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danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56501: Nov 8th 2018 at 9:50:30 AM

Meh, in the end her decision to side with Cinder stemmed from her belief that Salem was too powerful to oppose and Ozpin and his allies were destined to fail. What would offing Cinder do, other than be a temporary setback for Salem and make her even more determined to chase down the Spring Maiden, aka Raven?

TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#56504: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:01:46 AM

I thought it was pretty funny. It felt a bit like those abridged versions.

danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56505: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:12:20 AM

Funny, but it runs into logistical problems. Now if Raven double-crossing Cinder was an actual possibility, it would be funny through exaggeration. In this case, it's trying to be funny through exaggeration of an event that would never really happen.

TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#56506: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:15:21 AM

...I don't see the problem with that.

Edited by TheLovecraftian on Nov 8th 2018 at 4:16:04 PM

Darthwyn leader of Inherit from The void Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
leader of Inherit
#56507: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:25:36 AM

Like most jokes tend to be subjective the Raven comic falls under that category.

"Shall I use you, or make you mine... I'm not so sure what I'll do." - Dorthy
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56508: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:30:20 AM

I prefer humor that builds off existing characteristics and quirks of a character, or specifically subverts a characteristic. The Raven comic goes a few degrees of removal too far for it to be funny to me.

Edited by danime91 on Nov 8th 2018 at 10:30:41 AM

TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#56509: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:33:50 AM

Fair enough. I was fine with it.

danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56510: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:37:08 AM

Anyone follow Puns of Damage on Youtube? I find it curious that she constantly gets copyright strikes for her Rooster Teeth reactions, like RWBY and Nomad of Nowhere, when other Youtubers seem to be able to post reactions with no problems.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#56511: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:37:51 AM

You Tube is just super inconsistent about things like that.

TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#56512: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:41:31 AM

She's great. One of the few reactors I can still watch without finding them annoying. And yeah, her problem seems to just be youtube bots being inconsistent about flagging.

danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56513: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:48:32 AM

You'd think that Youtube would have a system where copyright owners can add certain trusted Youtubers to a whitelist of sorts so that the system ignores them when searching for copyright violations. Come on, Youtube.

TheLovecraftian Since: Jul, 2017
#56514: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:50:59 AM

Youtube should be doing a lot of things.

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#56515: Nov 8th 2018 at 12:00:25 PM

[up][up] This is a system that puts the burden of proof upon the accused rather than the accuser.

You Tube's a lost cause.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#56516: Nov 8th 2018 at 12:09:39 PM

YouTube doesn't want to get sued, so they err on the side of wealthy IP-holders with high-priced lawyers over their own content producers who are scraping together and living and could never hope to bring them to trial.

They also don't want to pay human employees because that cuts into those ever-important profit margins so they rely exclusively on automated systems that have no comprehension of Fair Use.

The end result: YouTube is governed by screeching Copyright Robot Velociraptors with IP-based vision, lurking in the grass and waiting to spring up and devour any poor unfortunate soul who uses copyrighted material in their video for any reason. And a few who don't and just had the misfortune of wandering too close to one of the raptors and giving theirselves away.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 8th 2018 at 1:10:30 PM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56517: Nov 8th 2018 at 1:30:46 PM

Now I'm imagining some sort of crossover between Terminator and Jurassic Park. Robot raptors would be cool. Ironwood, get on that.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#56518: Nov 8th 2018 at 3:02:18 PM

I actually agree with all of that except Raven being obviously destined to die. Death flags don't always guarantee inevitable character death.

Well, I did say 'usually' rather than 'definitely'. tongue

I just don't think Raven giving up and acquiescing to Yang's request after a "Reason You Suck" Speech really constitutes the character breaking.

I think this is an example of how words can be used in different ways. I don't know about anyone else, but when I talk about Raven 'breaking', I'm talking about her mask — she was exposed as a coward and 'broke into tears'.

I don't see how that scenario could be pulled off without it seeming like a massive ass pull /OOC moment. Not saying this as a knock on the writers but as the situation as a whole to go from a selfish, callous bitch abandoning her own child, leading a crew of bandits and end up willing to kill your own brother among other things so you can save your own hide to actually being a parent to your grown up spawn at age 40 plus.

Well, I didn't say anything about Raven becoming a parent to Yang. I only talked about her learning to put Yang's survival before her own.

Now, let's say the redemptive death happens. A woman dying to save the daughter she never raised doesn't turn her into a parent. She may be Yang's biological mother, but she's never parented her — and, in this scenario, would have died without ever having parented her.

I’m predicting that Raven will probably get a Redemption Equals Death if and when she does die

I vacillate between Redemption Equals Death and Death Equals Redemption purely because it's not unheard of for authors to be trying to write Redemption Equals Death only to end up writing Death Equals Redemption instead.

Honestly we really do need to know what led to Raven deciding that Salem is unstoppable along with what she was like with STRQ.

Yes. Because I think the reason why Salem is regarded as unstoppable by certain characters is because it's connected to why Ozpin has been unable to stop her for thousands of years and why she's even an issue in the first place (I also suspect it's tied in to the state of existence of the Grimm).

Anyone follow Puns of Damage on Youtube? I find it curious that she constantly gets copyright strikes for her Rooster Teeth reactions, like RWBY and Nomad of Nowhere, when other Youtubers seem to be able to post reactions with no problems.

I follow both her and Murder of Birds, note  although I haven't checked out their Episode 1 reactions yet. Murder of Birds has mentioned in the past that his RWBY reactions struggle with copyright strikes, too.

Side note. Where on earth does everyone put the commas when using the 'note' mark-up? Before the tag or after it? The sentence looks awful either way.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Nov 8th 2018 at 11:15:35 AM

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#56519: Nov 8th 2018 at 3:23:51 PM

I wonder if there might be some sort of mutual-existence Yin/Yang thing going on with Oz and Salem. Like, maybe one can never truly die so long as the other persists?

I feel pretty confident that Salem's got some sort of immortality shenanigans going on with her. My money's actually on the same setup as Oz; she can be killed but then just springs back up in a fresh new body. It's my pet theory that she's cultivating Cinder to be her next vessel.

Team STRQ probably fought this war back in their day and may even have successfully slain Salem to absolutely no effect. Prompting Raven to go "F*ck this shit," and ragequit when she realized both the players just reset and start up a new round every time one of them gets ganked.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 8th 2018 at 4:26:06 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
danime91 Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#56520: Nov 8th 2018 at 3:28:45 PM

A Forever War between two beings who bodysurf upon death? Sounds like a recipe for generations-long shenanigans and plans behind the scenes. Wonder if there was more direct and open conflict earlier on.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#56521: Nov 8th 2018 at 4:05:21 PM

[up][up]What I'm wondering is whether the Grimm are linked with her ability to be killed. For instance, in fairy tales there's always that one wicked old queen with perpetual youth and life because she drinks the blood of children or eats children. Now, the Grimm carry her symbol on their bodies (the heads usually), at least a simplified version of her symbol, and we see it when the parasite portals out of Cinder's hand (the more complete version of her symbol is on the bone-white glove Cinder uses).

I'm therefore thinking that perhaps Salem is stealing life from the people the Grimm kill. As a result, those who have come to know too much about Salem believe that Salem cannot be killed until all Grimm are first destroyed — that as long as one Grimm remains active somewhere in the world, she can crawl back from any injury — unlike Ozpin, who has to die and 'resurrect', she simply doesn't die, but simply has to put herself back together again and heal. Worse still, what if killing Grimm is helping Salem? What if the reason they dissolve upon death is because every time one is killed it releases its 'captured' life-energy (souls/Aura) to Salem, thereby allowing her to benefit from the actions of Huntsmen who trying to protect their world?

When confronted with an idea like that, it becomes much easier to see why some characters would give up in despair, declare Salem unbeatable and suggest that Ozpin is leading people to their deaths — as Roman said, most Huntsmen die before their time because of the nature of the job they do. So, if Ozpin 'knows' that the Grimm are effectively giving Salem immortality, that the only way to kill her is first to get rid of all Grimm, but if that the very act of killing individual Grimm makes Salem stronger, then doesn't it seem as though Ozpin is sending people to their deaths for no gain?

Now, the twist to this theory lies with Cinder's tattoo. Just as the tattoo appeared on her back as a sign of the parasite bringing the Fall Maiden's power into her soul/Aura, the Salem symbol on every Grimm is the key. Destroy the symbol — that link between Salem and the Grimm — and Salem can be defeated without having to first defeat all the Grimm on the planet (and the Grimm would then revert back to the original state they had as hinted at by the Tale of Two Brothers — so they'd still be a threat to humanity for generations, but now they're a potentially manageable one without Salem complicating the situation).

How to destroy the link? That mark in the centre of Salem's forehead is a third eye. That's the eye of power that her symbol represents. Destroy that, and the link is broken. Destroy that, and Salem can finally be defeated. That would make the Petra Gigas fight at the beginning of Volume 4 foreshadowing, as that is what the Geist was protecting while in Petra form when Team RNJR fought it. That would also make Leo foreshadowing as well — when Salem threatened Leo through the Seer when she first learned of the Spring Maiden's location, it was Leo's eye she threatened to stab. The eye is clearly very important to Salem conceptually and symbolically. It's also important to Ozpin because, while Salem calls the Branwen twins the Eyes (of Ozpin, a direct reference to the Eyes of Odin, as Odin sacrificed his one eye to obtain great knowledge — in other words, Raven, which is why I keep banging on about wanting to know why Raven seemed to have so much more knowledge of Ozpin and Salem than Qrow, and what finally appeared to make her separate from Ozpin), the Branwen twins do have eyes as their symbols — by using Ozpin's symbol (the cog) as the eyeball and the wing of a bird as the rest of the eye (feathers even forming eyelashes); although which twin is the left eye and which one is the right eye is up for debate, as arguments can be made either way (which again reflects Odin because which eye he sacrificed is never clarified in the stories, the idea that it's his left eye that he sacrifices doesn't have any basis in the original tales).

It's a thought, anyway.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Nov 8th 2018 at 12:20:33 PM

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
gjjones Musician/Composer from South Wales, New York Since: Jul, 2016
Musician/Composer
#56522: Nov 8th 2018 at 5:18:55 PM

I also have a feeling that Raven's life may take a massive turn for the worse (i.e. the Branwen tribe about her being a Dirty Coward who would rather run for her life and telling her something along the lines of "You failed us", Taiyang learning about her whereabouts, etc.), leading to a Misery Builds Character situation. Raven will probably become The Atoner at that point and when she reunites with Yang once again—this time in a somber way—she could undergo a Heel Realization, acknowledge her misdeeds to Yang and ask her for forgiveness, pull a genuine Heel–Face Turn, and ultimately help her, Qrow, Team RWBY and their allies fight against Salem for good.

That's also one of my ideas.

Edited by gjjones on Nov 8th 2018 at 9:08:06 AM

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.
FergardStratoavis A Fluff Ringer from Bellveins (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: A gay little love melody
A Fluff Ringer
#56523: Nov 9th 2018 at 1:25:17 AM

Given that the "tribe" was completely dependent on her and Vernal's ability to survive, that would be poor form on their part.

It's more likely that they simply won't be any wiser and Raven will conveniently forget about them while she tries to protect her own hide.

MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#56524: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:01:05 AM

Taiyang learning about her whereabouts
The last we saw of her, she was flying around Taiyang's house, and he saw her.

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#56525: Nov 9th 2018 at 9:55:39 AM

I just assumed that Taiyang already knew what she was doing and her general whereabouts. Him not contacting her had nothing to do with lack of information.


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