, but based on how he's acting, shows individuality and own personality, he's a fascinating supporting character. It's often helpful for a character to be cast in the right role for the right impact.

edited 5th Feb '17 5:50:33 PM by Prime_of_Perfection

Improving as an author, one video at a time.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45049: Feb 5th 2017 at 5:58:27 PM

[up] The way in which the story is structured does, I think come with some advantages; I do like how after four volumes we're still left with the sense that we're only seeing a very small piece of a very large and well thought out picture; the structure is very good at drip feeding hints as to what that big picture looks like without giving it away, in a manner that almost reminds me of the Kudzu Plot found in Dark Souls and Bloodborne. The execution of course is where it tends to be lacking.

edited 5th Feb '17 5:58:56 PM by CaptainCapsase

Prime_of_Perfection Where force fails, cunning prevails Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Where force fails, cunning prevails
#45050: Feb 5th 2017 at 7:18:47 PM

I'm not against that factor, as best seen in some of my suggestions of cutting screentime from the villains this season to make more a mysterious force when they're not interacting with the protagonists. It's just that it's easy to gain that exact same benefit while having a consistent, well structured season.

To note, what I believe you're referencing at the heart of this is gothic story structure. It's more the type of genre in that factor.

edited 5th Feb '17 7:26:19 PM by Prime_of_Perfection

Improving as an author, one video at a time.

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