Two ideas:
- Thread needs adding to the directory (regardless of where that thread goes)
- You might want to add a link in Handling Spoilers to this thread.
To pick an example, death tropes are often considered unmarked. However, you can still put a spoiler on the victim. Ending spoilers can sometimes be a spoiler only for one particular ending, in which case some spoilering can help.
I think the sentiment is correct, but that was a bad example.
For instance, I once came across an example where someone thought it was necessary to spoiler the fact that the kids in Battle Royale had to kill each other. You know, the thing that happens right at the start of the book and is the whole premise.
edited 2nd Feb '13 10:32:58 PM by Sessalisk
Caaan anybody find me... Somebody to ♠What about works that have been around forever and adaptation thereof? I'm specifically wondering about spoiler tags on Les Misérables (2012); the book's over 150 years old, and the new film is a very close adaptation (closer, in fact, than the musical that is the direct source material). For instance, nobody in the movie dies in a different way than in the book, and the musical's had a huge Pop-Cultural Osmosis, so are spoilers really called for?
No, 5 hours is not a long time. Sophie's death in Tales of Graces happens in the prologue and is a driving force for many characters. Spoiler tagging it is ridiculous, especially since she comes back.
Also, if the page says unmarked spoilers but is filled with white blocks, then we take them out. An entry must not be completely spoiler-tagged ever, unless it's a very big twist. And well, on a twist trope, you have been warned.
Works over 50 years old are spoilers-off, otherwise we should start spoilering how Achilles died.
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer50 years isn't actually official, since the off-hand 50-year example from Handling Spoilers doesn't match the rules on Spoilers Off. Now, we can talk about making it official, but it currently isn't.
I'm bad, and that's good. I will never be good, and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me.How about we don't compare apples with oranges? The OP says game. Video games are a time consuming medium. A film obviously has different standards. Five minutes into the film are not a spoiler.
edited 3rd Feb '13 12:45:31 AM by lu127
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - FighteerPeople make honest mistakes too. For example, I had someone come by and add spoiler tags to the description of Rainbows End, where it says "Unfortunately, Vaz is the man secretly behind the virus", which does sound like a spoiler if you don't remember that that was revealed to the reader in the middle of the first chapter. When I reminded him via PM, he apologized for the mistake.
As for the hours thing, it might be more sensible to talk about fractions or percentages. I'm not even sure how you'd measure hours for a book, since people have different reading speeds. :)
edited 3rd Feb '13 10:33:21 AM by Xtifr
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.Regarding the Les Misérables (2012) example, the Spoilers Off page says in pertinent part, "Spoiling specific media adaptations is still frowned upon."
edited 3rd Feb '13 11:32:55 AM by Gideoncrawle
Bigotry in the name of inclusion is still bigotry.If a spoiler happened five hours into Portal you'd have already beaten the game twice. Even in a longer game like Batman: Arkham Asylum, five hours would be like halfway through. It's not a trivial amount of time.
And five hours into a JRPG are usually the prologue, while five hours into Skyrim and Oblivion are barely enough to cover two quests.
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - FighteerCan we just say that 5 hours was an estimate, that doesn't work for all media or all games, which was intended to illustrate a point? It can be changed to 5 episodes of a show or 2 hours of a game, but I don't think our current discussion will get us very far. Just use discretion for how dense a work is and where something needs tagging, and if you can reach the point within an amount of time that is short relative to the work length, it shouldn't be tagged.
That was the amazing part. Things just keep going.The spoiler policy makes sense to me as it is (and can I just say I was a little alarmed when I saw this thread, because I thought spoiler tags were going to be taken away?) But just to put my two cents in anyway, giving a specific number of hours/pages/episodes isn't a great idea for the reasons already mentioned- the length of a work varies. First third or even first quarter seems fair.
I've already been trying to break up large blocks of spoiler tags when I encounter them, and to unspoiler the names of tropes on work pages (alphabetical order tends to give them away, anyway.)
Spoiler tags are explicitly allowed on trope names on work pages; it's work names that can't be spoilered.
If alphabetic order becomes a problem, the spoiler policy even suggests moving spoilered tropes to a separate section.
edited 4th Feb '13 5:43:59 PM by Xtifr
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.

Ever seen a page covered in white blocks? Even the trope names? Time to fix the thing!
Common spoiler tag abuse occurs in:
This will (hopefully) be a concentrated effort to eliminate gratuitous spoilers.
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer