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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45001: Feb 5th 2017 at 10:58:13 AM

By the way, it's not like I'm against the idea of meeting Raven providing Yang with a bit of a moral challenge (provided it's done well...). I just doubt they're going to do that now when the entire point of this is getting the gang back together without them even knowing it's happening.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:01:06 AM by LSBK

shinigamiPeter Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#45002: Feb 5th 2017 at 10:59:45 AM

On the names discussion- if the theory of (Doctor) Watts being a reference to Doctor Watson is true, then Arthur could come from Arthur Conan Doyle.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45003: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:00:11 AM

[up][up] The fact that they put a Yang focused song in the ending credits suggests to me that Yang will get a lot of focus in the next volume to make up for her being Out of Focus in this one, and the elephant in the room when it comes to Yang is the dangling plot thread about Raven that pretty much has to move forwards if Yang gets significant focus. Assuming she is in fact headed towards Mistral, I think it's very likely the plot will end up sending her and perhaps some of the others off to search for Raven.

@Yakuza: Another reason for my reading into the lyrics like this is that it doesn't seem right for Yang to have gotten past everything just like that and go completely back to normal; my intuition would be that she's burying her issues with anger and a thirst for vengeance, which is very much in character for her.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:02:59 AM by CaptainCapsase

powerpuffbats The crabby fussbudget Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The crabby fussbudget
#45004: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:02:27 AM

Or Raven will come to Mistral.

AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45005: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:04:26 AM

Anyway, I have mixed feelings on the finale as a whole.

The ending voice over narration felt out of place to me. The battle with Nuckelavee was good for what it was, but it was hindered by the fact that I didn't think it was the kind of situation that should take up an entire episode, but, being the finale, would seem weird if it didn't take up the entire episode, so it was bit unsatisfying because of that.

Also, for a second there I thought Yang somehow managed to get to Menagerie in a ridiculous amount of time.

[up]I'm betting on it.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:06:12 AM by LSBK

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#45006: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:05:10 AM

She's not "burying" anything though, and it's more than likely she's not going to deal with anything you're talking about until she actually meets Adam again. But for now, she wants to be there for her sister who's out there fighting and support her. Saying "oh she's going down a dark path" when nothing actually points to that is ridiculous.

On another note, Ren has spoken twice as much in this volume than literally every previous volume combined. That's pretty baller.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45007: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:08:52 AM

[up] I don't think she's necessarily going down a dark path, but she has been set up to be tempted at some point in the future, and if Yang does get a lot of focus next volume to make up for the lack of focus in volume 4, that's probably going to happen relatively soon.

@LSBK: Yes, it's very likely that if Yang doesn't go to see Raven of her own accord the plot will end up bringing them together.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:10:09 AM by CaptainCapsase

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45008: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:12:23 AM

Also, confirmation that Ren's Semblance is some kind of total cloaking. I knew that scene couldn't just be symbolic of cutting their emotions off.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45009: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:14:31 AM

[up] Not really confirmation given that we don't actually know how Grimm senses work; deadening emotions may very well have lead to it thinking that Jaune and Qrow just abruptly dropped dead, leading it to focus on the still active sources of fear in its vicinity.

Ren's semblance being invisibility doesn't really explain why he abruptly stopped crying and acts completely nonchalant when it first activated.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:16:47 AM by CaptainCapsase

FergardStratoavis A Fluff Ringer from Bellveins (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: A gay little love melody
A Fluff Ringer
#45010: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:15:15 AM

Now that I think of it...

If it's Prof. Lionheart who's a traitor and apparent Salem's informant, what are the odds of her being in possession of Haven's Relic already?

[up] It looked more like it has just lost sight of them, likely on top of other senses - emotions included - that it could use to track them with.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:16:01 AM by FergardStratoavis

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45011: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:15:48 AM

[up] Pretty high.

[up] Jaune and Qrow vanishing from its emotion-radar may have confused it enough to give it pause though, and without Qrow's agony to draw it towards him, it would probably refocus on the more obvious targets.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:18:29 AM by CaptainCapsase

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45012: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:29:28 AM

That's why I said total cloaking: sight, scents, sounds, and in the case of Grimm, emotions. Or at least, that's how I took it.

And calling Ren "nonchalant" when it first happened doesn't sound right. Focused and calm of mind sounds better. He says he's still afraid.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:31:05 AM by LSBK

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45013: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:31:19 AM

[up] That's certainly possible, though IIRC Ruby's head is following Jaune and Qrow in the scene, implying that she can see him. (let me just go back and check that)

Edit: never-mind, I'm not sure what i was thinking of. But based on how his demeanor abruptly shifted, I'd say his semblance does definitely include suppressing emotions, even if it also does visual and auditory cloaking.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:33:15 AM by CaptainCapsase

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45014: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:34:28 AM

Also, might have something to do with Ren's apparent heighten senses. Unless that's separate from his Semblance and he's just really good at sensing things because of training/just because.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45015: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:35:40 AM

[up] Heightened senses comes with having an awakened aura based on Pyrrha's exposition dump, though Ren is the only person who clearly has super senses, so I suppose he's just honed it far more than the others.

Edit: But on to another topic: Cinder, another example of RT giving us mixed signals about a character.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:38:14 AM by CaptainCapsase

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45016: Feb 5th 2017 at 11:56:31 AM

[up]I'm not so sure, her feelings on those around her aside, I never doubted she wanted revenge against Ruby.

Oh, and seems we've got the real Cowardly Lion now in Professor Leo Lionheart, headmaster of Haven Academy.

edited 5th Feb '17 11:56:49 AM by LSBK

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45017: Feb 5th 2017 at 12:13:43 PM

[up] Depending on whether the nod Jaune being similar to Sokka from Avatar The Last Airbender (and I think Monty actually said outright that he wanted his own Sokka in relation to Jaune) was indicative of the show being a major inspiration on some levels, I wonder if Cinder might end up being something of a Composite Character of Azula and Zuko.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45018: Feb 5th 2017 at 12:20:25 PM

Other miscellaneous thoughts: I'm annoyed they gave the illusion Ruby current Ruby's look when neither Emerald or Cinder have seen her like that; if Cinder really wants to master her new powers then she should stop only using fire.

edited 5th Feb '17 12:20:53 PM by LSBK

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#45019: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:05:01 PM

Anyway, this Volume was ok but pretty disappointing given everything setup n Volume 3. I get wanting to do a breather arc after everything that happened, but it didn't need a whole season to do so. As a result, it really feels like not much has happened this season of much significance.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45020: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:17:58 PM

[up] Nora and particularly Ren were fleshed out a bit; had they set up the Nucklavee earlier and had it stalking our heroes across the continent, I think it would have made a fairly satisfying, if self contained story arc.

Prime_of_Perfection Where force fails, cunning prevails Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Where force fails, cunning prevails
#45021: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:20:44 PM

Just stalking I don't think would be enough. It lacked an Act 2. They should have had confrontations with it beforehand where they couldn't defeat it.

Actually, I'll share some excerpts from this book I have called Act 2 Secrets. No Act 2 is a common problem mentioned and good reading for those interested in learning more.

"The most common Act Two problem is that it doesn’t exist - instead, Act One has been allowed to continue all the way up until Act Three. The writer may *think* there is an Act Two, but really the script is continuing to establish the conflict without ever diving into the conflict."

"Story is conflict, and Act Two is the conflict act. Act Two is the meat of your story! I have a Script Tip that compares that three act structure we’ve been using to create dramatic works for over 2,400 years... to a hamburger. Act One and Act Three are the bun... and Act Two is the *meat*. You don’t want some skinny little meat patty, you want a one third pounder! You want as much meat as you can get, plus some grilled onions and lettuce and a tomato slice and pickles and that secret sauce!"

"But how do you find the point in your story where Act Two begins? Since it's the "conflict act", Act Two begins when the conflict *involves your protagonist*. Not when your protagonist becomes aware of the conflict, or when he's in the same room as the conflict; but when he gets thrust right in the middle of the conflict and can not escape. We aren't in Act Two until either the protagonist has become the main obstacle in the way of the antagonist achieving their goal, or the antagonist becomes the main obstacle in the way of the protagonist achieving his goal."

"Act Two is about the protagonist *struggling* with the conflict. No struggle, no Act Two! Make sure your protagonist becomes the main obstacle to the antagonist achieving their goal (or vice versa) around a quarter of the way into your screenplay. There are times when it may take a little longer - the gauge is how interesting and involving Act One is. If you have an exciting page turner Act One that goes a little long, not a problem! But since Act Two is the conflict act, the excitement act, usually things don’t really get exciting until the protagonist we care about is stuck dealing with the problem."

"Act Two begins when the protagonist is *locked into the conflict* and can not escape. When the story focuses on the protagonist’s struggle with the conflict - *not* when the conflict is introduced."

So yeah, I say RWBY failed at that with the subplot, among other plots.

edited 5th Feb '17 1:33:43 PM by Prime_of_Perfection

Improving as an author, one video at a time.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#45022: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:26:50 PM

This thread contrasts nicely with other places and people I've seen how this volume was a fairly well paced character focus arc. Not that I totally agree with that either, but it's interesting to see the difference. I definitely think that's what they were trying to go for, while still putting in hints of the larger plot and set up for things to come.

But, the execution is the point of contention here.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45023: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:38:20 PM

[up][up] That kind of what I meant by "setting it up earlier"; actually have them stalked by it and have to run away from it when it proves too strong to beat. The big question is where Qrow fits into this; he was clearly poisoned to prevent him from making the Nuckles fight too easy, and his particular bit was more or less essential to the plot.

powerpuffbats The crabby fussbudget Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The crabby fussbudget
#45024: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:41:48 PM

I have a feeling that 3 volumes will be one story arc.

Like, Volumes 1-3 definitely have a feel of being one story. With Volume 1 being "Act 1", Volume 2 being "Act 2", and Volume 3 being "Act 3".

AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#45025: Feb 5th 2017 at 1:43:34 PM

[up] That seems very likely, though considering volume 2 was probably the weakest part of the show, Miles and Kerry really need to work on writing a better second act for their stories.


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